How are these Great Beings explained?

[Vinayaka]

Baha'u'llah would have had what we see as basic school learning. (Which like the Bab, was not neccessary) This in no way explains His Innate Knowledge that could not be matched by the most learned and educated people that spent many years in deep study.

Many many people have outdone him. The only proof against that is his own testimony about how smart he is. One cannot beat perfection.

 

[oldbadger]

But didn't a Baha'i say that it's up to the leaders of the nations to bring about peace? Come on Doctor Baha'u'llah you fix it. Same with the economy.

Yes........ he did appeal to the leaders of the World to heal the World. And his laws suggested that economics be handed over to economics specialists; I still prefer Mosaic Law which addressed all guidance, rules and laws for the Israelites; much more inclusive and integral.

 

[Vinayaka]

And so Brahman, Siva and Nataraja are your three Great Beings? ...... Or the first of your Great Beings?

And do they have knowledge of, and interest in, you?

We have no great beings in the way Baha'i' talk about it. They're all God. The deepest is formless, the second is all form, and the third, yes, it's more active in the interaction with His own manifestation. All termed Siva. Nataraja is just His form for that perfection. He does have an interest in his own Manifestation, but it's a rather aloof interest too.

 

[oldbadger]

Indeed - he studied religion as a child and his writings show that he took those studies far more seriously than "the other boys" don't you think? That is precisely what his sister testified about his childhood and half of the argument I have been making so far.

Say what? He learned to read the Qur'an, 'Attar and Rumi etc. but he didn't study 'religion'? More Baha'i double speak methinks.

With whom he is known to have spent time - in his youth - 'discussing' the teachings, laws and traditions of Islam - presumably among other topics. The other half of my argument.

Absolutely correct.....

All Muslim parents wished for threir sons to be able to recite the Koran by heart, whereby the parents gained automatic entry into Heaven.

Bahauallah's Father would have hired the best tutors that he could afford.

 

[CG Didymus]

Matthew 27:50-54 becomes allegorical as the writer takes artistic licence fusing history with embellished symbols. The earthquakes, resurrections, and temple veil tearing were not literal events.

Embellished things could also be seen as false events being added to the story. Baha'is somehow see the embellishments as symbolic, even though Christians have taught that the events really happened. But they never taught them as symbolic, so if they never happened, then the Christians are making up false events.

 

[oldbadger]

I
Baha'u'llah would have had what we see as basic school learning. (Which like the Bab, was not neccessary) This in no way explains His Innate Knowledge that could not be matched by the most learned and educated people that spent many years in deep study.

This story is similar to the story of the youth Jesus who asked such amazing questions of the learned priests in the Temple, showing such intimate knowledge of all, and he the son of a Galilean peasant. But the story is spoiled somewhat by the beginning, in which his parents wander off home and don't notice his absence and until far from city.

The Christians wanted (needed) their God to have Divine knowledge of all as well. G-John sure could tell 'em.

 

[oldbadger]

This is more on that subject;

Schooling

As He grew up, Bahá'u'lláh desired no schooling. He received a little customary education at home, in riding, using a sword or gun, good manners, calligraphy, poetries, and the ability to read out the words of the Qur'an.

Hafiz........... the ambition of all Muslim parents, but not by reading, but by reciting by heart.
So he learned 8 subjects to Advanced Standard. I don't know many folks who achieved 8 Ordinary levels, let alone Advanced levels.
That is equivalent to at least one Degree (Qu'run) and possibly another in literature.

....a little customary education!

 

[CG Didymus]

So it's changed from this:
'Birth control, however, when exercised in order to deliberately prevent the procreation of any children is against the spirit of the Law of Bahá’u’lláh, which defines the primary purpose of marriage to be the rearing of children and their spiritual training in the Cause. The Universal House of Justice will have to consider this issue and give its verdict upon it.'

"The Universal House of Justice feels that the time has not yet arrived for legislation on this matter, and that these instructions provide sufficient guidance for the friends for the time being.

(From a letter of the Universal House of Justice to the National Spiritual Assembly of the British Isles, July 13, 1967)"
Good to know.

Baha'is take credit for all the good things science has brought, but what about the bad? Like a horrible pill that allows people to have sex without making a baby. Or, the science that made weapons of mass destruction? Why did Baha'u'llah bring that kind of knowledge to the world?

 

[CG Didymus]

Not necessarily. Nowadays with the right technology and funding buildings can be built to withstand all sorts of natural disasters.

They're still struggling to get power back. How are the Baha'is doing there?

 

[Vinayaka]

Baha'is take credit for all the good things science has brought, but what about the bad? Like a horrible pill that allows people to have sex without making a baby. Or, the science that made weapons of mass destruction? Why did Baha'u'llah bring that kind of knowledge to the world?

It's truly amazing, the credit taking, isn't it? I've just shaken my head ... What??? so many times in this thread. If he could be Gandhi's main influence, invent Christianity, start the UN, and much more, one would think stopping the persecution of his own in Iran would be a simple task, eh?

 

[CG Didymus]

My understanding is that the basic foundation of belief in Christianity was that Jesus was a Manifestation of God called the Son of God.

I believe that once the Divinity of Jesus deviated from that then Christianity began to gradually lose its way and fall prey to man made dogmas which eventually caused splits and wars.

Politics and power became more important then love and I also believe that’s why Muhammad was sent to not only bring a new Revelation but clear up the misconceptions and false dogmas that were being taught to Christians.

And Baha'is say that the Ummayad dynasty was the beast from Revelation. So how long did Islam last before it had misconceptions?

 

[CG Didymus]

The Doctor administers the remedy, the body must heal itself. The body must accept the given remedy for that process to happen.

Regards Tony

The Doctor says to get rid of armaments. But he said that before nuclear bombs. How do we uninvent them? What did the Doctor say?

 

[CG Didymus]

It's truly amazing, the credit taking, isn't it? I've just shaken my head ... What??? so many times in this thread. If he could be Gandhi's main influence, invent Christianity, start the UN, and much more, one would think stopping the persecution of his own in Iran would be a simple task, eh?

He also is putting a stop to racism and sexism and gay rights to... Ah, wait, ah... No, the gays don't need rights... They need counseling.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Baha'is take credit for all the good things science has brought, but what about the bad? Like a horrible pill that allows people to have sex without making a baby. Or, the science that made weapons of mass destruction? Why did Baha'u'llah bring that kind of knowledge to the world?

Baha'i do not take credit for them. They attribute the progress in sciences to God's holy Spirit released at the time of Revelation of the Bab and Bahaullah.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

The Doctor says to get rid of armaments. But he said that before nuclear bombs. How do we uninvent them? What did the Doctor say?

Stay well and happy CG, we have posted answers to that and many other questions, many times.

Well past time to leave this thread. Wonder if self will get in the way again.

Regards Tony

 

[Vinayaka]

Baha'i do not take credit for them. They attribute the progress in sciences to God's holy Spirit released at the time of Revelation of the Bab and Bahaullah.

Do you understand what taking credit means?

Attribute the progress to ...means taking credit.

take credit for something. to allow people to believe that one has done something praiseworthy, whether or not one has actually done it. I can't take credit for the entire success.

 

[Vinayaka]

Well past time to leave this thread. Wonder if self will get in the way again.

Are you asking him to leave, or are you saying you're leaving (again)?

It's hard to get away, isn't it? We're all stuck in a ditch here, might as well enjoy it.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Do you understand what taking credit means?

Attribute the progress to ...means taking credit.

take credit for something. to allow people to believe that one has done something praiseworthy, whether or not one has actually done it. I can't take credit for the entire success.

A Baha'i takes zero credit, we give Credit only to God, that may be a different mindset that you are used to.

God Doeth as He Willeth.

Goodbye Vinayaka, I hope life is always good to you in your future.

Regards Tony

 

[Vinayaka]

A Baha'i takes zero credit, we give Credit only to God, that may be a different mindset that you are used to.

That's laughable. I can find (if I wanted to take the time) posts where a connection was drawn between Gandhi and Baha'u'llah, the UN and Baha'u'llah, etc. Perhaps it's not the Baha'i, perhaps it's Baha'u'llah or his son, or the grandson, I'm not sure. Certainly there is a lot of beliefs indicating we'd all be in deep trouble if it weren't for him.

I don't see how anger at hearing another's opinion is useful, but as you wish.

 

[Dawnofhope]

At some considerable risk of irritating @Vinayaka ........ Indeed he himself rather than @Aupmanyav.
Occasionally I will visit a local transport cafe for breakfast. A couple of regulars are often seen, stuffing a full-english (you would know them on sight, by weight alone) are usually telling the other diners about what is wrong with the World.
Beyond their usual subject matter, such as how to play football correctly, or how to rule the UK, their most intense subject is Cold Calling Religious Do Gooders!
You know me, I would never even think of dropping the match, but I may innocently have mentioned once how the JWs had recently called. I would not need to describe the self righteous furore resulting. When one of 'em gets really excited he spits egg across the cafe.
Such responses on doorsteps often do Mystify JWs, just as you might be mystified by attitudes here. But a JW would never send any away........
How does it go....? It's the only passage I ever learned.
Not every sea hath pearls; not every branch will flower, nor will the nightingale sing thereon.
Then, ere the nightingale of the mystic paradise repair to the garden of God,
and the rays of the heavenly morning return to the Sun of Truth.............. make thou an effort.

This reminds me a of a story I heard long ago about a man who wished to know the meaning of heaven and hell. He searched and searched and eventually he was directed to see a wise hermit sage that lived deep within the mountains. So over many days he make the treacherous journey. Eventually to his delight, he reached the goal of his desire and found the sage. The sage asked about the purpose of his visit and when informed of the question concerning heaven and hell, the sage's face contorted with scorn and he simply retorted "Why should I tell an A***hole like you!"

The seeker hurt and enraged reached for his sword as he intended to kill the sage then and there. At which point the sage calmly responded "now you are in hell." In an instant a profound flash of inspiration and the seeker knew in his heart the question had been answered. In profound gratitude he knelt to kiss the sage's feet, to which the wise man said "and now you are in heaven."

We are all seekers, Baha'is included.