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Featured How do Christian's explain

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Riders, Aug 31, 2019.

  1. Riders

    Riders Well-Known Member

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    I went to Hare Krishna temple in Dallas 10 years ago the teacher told me this when I said something the Christian church.

    He said the Hare Krishna have also always believed in Jesus sense way back. But they don"t believe he's a God man but good prophet ..

    My Muslim friend told me the same thing Muslins sense way have always taught about Christ but Christian's don"t know who he is.

    To me sense other religions have taught Christ was a prophet sense way back to me it's proof that the God man belief in the Bible was a myth.

    How do you explain other religions teaching this especially if it goes back to days in early Christianity?
     
  2. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    Muslims didn´t exist till 600 years after Christianity, and all of their beliefs are based upon the statements of one man.

    At the time Hinduism was in India, they had no knowledge of Christ. There is a story that the Apostle Thomas taught in India, but there is little evidence to support this.

    In both cases Christ has been appropriated by other religions, long after He was resurrected.

    Christianity is based upon the written words of those who knew him, and shared His life for over three plus years.

    We know these written books existed less than 75 years after the resurrection.

    They are eyewitness accounts of men who for the most part were martyred because they would not renounce their faith.

    The appropriators have taken the true Christ as revealed in the Bible, and like Gumby they bend Him in all directions to make Him what they want. Bluntly, they do not tell the truth about Christ, therefore...............................................................
     
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  3. Shiranui117

    Shiranui117 Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
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    Islam in the 600's, India whenever an idea of Who Christ was became known widely enough in public discourse (probably not for a long time), and you call that "the early days of Christianity"?

    I'm not surprised that Islam and Hinduism reject Christianity's claims of Who Christ is. It's the reason their followers still aren't Christians. This thread is like asking Muslims to explain the fact that Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and Zoroastrians just think that Muhammad was a regular guy and the Qur'an wasn't from God.
     
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  4. pcarl

    pcarl Well-Known Member

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    Gandhi once said he could believe in Jesus if it were not for Christians.
     
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  5. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Cultural diffusion.
     
  6. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    Gandhi wore diapers.
     
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  7. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Not all Christians believe in the trinity. It is the version enforced by Rome so widespread in the Old World carried forth into the New World.

    Justification? That is what they were taught. As a kid, I wasn't taught about the trinity or about God. I was taught about Jesus. He was a nice guy and liked children. Wanted us to be good and charitable.

    "Jesus loves me this I know. For the Bible tells me so." Really can't count the number of times I sang that song.

    1. Jesus loves me! This I know,
      For the Bible tells me so;
      Little ones to Him belong;
      They are weak, but He is strong.
      • Refrain:
        Yes, Jesus loves me!
        Yes, Jesus loves me!
        Yes, Jesus loves me!
        The Bible tells me so.
    2. Jesus loves me! This I know,
      As He loved so long ago,
      Taking children on His knee,
      Saying, “Let them come to Me.”
    3. Jesus loves me still today,
      Walking with me on my way,
      Wanting as a friend to give
      Light and love to all who live.
    4. Jesus loves me! He who died
      Heaven’s gate to open wide;
      He will wash away my sin,
      Let His little child come in.
    5. Jesus loves me! He will stay
      Close beside me all the way;
      Thou hast bled and died for me,
      I will henceforth live for Thee.
     
  8. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    Religious appropriation.
     
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  9. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Christians appropriated from the Jews, and Muslims continued the act, and the Catholic church doing an odd "appropriation/repackaging" of European Pagan ideas, but with those such as Hindus, who have their own established religion and "made a spot" for Jesus instead of picking up someone else's religion entirely, it's of just what happens as cultures inter-mingle, share ideas, spread around, and people learn about things over there and people over there learn about things here.
     
  10. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    In the Qur'an, Surah 19 says:
    16. And mention in the Scripture Mary, when she withdrew from her people to an eastern location.
    17. She screened herself away from them, and We sent to her Our spirit, and He appeared to her as an immaculate human.
    18. She said, “I take refuge from you in the Most Merciful, should you be righteous.”
    19. He said, “I am only the messenger of your Lord, to give you the gift of a pure son.”
    20. She said, “How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, and I was never unchaste?”
    21. He said, “Thus said your Lord, `It is easy for Me, and We will make him a sign for humanity, and a mercy from Us. It is a matter already decided.'“
    22. So she carried him, and secluded herself with him in a remote place.
    23. The labor-pains came upon her, by the trunk of a palm-tree. She said, “I wish I had died before this, and been completely forgotten.”
    24. Whereupon he called her from beneath her: “Do not worry; your Lord has placed a stream beneath you.
    25. And shake the trunk of the palm-tree towards you, and it will drop ripe dates by you.”
    26. “So eat, and drink, and be consoled. And if you see any human, say, ‘I have vowed a fast to the Most Gracious, so I will not speak to any human today.'“
    27. Then she came to her people, carrying him. They said, “O Mary, you have done something terrible.
    28. O sister of Aaron, your father was not an evil man, and your mother was not a whore.”
    29. So she pointed to him. They said, “How can we speak to an infant in the crib?”
    30. He said, “I am the servant of Allah. He has given me the Scripture, and made me a prophet.
    31. And has made me blessed wherever I may be; and has enjoined on me prayer and charity, so long as I live.
    32. And kind to my mother, and He did not make me a disobedient rebel.
    33. So Peace is upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the Day I get resurrected alive.”
    34. That is Jesus son of Mary—the Word of truth about which they doubt.
    35. It is not for Allah to have a child—glory be to Him. To have anything done, He says to it, “Be,” and it becomes.

    • The Virgin Mary goes off in private.
    • A spirit from God that looks like a human appears to her and tells her that he is only a messenger from God and is there to give her a son.
    • Mary asks: How can happen, I’m a virgin.
    • The spirit tells her: “God says: Easy. I’m God.”
    • Mary became pregnant.
    • Later, Mary goes somewhere alone, away from town, near a palm tree, and gives birth.
    • Then Mary takes the baby back home.
    • Folks who knew her saw her with the baby ,are horrified, and give her a hard time.
    • Mary points to the baby and says: “Ask him.”
    • The people say: “What? Are you nuts? A new born baby can’t talk.”
    • The new born baby then begins to talk, saying: “I am the servant of Allah. He has planted the Hebrew and Christian Scripture in me and made me a prophet. ... Peace is on me the day I was born, the day I die, and the Day I get resurrected alive.”
    • The baby’s name was Jesus.
    • God can’t conceive a baby. All he has to do is say: “Be!” and Voila! There’s a baby.

    Now, normally, in our world, it takes a human male’s sperm and a human female’s egg in order to conceive a baby. Commonly, the egg is already in the female’s body and the male does what he has to in order to get his sperm into the female. Right?

    Now-a-days, medical technology has advanced quite a bit, and a male’s sperm can be put into a female to fertilize the egg without any concurrent male involvement. That’s called in utero fertilization. When both the egg AND the sperm are outside of a female and the sperm is put into the same dish or tube with an egg, and the egg is fertilized, that’s called in vitro fertilization.

    Medical technology is pretty advanced and the science involved is very technical. But as far as I know, no human being has ever figured out a way to fertilize a human egg without sperm. Let me know if you ever hear otherwise. And, for the record, I’ve never heard of new born baby talking, but the Muslims say that Mary was a virgin when Jesus was conceived and born, that Jesus was conceived without male sperm, and that he talked when he was a new born baby.
     
    #10 Terry Sampson, Aug 31, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
  11. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

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    So God can create planets and galaxies but can't create a sperm in a woman's body. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Glad somebody thought of that.
     
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  12. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    I didn't say he couldn't. I was just trying to show Riders that Muslims are in no position to declare themselves above theological reproach.
     
    #12 Terry Sampson, Aug 31, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
  13. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

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    Oh, sorry, then I agree with you.
     
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  14. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    The story about Thomas in India is supported. He founded a Church in Kerala, India. Do your own research on the Internet. https://www.google.com/search?q=Tho....69i57j0l5.15647j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

    One of the factors that makes the story of Jesus so compelling is (Matt 27:53) where many of the dead that had believed in Christ rose and gave testimony of Jesus. Some sources say 500 people, others do not give a number. So, it wasn't ONLY the resurrection of Jesus, but also the supporting testimony of those who were known to have died.
     
  15. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    The original Christians were Jews, and they were allowed to teach in the synagogues. The big split came when the Jewish Christians taught that the Gentiles were equal in the faith.

    The OT laid out very specific criteria for the coming Messiah, Christ met the criteria.

    The Jews missed the expansion of the faith that their own Scriptures predicted.
     
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  16. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    And that's why Christianity appropriated it and Hindus adopted it as it diffused. Christians took the Jewish religion, inserted something the Jews have always largely and mostly rejected, and turned it into something that is their own. Hindus decided Jesus is another facet or avatar of Vishnu. They didn't even bother to say if Jews or Christians are right or wrong.
     
  17. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    God can do whatever he chooses with His creation, that is why He is God. You have no idea of the mechanism He used to have the virgin Mary become the mother of the Christ, you aren´t God.

    Who cares what the Muslims believe ? There are native peoples on islands who belong to the cargo cult that believes American GI´s in WW2 were demi gods, I don´t care what they believe either.
     
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  18. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    No, it was not appropriated. How can you appropriate what was predicted to be yours in the first place ?
     
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  19. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Unless you're Jewish, it wasn't predicted to be yours because your ancestors aren't the ones Yahweh made those promises to or made those covenants with. I don't know about yours, but my ancestors were off hugging trees while Yahweh made those promises and covenants with the Hebrews. They only much later became convinced Jehovah was the same as Yahweh, and those promises were also made to them and fulfilled by their Anglo-Sax Jesus. I'm glad their ways heavily penetrated Catholicism, corrupting the entire religion into a warped form they otherwise would have condemned and killed. Christianity isn't so much "Judaeo-Christian" as it is "Judaeo-Pagan." Especially and predominately with the Catholics, but it lingers on with the Protestants. There are so many elements of both, but they have been repainted, repackaged, and repurposed for a European audience. It's not original, it's not true to the sources, and it became the thing Jesus warned about it becoming. And what Yahweh warned against. But when that happened all the Pagan stuff was Middle Eastern Paganism and for a much older audience rather than European Paganism when the Jews sliced off and pieced together elements of the stories from this tribe-and-that-culture to develop their own mythos.
     
  20. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    The Messiah was to bring peace to the entire world, Gentiles are specifically mentioned in the OT as being benefactors of the Messiah as well..

    The NT explains what Christianity is to be exactly. It is not my problem if others do not follow the blueprint.

    Catholics esteem tradition as much as the Bible. Thus the car of their Christian ride jumped the road.

    You and I disagree regarding your diatribe re paganism.
     
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