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How Romance is vilified nowadays

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by Estro Felino, Sep 11, 2019.

  1. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Some people here defined my obsession with romance mawkish and exaggerated.

    And yet it is because there is, in my humble opinion, a tendency to vilify romance and the spiritual/esthetic aspect of love to prefer to turn love into something mechanical, animalistic.
    Into mere lust.

    As a consequence, people prefer to normalize some things like friendship with benefits or promiscuity.

    This tendency is present in movies, in Hollywood , in theater, in literature...it is something that is light years away from the kind of artistic tendency we used to have 30 years ago
     
    #1 Estro Felino, Sep 11, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019
  2. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    You have a very narrow understand of love. Yes it involves romance, it also involves togetherness, understand, compliance, faith, pleasure, gratitude, pride, awe and yes. it involves lust (despite your mockery of lust... It is not "mere*, it is a powerful aspect of love).

    Love is not just the simplified, over romanticised emotion as depicted in old movies. Todays movies are far more representative of reality by not giving people false impressions and expectations.
     
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  3. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    I think it's our "lust" (i.e. hormones) that attracts us towards certain people, but then hopefully the brain takes over from there. Unfortunately, there are many whereas phase 2 never kicks in.
     
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  4. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Exactly.
     
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  5. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    In fact I selected these pictures to show what romance is. Not only carnal instinct, but a meaning that transcends it, too. Aesthetic pleasure, Beauty is Truth.

    Romance
     
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  6. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    It's not their fault, Estro, they just never have loved for real.
    I'm saddened sometimes, by couple's demonstrations of convenience relationships. So far this year three couples that I know have lost one of their partners, only to discover that absolutely no provision was made in the event of death, and the blood relatives have turned the bereaved partner turned out of home, savings, the lot.
    Convenience love is not love at all, its just what it says in the title, and these folks could never understand ''high as a kite' 'die for love' lovers...... Not until they've kissed it for themselves.
     
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  7. dianaiad

    dianaiad Well-Known Member

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    Yeah?

    So show me a movie (not rated G) that does NOT have the protagonists sexually involved with each other within three seconds of meeting?

    Or for that matter, a "romance novel' that is only a short story if you skip the porn?

    Unless you buy YA novels, and then you only have to skip one scene, but they talk about it all the time.

    Unless you have someone going out to fight dragons in chain mail and faery swords....and even then you get it (or talk about it) if there are two protagonists, of whichever sex.

    REAL LIFE is about more than lust, Christine. Really. It is. Today's movies are about as representative of 'reality' as unicorns.

    The greeks had several different words for 'love,' and they all described different kinds of love....at least six (some say seven) and ONLY ONE OF THEM referred to sexual love, or lust. "eros." Then there is "philia,' or love of a friend...no sex. "Luda," or innocent playfulness...dancing, flirting...again, no actual sex, This would be, I think, where 'romance' comes in, in relationships (and old romance novels). "agape," spiritual love...love of everybody. "Pragma," or the sort of love that has 'stood the test of time.' The kind couples celebrating their 72nd wedding anniversary have. The kind of love that people have when they have made love 'work.' 'pilauta,' basically, self-esteem.

    Please note: of all these forms of love (which most of us can recognize in our lives, I think,) only one involves sweaty bodies and stained sheets.

    And I, for one, am sick and tired of the movies of today focusing only on 'eros' pretty much to the exclusion of all else.

    Unless, of course, the movie is all about FX and blowing things up, and even then one can't get entirely away from it.

    OK., you can all call me a prude now. Not that I AM, entirely, mind you. No fig leafs on statues for me. However, nobody can call today's movies classical....or even decent...art, and since they don't reflect reality, either...

    Scuse me. I'm going to look for a movie where they don't do ANYTHING but blow things up. Or find a Disney princess and sing "I see the light" from Tangled. (that's 'luda,' btw)
     
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  8. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Re read my post, i gave a reasonably comprehensive list of aspects of love, lust was just one of them and that was in direct reply to the OP

    As for the rest of your post, i read it but am ignoring it because of your cherry picking statement
     
  9. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Love is a creative process.
    You need to have high expectations to make it sublime.

    I you vilify it from the start you turn into mechanical squalid pleasure.
     
  10. pcarl

    pcarl Well-Known Member

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    At what moment does the subject of initial admiration of beauty become the selfish desire to take for ones own pleasure?

    Unfortunately some are driven by the desire to experience what is forbidden, and the less forbidden it becomes 'normalized' there remains the desire for what is forbidden, until what end?
     
  11. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    It is linked to the capability of seeing the other's soul.
    When I fall in love with a man, I am attracted to his soul first.
     
  12. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Can you define soul?

    When i fell in love with Paul i was attracted to all of him.
     
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  13. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Soul...personality, chatacter, temper, nature....
     
  14. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Ok,

    Not the religious interpretation of soul but the mental core of the man

    Just wondered.
     
  15. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Soul is a secular concept...otherwise there would be no psychology....since psychī means soul
     
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  16. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    I agree fully, and I've used the words "spiritual connections", based on a long series of "experiences" I had, that even goes beyond love and romance. I'm convinced there's "Something" that's involved, but just don't ask me exactly what that "Something" is.

    Put it this way: it very much restored my religious inclinations, let me tell ya.
     
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  17. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Yet most often used in a religious concept
     
  18. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

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    Here in the U.S., if we can't buy it or sell it, it is of no "real" value to us. And we have spread this kind of blinding ignorance to every corner of the world, since we create and sell most of the world's creative entertainment. I am sorry about that.
     
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  19. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    One thing I'e noticed is that Chinese and Italians
    have very different ideas on this topic!
     
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  20. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    Scrolling up, I did not see who posted this until
    I'd read part of a line, and then I didnt need to look.
     
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