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How Neoliberal Economists have Cost You Money and Wealth

Discussion in 'Political Debates' started by Sunstone, Sep 22, 2019.

  1. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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  2. Nakosis

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    How have the neoliberals economists cost me?

    As I see it, it's my skills, the values I create via my abilities which allow me to ask for proper compensation for my time.


    Self interest does not equal greed. To equate capitalism with greed is a complete misrepresentation of capitalism. Self interest can include cooperation, tending the economic garden as it was put. Greed is detrimental to capitalism.

    One guy who was himself greedy, made a lot of money being greedy is now going to lecture us about being greedy. Ok, if he saw capitalism as a system of greed, that was his mistake.

    The problem of a minimum wage is not it's effect on the economy. The problem is it's effect on the individual. As people rely more and more on the government to take care of them they lose the skill to set there own value. As inflation continues they will be stuck waiting for the government to decide their value for them. The government replaces the cooperation in deciding their worth. What's gained?
     
  3. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    What do you think caused numerous companies to increase their own wages above state and federal limits?
     
  4. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    The desire to keep their employees.
     
  5. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Where would they go?
     
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  6. Nakosis

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    Somewhere willing to pay more. It costs a lot of money for a company to train workers. Cheaper to increase wages to keep the ones you got. A CEO who doesn't understand this will end up regretting it. It is in the company's mutual interests to keep their workers happy.
     
  7. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Hope you enjoy your strawman. :cool:
     
  8. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Where are they going to go if they aren't happy? Another low paying position where they'll be unhappy?
     
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  9. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Nothing but experience. But hey, feel free to take some academic's word on it.
     
  10. Nakosis

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    Probably, since public school don't teach self interest well. It's certainly not in their self interest to. So why would they? Probably because they've been taught to let others look out for them.

    A good employer will look out for the interest of their employees, a bad one won't. Ideally they will keep looking for one who does. Since they don't, bad employers can keep doing what they do.
     
  11. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    They have been doing that long before minimum wage and labor laws.
     
  12. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Those who can, do. Those who can't teach.

    Never did any of that other stuff, so really couldn't offer an opinion one way or the other. Though certainly I'd be more likely to listen to someone who actually launched a rocket than someone who's only taught the physics of rocketry. Otherwise anyone could pickup a book and start launching rockets successfully. Even with all the academic knowledge one still needs experience to be successful. See it all of the time, engineers right out of school thinking they can fix all of the problems. Very little of that academic knowledge is useful. It's good for a foundations to build on, but nothing beets experience.
     
  13. Nakosis

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    And folks have been letting them. :(

    I blame public education. Unfortunately most successful people are left to learn success for their successful parents. I mean what is wrong with a education system that can't teach people to be successful?o_O
     
  14. Phaedrus

    Phaedrus Active Member

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    I am understandably leery of the type of success achieved via the foundation of a monetary system that first requires a particular socio-economic status only reached through a particular capitalistic standard. In other words, you have to be rich and successful in order to be rich and successful, considering the American Dream is nothing more than an unattainable dream for most everyone except the few who get lucky. Statistics, after all, show that most people who work all their lives never rise above their socio-economic status. The capitalist saying work hard and you will become successful is just another lie for the rich to stay rich while the poor remain poor.
     
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  15. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Not always. People did riot against it, unions have formed, but many people take a job or they don't eat or feed their family.
    Probably because "success" is not defined the same to everyone. I'm not a success with capitalism, but for my struggles and having came from nothing and no support I've been pretty successful in getting things and achieving goals. Who's success do we teach?
     
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  16. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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    If you know so much, why are you parroting other people? Do you have any thoughts of your own on this issue?
     
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  17. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    I'm reminded of Louis Pasteur's observation...
    Chance favors the prepared mind.
    IOW, luck plays a role in success, but ability & drive are important factors too.
     
  18. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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    I notice that both here and on other sites, people attacking Hanaeur's position are doing so with insipid, abstract observations -- not with hard facts. Lot's of crap about how this or that is theoretically true -- not much at all that's genuinely factual.

    It's Seattle all over again. The neoliberals saying that raising the minimum wage will throw people out of work, put restaurants out of business. Instead, the facts are unemployment went down and the restaurant business boomed. Theory vs. Facts.
     
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  19. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    With typical neoliberal positions about jobs and wages, you'd think great paying jobs were easy, nice benefits a negotiation away, and getting to choose where you work the norm, and poverty defintely not cyclic in nature. That's about as high up there in the ivory tower as it gets, far removed from people having to work nor where they want but where they can get a job, wages and benefits to they have to accept because someone else will, and great wealth coming to very few through actual hard work alone.
     
  20. Nakosis

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    I think I've expressed quite a few of my own thought, perhaps you haven't noticed.

    OTOH, I see no problem using and repeating good ideas. Kind of silly don't you think to condense my posts to a one liner to criticize.
     
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