How does Jesus free Christians from the Mosaic Law?

[roger1440]

How does Jesus free Christians from the Mosaic Law. The vast majority of Christians are Gentiles. Gentiles were never under the Law. How does Jesus free people from something they were never bound to in the first place?

 

[Glaurung]

Jesus didn't 'free us' from Mosaic law, but rather the early Church ruled that gentiles were not obligated to become Jews in order to become Christians. We still must live moral lives as per Christ's teachings, but things like dietary laws are just not applicable for those of us who were never Jews.

 

[Pegg]

How does Jesus free Christians from the Mosaic Law. The vast majority of Christians are Gentiles. Gentiles were never under the Law. How does Jesus free people from something they were never bound to in the first place?

before Christ arrived, the only way for people of the nations (gentiles) to approach Jehovah God was by becoming a member of the Israelite nation, by submitting to the practices and religious laws as taught by the Levitical priesthood. Besides the nation of Israel, Jehovah God did not view people of nations as his own people. He would only accept Israelites and those who submitted to the law of moses as his worshipers.

After Christ arrived, all mankind were free to approach Jehovah God through Christ. They no longer needed to get circumsized and live according to the law of Moses or become a proselyte of Israel. They could now worship Jehovah, and be accepted by him on the basis of Christs ransom sacrifice.

 

[Desert Snake]

before Christ arrived, the only way for people of the nations (gentiles) to approach Jehovah God was by becoming a member of the Israelite nation, by submitting to the practices and religious laws as taught by the Levitical priesthood. Besides the nation of Israel, Jehovah God did not view people of nations as his own people. He would only accept Israelites and those who submitted to the law of moses as his worshipers.

After Christ arrived, all mankind were free to approach Jehovah God through Christ. They no longer needed to get circumsized and live according to the law of Moses or become a proselyte of Israel. They could now worship Jehovah, and be accepted by him on the basis of Christs ransom sacrifice.

Jesus told people around Him that they didn't even know the Father, much less 'worship' the father, obviously. Jesus also heavily criticized the very priesthood you seem to be elevating to status of what the Xians would be grafted onto. This makes no sense.

 

[wizanda]

Because Paul said he end/fulfilled the law.... Though Yeshua stated the law all stands; so officially they're all breaking the law on purpose.

 

[Pegg]

Jesus told people around Him that they didn't even know the Father, much less 'worship' the father, obviously. Jesus also heavily criticized the very priesthood you seem to be elevating to status of what the Xians would be grafted onto. This makes no sense.

regardless, from the time that the Israelites were freed from Egypt and made into a holy nation, they were Gods chosen people, no one else.
If you wanted to worship Jehovah, you would have to join that nation and submit to the priesthood. That priesthood administered all of the instructions given to Moses on Mount Sinai. There were no other religions who God acknowledged as his own....in all the earth there was only one true religion whom God acknowledged.

It makes perfect sense.

 

[Etritonakin]

That is perhaps the most profoundly misunderstood subject in all of the bible.


In trying to explain every point in detail and in a way which would be received by those of the day (being all things to all people), some points are not apparent by reading only one or a few verses -but that is also due to how God had men write the things of God (line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little, there a little).

Anyway, I found it best to explain it with an analogy.......

Man's laws are (should be) intended to allow everyone to live peacefully and without conflict.

If a man breaks man's laws, that man disturbs peace, creates conflict, is subject to penalty -and is "under" the law.

If a man keeps the laws of man, man is no longer under the law.

The same is true for the laws of God, but the difference is that -as written...

-Romans 8-7Because the carnal mind isenmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God

It is impossible for man to keep the law in spirit -and they even have much difficulty with the letter of the law. Therefore they are "under" the law -and the penalties (the soul that sinneth shall die)

God gave the "Mosaic" law to carnally-minded people (for the most part), knowing that they could not actually keep it very well.
He did so, however, to lay the groundwork for the time when man would be made able to keep the law.

So -the next step was to make man able to keep the law in letter and in spirit and truth.

How was this made possible? By the pouring out of God's spirit. By coupling man's spirit with God's own spirit. (Also very misunderstood, and perhaps even more important -it is NOT a third person, though translations personify it. It is both the mind of God and how God accomplishes things. As defined in the bible, it is a spirit of power, love, and of a sound mind).

When Man's spirit is coupled with God's own holy spirit, man can increasingly have a Godlike mind, Godlike power (over sin and otherwise as God gives various gifts to different people), and Godlike love.


I John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth

Christ did NOT do away with the "Mosaic" law -but did change some judgments under the law which were initially given for a carnal people who were under the law to keep sin literally from Israel -such as penalties for breaking the law (he who is without sin cast the first stone) -which removed sin by literally removing the sinner. Christ also made the law MORE binding in some points (the divorce/adultery issue).

Notice here what Christ says....


Luke 11:42 But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

It was made clear that the spiritual matters are weightier than the physical -but that the law was still in effect -even though appropriate judgments under the law changed. We are to physically keep the letter of the law -but now are also able to keep the spirit of the law -and so we are actually MORE responsible to keep the law.

As for the laws concerning clean and unclean foods, God is moving things back toward the way it was in Eden -where they were vegetarian -if not even Vegan. Only afterward was all animal flesh allowed to be eaten -then only some -and when Christ returns none again -even the animals will not eat each other's flesh. While it is somewhat a matter of conscience what people may eat -as anything not of faith is sin -and though it is not the weightiest matter, a close look at the new testament scriptures on the subject show that all things allowed by God are clean regardless of other factors -not actually all things.

The followers of Christ are still to keep the holy days of God -including the "Jewish" sabbath -but without the physical animal sacrifices -as Christ's sacrifice did what all others could not -which is to take away sin and the death penalty by an innocent dying in our stead -and making it possible for man to keep the law in spirit and truth.

1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us
8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

42And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath

...and the whole earth will soon keep them -so we cannot say that they are for Jews only...


16And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles. 17And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.

Gentiles are not free to break the law -nor are Jews -sin is defined as the transgression of the law -and we are not to sin.

The task which faced the disciples and church of God in the New Testament was to bring those who had the law to understand the spirit -and bring those who were given the spirit who had not the law to an understanding of the law.


What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. 16Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness.

4Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

God is one. We all -Jew and Gentile -are to be one with God. Why would he then give two different laws?

 

[roger1440]

regardless, from the time that the Israelites were freed from Egypt and made into a holy nation, they were Gods chosen people, no one else.
If you wanted to worship Jehovah, you would have to join that nation and submit to the priesthood. That priesthood administered all of the instructions given to Moses on Mount Sinai. There were no other religions who God acknowledged as his own....in all the earth there was only one true religion whom God acknowledged.

It makes perfect sense.

That priesthood is?

 

[roger1440]

regardless, from the time that the Israelites were freed from Egypt and made into a holy nation, they were Gods chosen people, no one else.
If you wanted to worship Jehovah, you would have to join that nation and submit to the priesthood. That priesthood administered all of the instructions given to Moses on Mount Sinai. There were no other religions who God acknowledged as his own....in all the earth there was only one true religion whom God acknowledged.


It makes perfect sense.

There is a priesthood that is older than the Levites, that of Melchizedek. How does he fit within the scheme of things?

 

[Tarheeler]

before Christ arrived, the only way for people of the nations (gentiles) to approach Jehovah God was by becoming a member of the Israelite nation, by submitting to the practices and religious laws as taught by the Levitical priesthood. Besides the nation of Israel, Jehovah God did not view people of nations as his own people. He would only accept Israelites and those who submitted to the law of moses as his worshipers.
...

It's comments like this that make me truly question that Christianity somehow came out of Judaism.

 

[rosends]

before Christ arrived, the only way for people of the nations (gentiles) to approach Jehovah God was by becoming a member of the Israelite nation, by submitting to the practices and religious laws as taught by the Levitical priesthood. Besides the nation of Israel, Jehovah God did not view people of nations as his own people. He would only accept Israelites and those who submitted to the law of moses as his worshipers.

After Christ arrived, all mankind were free to approach Jehovah God through Christ. They no longer needed to get circumsized and live according to the law of Moses or become a proselyte of Israel. They could now worship Jehovah, and be accepted by him on the basis of Christs ransom sacrifice.

Actually, Judaism never taught that. By creating a situation, the Christian writers can then create a solution. But Judaism never demanded that anyone not part of the nation of Israel become part in order to reach God.

 

[Pegg]

That priesthood is?

All anointed christians are the priesthood according to the New Testament.

1Peter 2:9 But you are “a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for special possession, that you should declare abroad the excellencies” of the One who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.

Rev 5:10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God,and they are to rule as kings over the earth.”

 

[Pegg]

There is a priesthood that is older than the Levites, that of Melchizedek. How does he fit within the scheme of things?

He lived almost 500 years before the Mosaic law was given to Moses. It was different back then, people worshiped in many various ways and almost every man was a priest of his household. For example, the culture was that every patriarch had his own idols...even Abrahams own father was an idol worshiper. And we know that Moses father in law was a priest of Midian. The patriarch acted as a mediator for his family and that is why patriarchy was so strongly entrenched...the position of the patriarch was father and priest. But no one really knew how to worship God acceptably, they just did it the way they felt right. When God actually selected a group to be his worshipers, they were given the instructions on how to carry out worship and that came in the form of the mosaic law. So the mosaic law was really the first time that God had directed mankind in how to worship him in an acceptable way.

 

[metis]

After Christ arrived, all mankind were free to approach Jehovah God through Christ. They no longer needed to get circumsized and live according to the law of Moses or become a proselyte of Israel. They could now worship Jehovah, and be accepted by him on the basis of Christs ransom sacrifice.

This was actually being done long before Jesus came onto the scene because there were what were called "God-Fearers" (in English, of course), who believed in our God and worshiped him even though they did not have to observe the entire Law.

 

[metis]

So the mosaic law was really the first time that God had directed mankind in how to worship him in an acceptable way.

If God considers worship to be important, then why would He wait until the time of Moses in order to supposedly give these instructions? Abraham and Noah were considered righteous in their times, so obviously something had to be there before Moshe.

 

[Pegg]

Actually, Judaism never taught that. By creating a situation, the Christian writers can then create a solution. But Judaism never demanded that anyone not part of the nation of Israel become part in order to reach God.

Exodus 12:48 If a foreigner resides with you and he wants to celebrate the Passover to Jehovah, every male of his must be circumcised. Then he may come near to celebrate it, and he will become like a native of the land. But no uncircumcised man may eat of it.+49 One law will apply for the native and for the foreigner who is residing among you.”

Ezekiel 14:7 For if any Israelite or foreign resident living in Israel separates himself from me and is determined to follow his disgusting idols and sets up a stumbling block that causes people to sin and then comes to inquire of my prophet,+ I, Jehovah, I will personally answer him. 8 I will set my face against that man and make him a warning sign and a proverbial saying, and I will cut him off from my people;+ and you will have to know that I am Jehovah.”’

The situation was that a foreigner who wanted join themselves to the nation of Israel they had to submit to the mosiac law in all respects according to Leviticus 24:22 “‘One judicial decision will apply for you, whether a foreign resident or a native,+ because I am Jehovah your God.’”
If they did not, they could not remain in the land. They were to be cut off from the nation.
Adherence to the mosaic law was the only way they could remain in Isreal.

 

[Pegg]

If God considers worship to be important, then why would He wait until the time of Moses in order to supposedly give these instructions? Abraham and Noah were considered righteous in their times, so obviously something had to be there before Moshe.

Can you show us what was there before the mosaic law? At least in the mosaic law we have written evidence. We have a timeline. We have a written law code.
Apart from what is actually written in Genesis about the Noahide laws, what evidence do we have prior to that?

 

[rosends]

Exodus 12:48 If a foreigner resides with you and he wants to celebrate the Passover to Jehovah, every male of his must be circumcised. Then he may come near to celebrate it, and he will become like a native of the land. But no uncircumcised man may eat of it.+49 One law will apply for the native and for the foreigner who is residing among you.”

Ezekiel 14:7 For if any Israelite or foreign resident living in Israel separates himself from me and is determined to follow his disgusting idols and sets up a stumbling block that causes people to sin and then comes to inquire of my prophet,+ I, Jehovah, I will personally answer him. 8 I will set my face against that man and make him a warning sign and a proverbial saying, and I will cut him off from my people;+ and you will have to know that I am Jehovah.”’

The situation was that a foreigner who wanted join themselves to the nation of Israel they had to submit to the mosiac law in all respects according to Leviticus 24:22 “‘One judicial decision will apply for you, whether a foreign resident or a native,+ because I am Jehovah your God.’”
If they did not, they could not remain in the land. They were to be cut off from the nation.
Adherence to the mosaic law was the only way they could remain in Isreal.

First off, you are mistranslating the word "ger." It means "convert." If someone wishes to join, he may do so and be circumcised and then eat of the Passover offering. Someone who is not circumcised may not. Of course, eating of this offering is not something required of non-Jews so to say that they can't do it is not to say that they suffer any disadvantage.

So a foreigner who wanted to be bound to all the laws could convert but someone who did not want to could certainly still access God -- the Noachide laws ensured that generations before. Lev 24:22 talks about applying Mosaic law to a criminal -- there is one law for the person born as a Jew and one who converts. The same rules which bind one bind the other. Nothing to do with non-Jews who are bound by a separate set of laws.

So, again, the gospel accounts create a missed relationship where there is no such construct and then create a "solution" to it. Judaism existed before Jesus' time and we have a code of laws that existed prior to his life which affirms that non-Jews can still connect to the divine. Please do not characterize the Jewish attitude so that it accounts for the gospel's "fix." It wasn't broke.

 

[Pegg]

First off, you are mistranslating the word "ger." It means "convert." If someone wishes to join, he may do so and be circumcised and then eat of the Passover offering. Someone who is not circumcised may not. Of course, eating of this offering is not something required of non-Jews so to say that they can't do it is not to say that they suffer any disadvantage.

thats right, those who did not convert could not participate in the worship of Jehovah. God only recognised those who submitted to his priesthood and he only accepted those who submitted to his priesthood as his worshipers.

So a foreigner who wanted to be bound to all the laws could convert but someone who did not want to could certainly still access God -- the Noachide laws ensured that generations before. Lev 24:22 talks about applying Mosaic law to a criminal -- there is one law for the person born as a Jew and one who converts. The same rules which bind one bind the other. Nothing to do with non-Jews who are bound by a separate set of laws.

I think this is where the jewish teachers have it wrong. The noahide laws were given long before any priesthood was established. So those laws applied to everyone and even Abraham would have come under and submitted to those laws. They applied to all people of the earth beginning with Noah and his 3 sons who are the forefathers of all the tribes of the earth.

But when God introduced the mosaic law, things changed. Now worship was to be carried out through the levitical priesthood.
And when the Israelites went into the promised land, they were told quite clearly to remove all the nations who were dwelling in the land...this was to ensure that only those adhering to the mosaic law could dwell in the land.
Deut 7:1 “When Jehovah your God brings you into the land you are about to enter and take possession of,+ he will also clear away populous nations from before you:+ the Hit′tites, the Gir′ga·****es, the Am′or·ites,+ the Ca′naan·ites, the Per′iz·zites, the Hi′vites, and the Jeb′u·sites,+ seven nations more populous and mightier than you are.+2 Jehovah your God will give them over to you, and you will defeat them.+You should without fail devote them to destruction.+ You must not make any covenant with them nor show them any favor.+3 You must not form any marriage alliances* with them. Do not give your daughters to their sons or take their daughters for your sons.+4 For they will turn your sons away from following me to serve other gods;+ then Jehovah’s anger will blaze against you, and he will swiftly annihilate you.+

So really, if Isreal complied with Gods order, there would not have been any other nation of people dwelling in the lands promised to Abraham. They would have been the private property of the Israelites and no other nations should have been living on their lands. And when you consider this directive, its easy to understand that anyone who was not a natural born Israelite would have needed to convert to the mosaic law if they were to live among the isrealites.

So, again, the gospel accounts create a missed relationship where there is no such construct and then create a "solution" to it. Judaism existed before Jesus' time and we have a code of laws that existed prior to his life which affirms that non-Jews can still connect to the divine. Please do not characterize the Jewish attitude so that it accounts for the gospel's "fix." It wasn't broke.

actually, i would say that judaism wasnt correctly being practiced. If the Jews were actually following the mosaic law in its entirety, there would not have been any non-jews living in the land at all. Only natural born Isrealites and Converts.

 

[rosends]

thats right, those who did not convert could not participate in the worship of Jehovah. God only recognised those who submitted to his priesthood and he only accepted those who submitted to his priesthood as his worshipers.

No, not only is that wrong, but it is also not what I said. You have created another straw man. The Passover sacrifice was one particular expression commanded of the Jewish people. But other people can (in fact, according to Jewish law, MUST) worship God. One does not have to "submit to a priesthood" (which, btw, makes no sense in Judaism...just another invention) to recognize and worship.

I think this is where the jewish teachers have it wrong. The noahide laws were given long before any priesthood was established. So those laws applied to everyone and even Abraham would have come under and submitted to those laws. They applied to all people of the earth beginning with Noah and his 3 sons who are the forefathers of all the tribes of the earth.

But when God introduced the mosaic law, things changed. Now worship was to be carried out through the levitical priesthood.

No, that's where YOU have it wrong. You see, these are concepts from within Judaism. Your understanding, as it is from outside Judaism, is flat out wrong in its characterization of Judaism and Jewish law.

And when the Israelites went into the promised land, they were told quite clearly to remove all the nations who were dwelling in the land...this was to ensure that only those adhering to the mosaic law could dwell in the land.

Um, no. It was to ensure that there was no idolatry. Judaism taught thousands of years ago that Joshua, as he readied to enter the land told the indigenous people that they could leave, fight or make peace and stay as long as they abandoned idolatry. ("Joshua sent three proclamations to Eretz Yisrael before Israel entered the Land: “Whoever wishes to leave, should leave; to make peace, should make peace; to make war, should make war.”) You are making a claim which simply does not represent Jewish thought.

So really, if you take a look at Judaism and what it actually taught, you see that there was no reason for anyone to convert in order to connect with the divine, or live in the land. Claims to the contrary are simply the result of lack of knowledge