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How do we know a Prophet is a Prophet and sent by God?

Kelly of the Phoenix

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
loverofhumanity said:
This is for me a fascinating topic because I am a strong believer in the Prophets although I never met Them yet somehow within myself, I know they are true and sent by God.

The question is - how do we know a Prophet is from God? We have such scriptures as the Bible, the Quran which I accept and also stories about the Lives of Great Educators like Buddha, Christ, Moses, Muhammad, Krishna and Baha’u’llah.

But with no one yet able to describe God how do billions of people believe in Them?
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I’m one. Do you believe me?
 
Kelly of the Phoenix

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
loverofhumanity said:
So you are claiming that the majority of humanity are delusional? But also is the question that after the passing of the Prophet, their influence extended over many centuries. So Muhammad died in 632AD and now it’s 2022 yet His influence is felt over billions and also many governments. Can you or I achieve this? Can we replicate it?
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Seeing pictures of someone bowing before a golden statue of a known criminal and corrupt president sealed the deal for me. Clearly people will kneel before anyone and anything.
 
TransmutingSoul

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
74x12 said:
Rule #1: If they contradict the Bible they aren't of God.
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Jesus did not pass your rule # 1, according to the Jews, yet many see that Jesus did.

So, how do people know that a Prophet who comes after Jesus, will not faced the same fate of rejection by Christians?

This is what I see the OP is asking.

Regards Tony
 
74x12

74x12

Well-Known Member
TransmutingSoul said:
Jesus did not pass your rule # 1, according to the Jews, yet many see that Jesus did.

So, how do people know that a Prophet who comes after Jesus, will not faced the same fate of rejection by Christians?

This is what I see the OP is asking.

Regards Tony
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Jesus was hidden with God. He's not revealed unless the Father shows him. All true prophets will face this same dilemma.

All true prophets will face rejection to some point and to some level. But none of them will contradict the Word of God.
 
CG Didymus

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
TransmutingSoul said:
To me he was One of the greatest.

His visions by the River Chebar of the Glory of God, were sound and accurate.

Regards Tony
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The greatest? So, other than the one about the gate and the Glory of God, which other verses in Ezekiel do you see as referring to the Bab and Baha'u'llah? Then, because Jesus and Muhammad have to be considered almost as important as the Baha'i prophets, what prophecies in Ezekiel refer to them?
 
CG Didymus

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
Subduction Zone said:
And I will ask the same question. What if Deuteronomy is wrong? How do you know that it is right? The Baha'i think that believe that their prophets are right The Muslims believe that their prophet is right.

How do you test them? Everybody has confirmation bias tests so those are worthless. And one cannot assume that any one holy book is right because we have not even gotten into Eastern religions or New World ones. Or African ones.
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I can understand why some Jews believe their Scriptures are true and accurate. But to everybody else, I think it's very reasonable and sensible to question the accuracy of the Bible. Then, on top of that Christianity and the Baha'i Faith, and I suppose Islam too, cherry-pick verses to support their religions. But all of them fail to fulfill one important thing about Messianic prophecies, none of them brought peace. And, even thought, the Baha'is say they have the plan to bring peace and unity to the world, I don't see any prophecy in any religion that says the Messiah, or whatever the other religions call him, will not establish peace in his lifetime. And with Christianity, it's a never-to-die Jesus that comes down and destroys evil and gets rid of the evil kings and rulers.

So, each religion has to explain why their guy didn't fulfill the prophecies exactly. Which, to me, makes the prophecies next to useless... if they aren't going to be fulfilled as foretold in the prophecies. Is close enough is good enough? Is it okay to explain away things in the prophecies by saying they are using symbolic language and can't be interpreted literally? Which again, makes them next to useless if any religion can find a way to symbolically interpret the prophecies to make their guy fit?
 
CG Didymus

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
loverofhumanity said:
For myself personally, the centre of Christianity was Christ and still is and that’s the reason why it has endured thousands of years despite many questionable doctrines and man made teachings. Christ to me is as the sun from which all light emanates and from which candles get their light too. Without Christ as the Centre, Christianity I believe would have died out the same generation it began and with Christ’s passing the world would no longer have heard of Him had there not been a mystical force behind Him, guiding and inspiring those who followed Him. Some call it the Holy Spirit, but whatever it was, it still inspires hearts and minds.

So regardless of who spread or led Christianity at any given time in history, wasn’t it the mystical force behind Christ which was the real Cause of its spread? I have no doubt that Christ was true or truth, so the truth of Christ has spread to modern times despite man made doctrines being added.
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Who is "The Christ"? Did he fulfill the Jewish prophecies? Not even including what came after, but started with the NT. Already, Baha'is don't believe some of the things taught in the NT. The number thing being that Jesus came back to life. I don't question that the NT does teach that Jesus came back to life. The stories go out of their way to show how it was Jesus.... He said it is "I" to touch him and see that he is real.

So, what do baha'is do with that? They have to find ways to explain it away and make the resurrection symbolic. But did the disciples and the early Church leaders believe it was a "symbolic" resurrection? That Jesus rose only in spirit and not physically? I don't think so. I think that was an important part of what Christians were preaching, and what many Christians still preach today... that Jesus rose from the grave. The tomb was empty. And He lives and is going to return.

If the Baha'is are correct, all that is false. The beliefs about Jesus were wrong. They were true... If the Baha'i are correct in saying that he did not rise physically from the dead. Then what developed from that? That Jesus is God. Why would they believe that if Jesus was dead and gone? So, now he is God and part of a Trinity. That is the "Sun" that people were praying to and believing in... a make believe God. But... because they believe it was true, it had a power. In the hearts of the believers, it was all real. We hear them preach it today. That Jesus is the only one that can forgive you of your sins. They say we can't do enough. We can't be good enough to become righteous before God on our own. We need the blood of Jesus... to accept his sacrifice on the cross to become forgiven. That's got power... if believed. But is it real? Is it the truth?

But if not for Constantine and the coercion of the Roman Church would Christianity have spread like it did? Then with the Protestant preachers, especially those that preached hellfire and damnation, where would Christianity be? So, I don't think the "mystical" force behind Christianity can be claimed to be necessarily real. It could be just an idea and man-made image of a perfect risen Jesus that can save a person soul, can heal their disease, and is coming back. And we all know those types of Christians that believe like that. And even go so far as to believe the Bible stories about creation and the flood are literally true. They have a power. You can tell they believe it. They can show you in the Bible that what they believe is true. Yet, why don't so many of us believe them? For me, it's because, when it comes to religious truth, everybody thinks they have The Truth. But do they?
 
CG Didymus

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
74x12 said:
Jesus was hidden with God. He's not revealed unless the Father shows him. All true prophets will face this same dilemma.

All true prophets will face rejection to some point and to some level. But none of them will contradict the Word of God.
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Since this is a thread started by a Baha'i, the belief is that Muhammad and the Bab and Baha'u'llah are prophets also. But, actually more than prophets, but what Baha'is call manifestations. How can we know if that is true or not? Is there prophecies that point to them as being from God? Do their writings sound as if they came from God? If not, then what? They are false Messiahs? Or, if they are true prophets from God, why did they get rejected?
 
TransmutingSoul

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
74x12 said:
Jesus was hidden with God. He's not revealed unless the Father shows him. All true prophets will face this same dilemma.

All true prophets will face rejection to some point and to some level. But none of them will contradict the Word of God.
Click to expand...

Agreed.

Regards Tony
 
TransmutingSoul

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
CG Didymus said:
Since this is a thread started by a Baha'i, the belief is that Muhammad and the Bab and Baha'u'llah are prophets also. But, actually more than prophets, but what Baha'is call manifestations. How can we know if that is true or not? Is there prophecies that point to them as being from God? Do their writings sound as if they came from God? If not, then what? They are false Messiahs? Or, if they are true prophets from God, why did they get rejected?
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Baha'u'llah has left a prayer for us where this is the closing verse

“O Thou Who are the most manifest of the manifest and the most hidden of the hidden.”

Thus is a blog where it has been given some thought.

@74x12

Manifest Yet Hidden

Regards Tony
 
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