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How do you recognize religious propaganda?

The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause

This is the traditional, neutral definition of propaganda, akin to 'persuasive communication'. Most religious communication would meet this criteria.

Most people use propaganda as a negative term these days though, which would make a significant difference.
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
The first problem is to properly define religion. Not all religions worship deities. Buddhism, which is considered a major world religion has no deities, yet it is called a religion. Buddha was a precocious young man who used his mind and self observation to develop a philosophy and techniques, to achieve enlightenment. Therefore, a connection to deities, by itself, is not enough to infer all forms of religious propaganda. There is another kind of religious propaganda that is not as obvious as deities.

The problem is atheism has defined religion in a way that exempts itself. Their standard would not consider Buddhism a religion since this religion lacks deities. The Buddhists are happy to call this a religion and they should know better.

Atheism is the mirror image of Buddhism, in the sense atheism is about humans using the extroversion of science to evolve humanity, while Buddhism is about humans using introspection to evolve humanity. Both are based on humans activity to achieve higher states of knowledge and enlightenment. There are no deities involved, although some will worship those who take their respective techniques to the upper level; Buddha, Einstein, Darwin,etc.

One such non deity example of religious propaganda, that comes to mind, is the idea of utopian Socialism. Socialism has a connection to the teachings of Jesus. But beyond that, If you look at history, socialism does not turn out as well as the utopian fantasy that is always sales pitched. The sales pitch creates a paradise illusion but it never ends that way in reality.

This fantasy propaganda, in the light of hard data that says otherwise, would rank as a type of religious propaganda, since even atheism broadly defines religion as imaginary. Socialism is more in the mold of a religion without deities, where humans get to play God; Stalin and Castro, pillaging the wealth and power of their socialist nation, until they have the control over life and death.

The left wing religious propaganda about Trump being an incarnation of Hitler is a type of reincarnation religious propaganda. This and other types of religious propaganda has turned Trump into a type of fairly tale character, who symbolizes all that is wrong and evil with humans. This is not even rational, which may be another sign of religious propaganda.

The only reason this religious propaganda is being left alone is the Supreme Court once ruled that freedom of the press could not be hindered by litigation, and that public figures had to take even lies and slander with no way to appeal beyond public opinion. The press used to self censor and set limits, so this worked out. However, ever since Trump won, self censor was thrown out, knowing, even religious propaganda; fairy tales, would be protected under the statute. This freedom to speak, lies and religious fantasy propaganda, has misinformed the less than rational, like a sermon from a quick talking evangelist.

This statute may need to change in the near future, so subtle non-deity, religious propaganda, by the press, will be subject to liable and slander suits, unless they make it clear this is unsubstantiated fantasy or opinion. CNN may have to have post a large disclaimer, for 10 seconds, before each show, saying the following is for entertainment purposes only, and should not be taken seriously. This may head off the lawyers since it warns of religious propaganda; fantasy sold as authority.
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
So you think basically all news are propaganda?

Not at all. Only news that fits into what I've already described to be recognizable propaganda.

Are you suggesting that all news is unverifiable?
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
So you think basically all news are propaganda?
Do you think news can't be verified?

Even if I can't, say, visit a war zone on the other side of the planet to look for myself, there's still generally things like corroborating accounts from other reporters and witnesses or physical evidence (e.g. video showing what happened).

This is a far cry from, say, a "prophet" claiming that God has revealed things to him in a vision that nobody else could see.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
The first problem is to properly define religion. Not all religions worship deities. Buddhism, which is considered a major world religion has no deities, yet it is called a religion. Buddha was a precocious young man who used his mind and self observation to develop a philosophy and techniques, to achieve enlightenment. Therefore, a connection to deities, by itself, is not enough to infer all forms of religious propaganda. There is another kind of religious propaganda that is not as obvious as deities.

The problem is atheism has defined religion in a way that exempts itself. Their standard would not consider Buddhism a religion since this religion lacks deities. The Buddhists are happy to call this a religion and they should know better.

Atheism is the mirror image of Buddhism, in the sense atheism is about humans using the extroversion of science to evolve humanity, while Buddhism is about humans using introspection to evolve humanity. Both are based on humans activity to achieve higher states of knowledge and enlightenment. There are no deities involved, although some will worship those who take their respective techniques to the upper level; Buddha, Einstein, Darwin,etc.

One such non deity example of religious propaganda, that comes to mind, is the idea of utopian Socialism. Socialism has a connection to the teachings of Jesus. But beyond that, If you look at history, socialism does not turn out as well as the utopian fantasy that is always sales pitched. The sales pitch creates a paradise illusion but it never ends that way in reality.

This fantasy propaganda, in the light of hard data that says otherwise, would rank as a type of religious propaganda, since even atheism broadly defines religion as imaginary. Socialism is more in the mold of a religion without deities, where humans get to play God; Stalin and Castro, pillaging the wealth and power of their socialist nation, until they have the control over life and death.

The left wing religious propaganda about Trump being an incarnation of Hitler is a type of reincarnation religious propaganda. This and other types of religious propaganda has turned Trump into a type of fairly tale character, who symbolizes all that is wrong and evil with humans. This is not even rational, which may be another sign of religious propaganda.

The only reason this religious propaganda is being left alone is the Supreme Court once ruled that freedom of the press could not be hindered by litigation, and that public figures had to take even lies and slander with no way to appeal beyond public opinion. The press used to self censor and set limits, so this worked out. However, ever since Trump won, self censor was thrown out, knowing, even religious propaganda; fairy tales, would be protected under the statute. This freedom to speak, lies and religious fantasy propaganda, has misinformed the less than rational, like a sermon from a quick talking evangelist.

This statute may need to change in the near future, so subtle non-deity, religious propaganda, by the press, will be subject to liable and slander suits, unless they make it clear this is unsubstantiated fantasy or opinion. CNN may have to have post a large disclaimer, for 10 seconds, before each show, saying the following is for entertainment purposes only, and should not be taken seriously. This may head off the lawyers since it warns of religious propaganda; fantasy sold as authority.
Wow... you just kinda latched onto a whole bunch of bad assumptions and took of running, eh?
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
the universal definition of propagnda "The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause. n. Material disseminated by the advocates or opponents of a doctrine or cause: wartime propaganda."

The sine qua non of propaganda is that it be ideas that another wishes you to hold, and that it be indoctrinated rather than taught in the academic sense. Academic education and propaganda are for different purposes, and are delivered differently. Propaganda is generally unsupported claims that are delivered by repetition, such as the claim that we are threatened by a crowd of immigrants at the southern border, or life on earth was intelligently designed by a supernatural intelligence. The ideas are simply claimed to be true, insufficiently supported by evidence, and repeated until believed. Fallacious arguments might be included.

With academic education, one is presented the dominant ideas in the field of study being considered, such as that all life on earth evolved over geologic time from a last common ancestor under the twin influences of natural selection acting on genetic variation in populations over generations. The evidence leading to this conclusion is then presented along with the arguments that connects it to conclusions.

Another fundamental difference between propaganda and proper education is that with the latter, the teacher doesn't care if you believe what was taught, just whether you learned it and can pass a test on the material, whereas the propagandist cares very much that you believe the propaganda, and there may be undesirable social ramifications for those who don't.

Considered from that framework, propaganda of any kind is easy to identify. It's the unsupported (or insufficiently supported) claim that is delivered through repetition that somebody obviously wants you to believe. It needn't always be insidious. Ordinary advertising often fits this description. "We're America's favorite. You'll love it!"

Recognizing what the topic of the propaganda is is not difficult. If the topic is religious, such as creationism, it's religious propaganda. If political, such as border walls, it's political propaganda.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I look at their intended audience. If the audience is within their own sect, or group, meant for themselves, then it's just encouraging their own. If the intended audience is outside of their own faith, then it's propaganda.
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I don't mean so much how do you recognize religious propaganda as how do you recognize religious propaganda, though feel free to share your views on either or both.
If it reads like sales material, or like a political attack or defense, and it's on behalf of a religion, it qualifies as propaganda.

The word is Latin for '[for] propagating' and finding its way into English from the office of the Vatican called Sacra Congregatio de Propaganda Fide, 'Sacred Congregation for Propagating the Faith', these days called the 'Congregation for the Evangelizing of Peoples'. So when they're the ones doing it, it's the real deal.
 
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loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
At one time propaganda was spread that the earth was flat but now we teach the truth that the world is a globe. Can this truth be categorised as propaganda also? I don’t think so.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
I don't mean so much how do you recognize religious propaganda as how do you recognize religious propaganda, though feel free to share your views on either or both.

There is the good kind--Christian propaganda, and the bad kind, everything else. ;)
 

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
There is the good kind--Christian propaganda, and the bad kind, everything else. ;)

Which Christian propaganda are you referring to as good because there are over 40,000 opposing sects that each claim they are true and the others are false?. Jesus commanded Christians to love one another and be as one brotherhood. Where do we see the Christianity Jesus taught in the world today?
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Pretty much all religious writings may be considered "propaganda" as they're written from subjective viewpoints, not objective viewpoints.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
I don't mean so much how do you recognize religious propaganda as how do you recognize religious propaganda, though feel free to share your views on either or both.
I generally do not.

As I stated in another recent post in another thread, I do not think that it is truly possible to separate the religious aspect of our lives from the everyday aspects of it.

Instead, I attempt to perceive patterns and identify doctrines. But mostly I try to gauge how sound any ideas are.

Whether they are considered religious by anyone is definitely a secondary concern at most.


Edited to add: @Revoltingest 's definition above is also useful. There is such a thing as too ideologically-loaded discourse, and there is also plain disregard for one's interlocutor.
 

ajay0

Well-Known Member
I don't mean so much how do you recognize religious propaganda as how do you recognize religious propaganda, though feel free to share your views on either or both.

Imo,anything that promotes vicious conduct or goes against the golden rule can be safely assumed to be religious propaganda.

Such as hating homosexuals, infidels, 'us versus them' attitude, intolerance, untouchability, sati and so on.
 
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