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How are these Great Beings explained?

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I avoid directly teaching Jews about the Baha'i faith on RF btw. I'll talk about Christ, but avoid mentioning my own religion to them.

Still doen't address what Jews think of Baha'i's. But agreeing to not proselytize is great. Too bad the Muslims, Baha'i' , and Christians wouldn't extend the same courtesy to Hindus. India should have made the same deal in return for the Delhi Baha'i temple. Maybe the Jews will share with us how they did it.
 

InvestigateTruth

Well-Known Member
A couple of problems we've already talked about... The Bible says Isaac was the son that was taken to be sacrificed. The New Testament says Jesus came back to life and appeared, ate, spoke and was touched by his disciples. Baha'is take both those plain and obvious stories and change them.

Why? Because they need Ishmael, not Isaac, to be the one Abraham took to be sacrificed.

Not a problem for me. Bahaullah answers:


The question is that whereas in past Scriptures[1][2] Isaac is said to have been the sacrifice;[3] in the Qur’án[4] this station is given to Ishmael.[5] This is, undoubtedly, true. All, however, must fix their gaze upon the word which hath dawned from the Divine Horizon:[6]it is incumbent upon every soul to ponder upon its sovereignty, influence, might, and on its all-encompassing nature. There hath never been any doubt whatsoever that all these things are confirmed and corroborated only by the Word of God. It is the Word of God that transcendeth all things, creates the universe, educateth the people, guideth them who are sore athirst from separation unto the ocean of reunion, and penetrateth through the darkness of ignorance with the light of understanding. Consider: all those who believe in past Scriptures[7] think of Isaac as the Sacrifice; likewise, the people of Qur’án[8]confirm this station for Ishmael. It is clear and evident to every possessor of insight and every religious person that no one was, outwardly[9] sacrificed; all agree that an animal was sacrificed. So, ponder upon this: Why is it that a person who hath gone to the altar of sacrifice for the Beloved and yet hath come back [alive], is adorned with the raiment of ‘Sacrifice of God’ and accepted[10] as such? There is no doubt that this is so because of the Word of God. Therefore, the criterion[11]for the manifestation of all names and for confirmation and fulfillment of all stations is dependent upon the Word of God.[12]Likewise, there is no doubt, that the Inaccessible, Unknowable [God] doth not talk as He is, and hath always been, sanctified from such conditions; rather, He speaketh through the tongue of His Manifestations.[13]Thus the Torah issued from the tongue of Moses. The same is true of other Holy Scriptures: all were revealed by the tongues of Prophets and Messengers but, the real Speaker[14] in all these Holy Books is the One true God.... It is now, therefore, established and confirmed that the station of ‘Sacrifice of God’ was, according to past Books,[15] given to Isaac by Abraham and that very same station is, according to Divine Revelation, Ishmael’s in the Qur’ánic Dispensation.[16]



They also can't believe in the possibility that Jesus resurrected. So Baha'is change things in religions to suit their needs.
Baha'is can believe Jesus was resurrected spiritually. Now can Atheist believe Jesus was resurrected either spiritually or physically?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Indeed. Major problem. Backward.
Adrian, I see birth control as another major problem. No birth control means higher population, means more poverty. As for abortion, I personally agree with the Baha'i' stance, but wouldn't enforce my view on others.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
In my view, it was a trick to imply, 'Oh, we're just like you,' to get a foot in the door for follow-up conversion. The Christians in India have been using similar tactics for years. In the beginning stress the similarities, to gain confidence. Send the big guns in later. Few Hindus would fall for it, and those who do, we can do without.
Yes, the old foot in the door trick. I used to fall for the old flower from a pretty girl trick. They got me believing almost anything.
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Yes, the old foot in the door trick. I used to fall for the old flower from a pretty girl trick. They got me believing almost anything.

'Flirt to convert' is the slogan. Seeking out the lonely, (husbands working abroad) reading obituaries to find the most vulnerable, fake miracles, using children as a barrier, there's a secret book of 'How to ..." lol

A part of you was too vulnerable I guess.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
The greatest torment I see can be had right now, that is not knowing of our God. I can see no greater torment.

So there is Knowing God...Heaven and less knowledge of God....leading to no knowledge..Hell.

Regards Tony
And that is justice? Having no knowledge of God? So Jesus lied about evil people being punished with fiery torment?
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Do you want a laptop that doesn't work because the manufacturer hasn't adhered to consistent standards?

Question with a question. :rolleyes: Please answer the question.

I know you're familiar with this. Early this year I took a neuropsychological testing. It lasted about four hours. Near the end, the instructor (or clinician?) told me to sit in front of the computer and look at shapes and colors. I press on the shape trying to make a pattern. Every time I click a pattern, it was wrong. It supposed to tell if one can adapt to change or flexibility. I cannot at all. They found I have a dysfunction in the frontal lobe. Executive functions and ability to "change direction" are many symptoms included.

The test gave me inconsistent results for a reason. It helped the doctors to know what part of the brain my seizures now originate. With the information, we decided not to opt for surgery and take me off one of my meds instead.

Without inconsistency tests like that, then they would not have found out this information. In my eyes both medical experience and all the above, inconsistency is a must.

The Buddha Dharma taught that everything is in constant motion (samsara). Everything is in constant change. Nothing is consistent. No eternity. He taught against that. We learn to deal with change. We learn to deal with inconsistencies. Yes, we can learn how to roll with the flow but not all religions teach that everything needs to be consistent.

So, I ask you since I am not familiar with "needing to be consistent" view of life (seizures are quite the opposite)

Why are inconsistances wrong?
 
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CG Didymus

Veteran Member
'Flirt to convert' is the slogan. Seeking out the lonely, (husbands working abroad) reading obituaries to find the most vulnerable, fake miracles, using children as a barrier, there's a secret book of 'How to ..." lol

A part of you was too vulnerable I guess.
Do you think drooling over her looks gave it away?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Question with a question. :rolleyes: Please answer the question.

Why are inconsistances wrong?

I wonder how many times you will have to ask, before you get a response, or indeed if you ever will get a response. Evasion tactics are annoying, eh?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
Do you think drooling over her looks gave it away?

Part of me says 'if I only knew what I know now'. The more spiritual part is great with what happened. Here's a funny story ... In high school, my brother (whom I didn't really get along with) asks me if I want to go on a double date with his date's little sister. Of course I say no, cause who wants to be stuck with somebody's little sister, right, and partly just to spite my brother for playing the 'big brother' role with too much desperation. So about 3 weeks later, he points me to 'the little sister'. She's this incredibly endowed and beautiful girl, long legs, pretty like a model, and to make things worse, it seems she didn't mind a little foolin' around if you know what I mean.
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
So I googled what do Jewish people think of the Baha'i' faith. I couldn't find a single site that addressed it from the Jewish POV. Of course I did find dozens of sites that addressed it from the Baha'i POV, mostly about how many Jews had converted to a Baha'i', and a few non-Baha'i non-Jewish musings on the topic. So my search itself indicated a lot to me, namely that the Baha'is really care about putting their beliefs out there to Jews, (proselytizing) but it's not at all a reciprocal process.

Now I do wonder what the Jews think, if anything?

The world Centre is in Israel, many Jews each day visit the Gardens and hear the explanation of the significance.

I met and talked to a few while their on my 9 day Pilgrimage. Baha'u'llah was Banished there all coinciding withe the Jews Return to the Holy Land. A return foretold in their own scriptures.

I look forward to the day we can talk about it all.

Regards Tony
 

TransmutingSoul

Veteran Member
Premium Member
And that is justice? Having no knowledge of God? So Jesus lied about evil people being punished with fiery torment?

Yes, Yes and No. I know you are not looking for a detailed answer with quotes to which this subject requires.

There is a prayer by the Bab that finishes with this thought;

"....Indeed shouldst Thou desire to confer blessing upon a servant Thou wouldst blot out from the realm of his heart every mention or disposition except Thine Own mention; and shouldst Thou ordain evil for a servant by reason of that which his hands have unjustly wrought before Thy face, Thou wouldst test him with the benefits of this world and of the next that he might become preoccupied therewith and forget Thy remembrance." Bahá'í Reference Library - Bahá’í Prayers: A Selection of Prayers Revealed by Bahá’u’lláh, the Báb, and ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Pages 150-151

Our unwise choices are our torment, even when we are unaware that is so. This ancient tradition hints at this; "The good deeds of the righteous are the sins of the near ones".

Regards Tony
 
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Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
I don't know, but everything that is, being a part of all, and all being of God, proves the existence of a Deity, or so I believe .. not that such Deity notices us.

No. Yeshua referred to self as the son of man, but since the Israelites believed that they were the children of God, then any Israelite man could call himself son-of-God. Interesting...............?

No...... just that they were amazing people...........
I agree to that. That is my belief (Advaita - non-duality). All being part of one. That does not prove the existence of deity. It just proves my existence. There is no deity.

I thought only prophets were sons of God and not everyone. Read that somewhere.

And, pray, what was amazing with them? They were good speakers. They established only their own importance among the people they commanded. Sometimes just eleven (not counting Judas) and sometimes a marauding horde.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
I can agree with that. Hinduism was a Religion established thousands years ago. I however believe we do need a new Religion for our new age, and I found Baha'i Faith to be the one.
Good for you. I stick with my old one.
That is true. There is no end to what silly people believe in. But within each religion, including yours, there is a great deal of truth, wisdom, and practical advice for good living. But when religion becomes overtaken by superstition and prejudice and brings out the worst in people rather than the best, then its best to leave that religion altogether.
There is no superstition greater than God, as also the belief in sons, manfiestations, prophets, mahdis, who claim the sole agency for selling tickets to heaven.
 
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