1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

House Democrats Want AZOV Battalion Listed as Terrorist Group

Discussion in 'The Political World' started by Stanyon, Oct 22, 2019.

  1. Stanyon

    Stanyon WWMRD?

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    4,774
    Ratings:
    +2,225
    Religion:
    Living
    My how times have changed, yet another of Americas Allies who seemingly fought for western interests against the Russians have been betrayed, only this time they are also blamed for supposedly inspiring far-right and neo- nazi's in the U.S. ( the very same accusation that was made against Russia). The Obama administration supported them
    Please read the full articles

    "A group of 40 House Democrats called on the State Department to designate three European neo-Nazi groups as terrorist organizations, Vice reported Wednesday.
    The letter urged regulators to list Ukraine’s Azov Battalion, Britain’s National Action and Scandinavia’s Nordic Resistance Movement on the State Deparment’s list of Foreign Terror Organizations. This would give security officials more tools to monitor and potentially prosecute Americans who correspond or train with those organizations."
    source Oct 16, 2019 :
    House Democrats: Put Neo-Nazi Groups On Terrorist List – The Forward

    Oct 22, 2019:

    "The notorious Ukrainian paramilitary group Azov took offense after 40 US Democratic representatives called it just that in a letter to the State Department. Led by Max Rose (D-NY), the lawmakers asked why a “violent white supremacist” group “that openly welcomes neo-Nazis into its ranks” has still not been officially listed as a foreign terrorist organization by the US government.
    They wrote that the shooter in Christchurch, New Zealand had ties with Azov and “routinely wore a neo-Nazi symbol associated with them.” The massacre, which left 51 people dead, directly inspired the recent mass shootings in Poway, California and El Paso, Texas, the lawmakers said, accusing Azov of “radicalizing” American citizens."

    Source:
    Ukraine’s infamous ultra-nationalist group Azov says US lawmakers SLANDERED them by saying they inspire terrorism — RT World News
    From The Intercept Feb 27,2015:

    "A similar dynamic is at play in Russia and Ukraine. Yesterday, Obama’s top national security official, Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, told a Senate Committee “that he supports arming Ukrainian forces against Russian-backed separatists,” as the Washington Post put it. The U.S. has already provided “non-lethal” aid to Ukrainian forces, and Obama has said he is now considering arming them. Who, exactly, would that empower?
    Russian President Vladimir Putin has long said that the Ukrainian coup of last year, and the subsequent regime in Kiev, is driven by ultra-nationalists, fascists, and even neo-Nazi factions. The Russian TV outlet RT also frequently refers to “the active role far-right groups have played on the pro-government side in Ukraine since the violent coup of the last year.”
    For that reason, anyone pointing out that arming the regime in Kiev would strengthen fascists and neo-Nazis is instantly accused of being a Putin propagandist: exactly like those arguing that the best anti-Assad fighters were al-Qaeda-affiliated were accused of being Assad propagandists (until that became the official position of the US Government). U.S. media accounts invariably depict the conflict in Ukraine as a noble struggle waged by the freedom-loving, pro-west democrats in Kiev against the oppressive, aggressive “Russian-backed” separatists in the east."

    source:
    Clapper Calls for Arming Ukrainian Forces: Who Would That Actually Empower?


     
  2. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    15,757
    Ratings:
    +8,076
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Sorry, what's your position? I'm confused.
     
  3. sun rise

    sun rise "Let there be peace and love among all"
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2014
    Messages:
    37,918
    Ratings:
    +14,434
    Religion:
    Love
    Neo-nazis get no sympathy from me. They're no friends of anyone who loves freedom and democracy.

    In 2014, it gained notoriety after allegations emerged of torture and war crimes, as well as neo-Nazi sympathies and usage of associated symbols by the regiment itself, as seen in their logo featuring the Wolfsangel, one of the original symbols used by the German Nazi Party. In 2014, around 10-20% of the unit were neo-Nazis.[9] The U.S. Congress passed legislation in 2018 blocking military aid to Azov on the grounds of its white supremacist ideology

    Azov Battalion - Wikipedia
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  4. Stanyon

    Stanyon WWMRD?

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    4,774
    Ratings:
    +2,225
    Religion:
    Living
    So under Obama they were o.k. but under Trump they stopped aid. Rest assured the U.S. knew what was going on S.F. are responsible for monitoring and reporting actions of rebels etc. We train and use. Someone knew long ago, maybe they were more useful as terrorists at the time?

    Since it is claimed that Azov is responsible for the rise of far right and Nazis in the U.S. could it not be said that Obama contributed to the rise of far right nationalism by supporting Azov?
     
  5. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    14,775
    Ratings:
    +3,315
    Religion:
    Theological noncognitivist
    The point is the amendments that would have prevented legal funding were removed before the passed Bill. It wasn't gutted by Congress as per the record via amendments. It was dropped completely without notice at all due to the DoD. This is a standard policy of the US to turn a blind eye to a group only to label them terrorist when the group is no longer useful or becomes an enemy. Just like when the US was handing out money to Sunni and Baath militia which turned into ISIS later.

    Pelosi was minority leader in 2015/16. She didn't bat an eye.
     
  6. wellwisher

    wellwisher Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2018
    Messages:
    640
    Ratings:
    +243
    Religion:
    Catholic
    By the transitive property, since Obama assisted them, and Obama was a Democrat, the Democrats also sided and empowered them. Should the Democrats be considered a terrorist group due to their transitive connection? With this designation we can use the tools of government to monitor their behavior, while they scheme behind closed doors wearing hoodies.

    Left wing propaganda, coming from the Democrats players appears to be terrorizing the youth of the USA. Many have become so shelled shocked that have become snowflakes, with the rate of suicide increasing. It smells like the fruit of terrorists to me.
     
  7. Stanyon

    Stanyon WWMRD?

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    4,774
    Ratings:
    +2,225
    Religion:
    Living
    It seems CNN and MSNBC is not covering this, I may be wrong but I couldn't find anything yet. Wonder if it is because uncomfortable questions may be raised about the U.S. role in supporting terrorism in the Ukraine and the democratic parties stamp of approval on it?
     
  8. Good-Ole-Rebel

    Good-Ole-Rebel Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2019
    Messages:
    827
    Ratings:
    +69
    Religion:
    Christian
    This is the liberal left building stepping stones to be able to brand any white group in the U.S. as a terrorist organization. They start with these groups in Europe so as not to raise so much fuss here. The liberal media follows their lead and doesn't want it to be broadcast so as to get it done quickly. Once it is done they have a precedent to work from.

    Good-Ole-Rebel
     
  9. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    14,775
    Ratings:
    +3,315
    Religion:
    Theological noncognitivist
    So far no one has presented evidence this group actually received funding. The Bill is worded for funding "military and national security forces". There could be direct funding from the US itself if it designates the group as a one of the two. Indirect funding if Ukraine creates the designations. RT does not provide evidence of funding. It only puts out the hypothetical.
     
  10. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    14,775
    Ratings:
    +3,315
    Religion:
    Theological noncognitivist
    CNN was promoting the group in 2017 while omitting major parts of the groups ideology
     
  11. Stanyon

    Stanyon WWMRD?

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    4,774
    Ratings:
    +2,225
    Religion:
    Living
    Interesting, I also believe that some representing AZOV were at the "unite the right" rally in Charlottesville, I need to find some pictures.
     
  12. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    14,775
    Ratings:
    +3,315
    Religion:
    Theological noncognitivist
    CNN even had reporters with the group.
     
Loading...