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Featured How can the Jew reject, Jesus, Muhammad, Bab and Baha'u'llah?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Tony Bristow-Stagg, Dec 30, 2020.

  1. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Jesus was talking about seeing God in his fullness. Jesus was the Son of God. Jesus being the son of God is a reference to Jesus being the second person of the Trinity.

    Jesus as the Son of God

    The concept of the Trinity is supported by the Old Testament. It doesn't mention three gods, it means a tri-unity within the Godhead. The Trinity: The Old Testament Evidence: A Multi-Personal God

     
  2. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg One Planet One People Please
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  3. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Jesus appeared to Moses at the burning Bush. Is Jesus Christ The Angel of The Lord? – Finding Christ In The Old Testament

     
  4. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Whereas that is absolutely true, whether God considers their choice reasonable and acceptable is another matter altogether. ;)
     
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  5. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg One Planet One People Please
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    Thank you for supporting the Message given by Baha'u'llah.

    I fully expected for the Christain to now use the keys found in the Message given by Baha'u'llah in many of their explanations, as when the Word is given the power of its knowledge is released.

    So see if you can trace back when it was Christians first Considered this matter.

    Regards Tony
     
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  6. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Jesus did not talk to Moses as a messenger, representative, or self of God. Moses heard the voice of God but he didn't see the Father.
     
  7. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    I was expecting to hear something like... "They reject them because they are looking for a literal fulfillment of their prophecies." Not...

    And what were those choices? With Jesus accept that is saves people from their sins? That he is God? That Baha'u'llah is the Messiah? Yes, those would be some choices, so why do they reject those choices?

    What Baha'is believe that Jesus taught is way different than what Christians believe.

    Yes, what did Jesus offer? Salvation? Eternal life? By doing what? Christians say by accepting that he paid the price for the sins of the people.

    Yes, what do Baha'is believe Jesus offered?

    So we are supposed to understand what Jesus offered. Then you say it is the vision and promise to enable us to embrace the Message? And what message is that? You tend to go around in circles and being as vague as possible. And then usually say, "It is your choice."

    Well, Baha'is don't believe the Christian salvation message. They don't believe Jesus is God. They don't believe in the devil. The don't believe he rose from the dead. What they believe is the "message" given by the Father is... "I'll be sending more prophets/comforters/Messiahs. They will lead you into more truth." But, if the Christian salvation message is true, there is no need for other messengers from God. Sins are paid for and Jesus will come back to destroy Satan. For the Baha'is to be true, none of that can be true. And all the time the Jews are watching and probably shaking their heads and saying something like, "Both of you are wrong. Jesus is not God, wasn't a sin sacrifice and Baha'u'llah, a Persian, is not the Jewish Messiah."
     
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  8. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    If there is no devil, who was the Satan in Job? The author of job treats Satan as someone distinct and separate from the "sons of God". I think satan was revealed to a greater extent in the New Testament, but he's it's underlined that Satan is a fallen angel in the book of Job. He's not one of the sons of God.
     
  9. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg One Planet One People Please
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    For it to be all true CG the solution is easy.

    Either Baha'u'llah is as claimed and it is True, or Baha'u'llah is not as He claimed and it is not true.

    Such is the quandary we all face when we look at the history of religion.

    To me the answer has been found and now it is up to me to change my own self, to live a life of peace and unity under One God as part of One Human family.

    I have answered all the questions you have asked, from my understanding of what Baha'u'llah offered.

    This is what Baha'u'llah offered to me, you and all people, it is under a spoiler so it is a definite choice to look.

    "THE world’s equilibrium hath been upset through the vibrating influence of this most great, this new World Order. Mankind’s ordered life hath been revolutionized through the agency of this unique, this wondrous System—the like of which mortal eyes have never witnessed.
    Immerse yourselves in the ocean of My words, that ye may unravel its secrets, and discover all the pearls of wisdom that lie hid in its depths. Take heed that ye do not vacillate in your determination to embrace the truth of this Cause—a Cause through which the potentialities of the might of God have been revealed, and His sovereignty established. With faces beaming with joy, hasten ye unto Him. This is the changeless Faith of God, eternal in the past, eternal in the future. Let him that seeketh, attain it; and as to him that hath refused to seek it—verily, God is Self-Sufficient, above any need of His creatures.
    Say: This is the infallible Balance which the Hand of God is holding, in which all who are in the heavens and all who are on the earth are weighed, and their fate determined, if ye be of them that believe and recognize this truth. Say: Through it the poor have been enriched, the learned enlightened, and the seekers enabled to ascend unto the presence of God. Beware, lest ye make it a cause of dissension amongst you. Be ye as firmly settled as the immovable mountain in the Cause of your Lord, the Mighty, the Loving"

    All the best for eternity CG

    Regards Tony
     
    #1369 Tony Bristow-Stagg, Feb 27, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2021
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  10. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    The Jewish writings claim that when Messiah arrives, he will be the interpreter of the Torah and teach us accordingly. That is exactly what Jesus did during his time on earth. Not only did he interpret the Torah, he said that he came to fulfill it and not do away with it (Matthew 5:17). Jesus taught that the heart behind each commandment is the key, not just the required action.
     
  11. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Jesus told the Pharisees, before Abraham was I am. John 8:58

     
  12. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    OK...
    Maybe... Maybe not.
    Fulfillling the law could result in a blessing or a curse... ;)
    The Torah teaches not to follow the heart... Jeremiah agrees.
     
  13. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    OP: Add Mirza Ghulam Ahmad to the list. Yeah, how can?
    Who are the sons of God? Did they become sons of God like in case of Jesus (Immaculate conception, breathed in by the Holy Ghost)?
     
    #1373 Aupmanyav, Feb 28, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2021
  14. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Yeah, Bahaollah was uneducated and sorry for that. Why did not he study in Tehran, Egypt or Turkey? His father was not a poor person.
    He did see the hind part as I have read.
     
  15. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Jesus doesn't teach to listen to your heart. Jeremiah 17:9 says

     
  16. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    The Christian scripture can be interpretted in many ways.
     
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  17. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Where did Jesus teach to listen to your heart? Jesus taught us to trust and rely on God for everything.

    Listen to Your Heart: More Things God Never Said

     
  18. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    Matthew 13:15... understanding with the heart
    Great!
     
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  19. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

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    Understanding with the heart is different from looking to yourself and mindfulness to find answers to things. The words of Jesus have to be read in full context for the proper meaning to be understood.
     
  20. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    You're the expert :)
     
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