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Hinduism makes me lonely! :( (warning: long!)

Okay, so I'll bite the dust.

As you all have known, I have been a Vaishnava for some years now. Although I have wavered from time to time, I have been mainly active. I left my entire family's value system (aunts, uncles, grandparents, parents, siblings, cousins, etc.) and religious culture (Christianity), internalised since four generations, to convert to Hinduism.

As you all may have or not have known, I also am a woman with transsexual history. I keep this part private since it is a part of my psychological and medical history from birth to now, and many people are prejudiced with 'true transsexuals'.

When I converted, I became quickly active back then in my old self. I learned how to wear temple clothes, began chanting 16 to 20 rounds every day for years. I followed the four regulations of spiritual life very quickly: no meat eating (to follow daya, or compassion), no gambling (to follow satyam, or truth), no illicit sex (to follow tapah, or self-discipline), and no intoxication (to follow shaucham, or cleanliness). I did puja at home every day, and committed to reading Vaishnava Scripture every day.

I also was very active at my local Vaishnava temple. I helped volunteer with preaching activities: going out on the streets a few times a month to sing God's names, distributed books about Krishna, and talked to strangers about Krishna. I also distributed flyers, brochures, and temple invites. I helped washing temple dishes, helped the elders close by, by bringing them temple prasadam, walking them to temple, etc. I did service once a week in the pujari room polishing the silver for the altar Deities, went to Sunday feast regularly and accomodated guests and visitors there, participated in home programs, attended classes and workshops (and listened to everyone on the vyasasana), aspired for gurus, volunteered time for festivals and other preaching activities. I helped serve prasadam for lunch hours at temple, and did other services such as cleaning and tidying.

Maintaining my sadhana and seva was a balancing act for me. Then I found out about my past medical history, had a psychological assessment, and got myself medical care two years ago, so I could continue with stri-dharma. The temple council, who I tried to talk to, did not allow me allotted time, even when I created a compilation of Vedic references to my transsexuality and distributed them to the temple presidents.

I certainly am NOT a hijra, and I intended to follow stri-dharma as I could. But I heard from another devotee that they rather laughed at my plight, and I've had a guru (Sankarshan das Adhikari) tell me that a), I would never go back to God, b) I should never take a guru because I will drag him down through samsara, and c) I could even be born in a lower species of life. During class, even this same guru would mention my plight in public, and then demonise it in front of other devotees! I felt humiliated, and cried, and did not associate for a while.

~*~*~*~*~*~

Skip into the present, I celebrated Sri Chaitanya's Appearance Day (or Gaura-Purnima) just last week, which is one of the most auspicious days of the year for us, and considered the new year for all Gaudiya Vaishnavas. I haven't been attending temple regularly, but at this particular festival, I've had half the local congregation pass by me or look briefly at me and completely ignore me, or look away. They would in discomfort say hi, or 'Hare Krishna!' and then either move away, or merely glance away from me.

I certainly hope I didn't look horrid, but I was appalled by this very un-Vaishnava behaviour. Although some devotees (actually many) still talk to me, a good many do not, and I can see in their eyes a sense of disgust. What hit me the most was that they were looking at me, not because of my sadhana, or my spiritual life, or how I was such a dedicated devotee (yes, that's my ahamkara talking!), but rather because of my body.

I have been told by some devotees to be transcendental above this matter, and that there will always be people who will accept me and not accept me. But it is very hurtful sometimes to come for darshan, and then have some people who used to associate with you regularly suddenly stop talking to you. I should go to temple just for Krishna to see me, but sangha is an INTEGRAL part of the Vaishnava religion! How can we be told that we constantly need the mercy of the other Vaishnavas, when they themselves chose to not associate with me? I gave my heart and soul to my local community, and they literally turn their backs to me.

I wish that there was another Vaishnava temple in my locality, but unfortunately there are none. I wish I could just be transcendental to such mundanities, and go without hesitation. But it disheartens me and I haven't really done much sadhana lately. I just feel hurt, and I do not know what to do. Am I being selfish by assuming that everyone is going to like me?

Sometimes I feel that maybe I was better off in the religion of my family - they have been very accepting of me, especially my very religious grandmother, and I have seriously been thinking of reconverting. My boyfriend suggests that I convert to Unitarian Universalism. At the heart of the matter, I just do not know anymore. :( Practicing Vaishnavism is best done communally, but where can I seek refuge except through Krishna?
 

Sumit

Sanatana Dharma
I certainly am NOT a hijra, and I intended to follow stri-dharma as I could. But I heard from another devotee that they rather laughed at my plight, and I've had a guru (Sankarshan das Adhikari) tell me that a), I would never go back to God, b) I should never take a guru because I will drag him down through samsara, and c) I could even be born in a lower species of life. During class, even this same guru would mention my plight in public, and then demonise it in front of other devotees! I felt humiliated, and cried, and did not associate for a while.
Why do you consider such person as your Guru. This person do not know what guru is. And why you cry? Because they said so or you believe what they say? Gita clearly states that "whoever comes to me through whatever path, all attains me". So just be happy.

I wish that there was another Vaishnava temple in my locality, but unfortunately there are none. I wish I could just be transcendental to such mundanities, and go without hesitation. But it disheartens me and I haven't really done much sadhana lately. I just feel hurt, and I do not know what to do. Am I being selfish by assuming that everyone is going to like me?
Why to you need any temple to worship? This body is temple and god resides in your heart. Make any small room as poojaghar and use it for prayers and when you are sad go and sit in that room, it is as effective as visiting temple. So do not visit that temple anymore.
 

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
:hugehug:

Unfortunately most Hindus are still somewhat socially conservative, so there's going to be some problem...

But my own opinion is with the local UU congregation... I wouldn't suggest converting to UU. Middle-aged, Middle-class white people who eat biscuits and sing "Go from here in Peace, Go in Love~" whilst recoiling in abject terror at the word 'God' are not going to be as fulfilling for you spiritually as either Christianity (either Anglo-Catholic or Catholicism) - UUism is, in comparison, a little bit drab and Protestant-esque, when you've been spoilt by two of the great religions of bhakti and artwork to suddenly go into something like that... I think you'd find it boring after a while... and there's no real unity.

I don't know about you, but I also don't like religion in politics, so I'd get annoyed with UU's more political evangelism, even though I may support their views.

I don't think you're in the wrong or being selfish by expecting people to like you. I'm sure you're aware not everyone is going to like you, because some people are like that -- but the guru. The guru!!! Not a sadhguru in my opinion, and if this is the guru there... it's not worth your time. If it's not the guru... then maybe continue trying.

But remember, this place is also your saṃgha. :) But face-to-face...
I don't know. I really don't.
 
Why do you consider such person as your Guru. This person do not know what guru is. And why you cry? Because they said so or you believe what they say? Gita clearly states that "whoever comes to me through whatever path, all attains me". So just be happy.

Thank you, sir. I suppose a "don't worry, be happy!" attitude should be the best, I suppose. This man is certainly not my guru, but some person which many consider a guru, who was visiting my temple a few years ago.

I suppose that I was so hurt, because I was not even aspiring for his shiksha anyways!

Why to you need any temple to worship? This body is temple and god resides in your heart. Make any small room as poojaghar and use it for prayers and when you are sad go and sit in that room, it is as effective as visiting temple. So do not visit that temple anymore.

I could definitely make part of my home a kirtan-ghar. Thank you for the suggestion. If only I could be as detached as you!
 
:hugehug:

Unfortunately most Hindus are still somewhat socially conservative, so there's going to be some problem...

Thank you for the hug! :) I really appreciate it. And yes, many Hindus are socially conservative. That's a given.

But my own opinion is with the local UU congregation... I wouldn't suggest converting to UU. Middle-aged, Middle-class white people who eat biscuits and sing "Go from here in Peace, Go in Love~" whilst recoiling in abject terror at the word 'God' are not going to be as fulfilling for you spiritually as either Christianity (either Anglo-Catholic or Catholicism) - UUism is, in comparison, a little bit drab and Protestant-esque, when you've been spoilt by two of the great religions of bhakti and artwork to suddenly go into something like that... I think you'd find it boring after a while... and there's no real unity.

I don't know about you, but I also don't like religion in politics, so I'd get annoyed with UU's more political evangelism, even though I may support their views.

I only mentioned it because my boyfriend is Unitarian Universalist. But I must say, I am biased with the Christianity of my forebears. It gave me a belief system growing up, and I wasn't forced to believe, or had the religion shoved down my throat like many ex-Christians bitterly remember. I grew up with Christian home shrines and statues, candles, crucifixes, grace at special meals, and rosary prayers, and loving grandparents.

It's certainly boring at times, but it unified my family,and it still does. For Filipinos, religion and culture blend together without separation. But I do understand: Hinduism is theologically fulfilling, philosophically refreshing, aesthetically appealing, ritually inspiring, and balances individuality and community that other religions don't necessarily provide upfront.

Intellectually, Unitarian Universalism appeal for unitive reasons with my significant other, and it is intelligently stimulating and engaging. But certainly boring in worship. It is a little dry and white as an Albertan winter!

I don't think you're in the wrong or being selfish by expecting people to like you. I'm sure you're aware not everyone is going to like you, because some people are like that -- but the guru. The guru!!! Not a sadhguru in my opinion, and if this is the guru there... it's not worth your time. If it's not the guru... then maybe continue trying.

But remember, this place is also your saṃgha. :) But face-to-face...
I don't know. I really don't.

Now I know that that particular guru had no realisation of how I felt, and he was a guest visiting the temple. But I've had one visiting guru tell others that such a thing was sinful, and another who used to at least engage with me also stopped talking to me.

At least I do have online association, but I suppose it's nicer to be with others face-to-face. I can't exactly listen to a Vaishnava lecture, and develop interpersonal skills with a monitor screen.
 

Nyingjé Tso

Tänpa Yungdrung zhab pä tän gyur jig
Vanakkam,

Mens didn't made you what you are, women didn't made you what you are, your parents, family, not even yourself made you. It's God.
And God didn't made any mistake to make you as you are. It is a gift, because you are stronger and you are becoming stronger.
People that tell you what you are, aren't, should be fail to see the work of God around them, such persons aren't far on the spiritual path, such persons should not be called Guru also. Take God's hand and stand up above all judgements, by the strenght of your Sadhana nothing will stop you. Your devotion is toward God, not toward mens and womens.
Make a temple in your body, make a temple in your house...And stand up before God and say proudly: "I am your devotee, I am the way you made me, I only need you"
God never let go of the faithful devotees that seek Him. I know when I'm alone, I look around me, I look at my altar, I look outside and inside myself and smile: "Ah Lord Shiva, there you are !"

Aum Namah Shivaya
 

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
Gaura, sweet soul, I am so sorry you are going through this; I truly am.

Why to you need any temple to worship? This body is temple and god resides in your heart. Make any small room as poojaghar and use it for prayers and when you are sad go and sit in that room, it is as effective as visiting temple. So do not visit that temple anymore.

Before I read Sumit's post, as I was reading Gaura's, I was thinking the same thing. Perhaps this is because I am not a social person or a temple-goer anymore. Not for any reason other than I don't feel that God resides only in temple, any more than s/he does in one's heart or one's living room. I admit I may be biased in that regard.

But if the environment is hurtful, and it sounds like it certainly is, why torture oneself and try to "force the issue" of making oneself continue in uncomfortable company. I'm not passing judgment on the other people, but some situations are not suited to everyone.

No one needs to account to or explain anything to anyone except themselves. Not even to God. God doesn't want an explanation or to be accounted to, only to be loved. I think it was Paramahansa Yogananda who said that God craves our love, and is the one thing that makes God happiest in addition to our happiness.

The only thing I can think of to fulfill the need or desire to be in the company of gentle and accepting people, though they are most likely not Hindu, is to attend a Friends' Meeting House. I've read some very nice things about them.
 

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't know about you, but I also don't like religion in politics, so I'd get annoyed with UU's more political evangelism, even though I may support their views.

Or politics in religion! And that includes cliquishness and jockeying for position within a congregation.

I don't think you're in the wrong or being selfish by expecting people to like you. I'm sure you're aware not everyone is going to like you, because some people are like that -- but the guru. The guru!!! Not a sadhguru in my opinion,

This 100^10,000
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
It's karma. That part is tough to admit, but once you do ... well, then it distances you from the presence. Next lifetime, maybe later in this lifetime. Have you tried the sanatan style temples like the one out on 5th in Richmond, or the MahaLakshmi one off Fraser. Maybe they would be close enough to what you're used to.
 

ratikala

Istha gosthi
dear gaura priya ,

I am so sorry to hear of your sadness , and even more sad to hear of the terible insencitivity of so called devotees this is utterly shamefull .

from what I have read in your posts you have amased me that one so young is so devoted and so well read , it shows your deep love , any guru worth his salt should also see this and make an effort at least to undestand your circumstances .

you may no longer feel welcome in that temple which is teribly sad especialy for one who has been so devoted and offered so much serva , but do not worry things have a strange way of working themselves out another oppertunity will occur . the sadest thing is that we do need association , but not bad association so for now please accept me as a god sister as I would be more than happy to serve along side such a devoted soul .

I can only say one more thing if krsna wants your service he will make a new oppertunity for you , and I see no reason why he would shun the love of a devote with such a large heart , and should anyone ever say such insencitive things to you again remember this and you will laugh inside , how many times have you heard it taught that...."we are not this body" !

Vallabhacharya_Jayanti_01.jpg


this is one of my favorite pictures srinathji hugging valabacharia , .....just to remind you that krsna never deserts his devotees :bow:

with much love to my young gopi sister :namaste
 
Vanakkam,

Mens didn't made you what you are, women didn't made you what you are, your parents, family, not even yourself made you. It's God.
And God didn't made any mistake to make you as you are. It is a gift, because you are stronger and you are becoming stronger.
People that tell you what you are, aren't, should be fail to see the work of God around them, such persons aren't far on the spiritual path, such persons should not be called Guru also. Take God's hand and stand up above all judgements, by the strenght of your Sadhana nothing will stop you. Your devotion is toward God, not toward mens and womens.
Make a temple in your body, make a temple in your house...And stand up before God and say proudly: "I am your devotee, I am the way you made me, I only need you"
God never let go of the faithful devotees that seek Him. I know when I'm alone, I look around me, I look at my altar, I look outside and inside myself and smile: "Ah Lord Shiva, there you are !"

Aum Namah Shivaya

That's so nice. I am so glad that you have inner strength and wisdom that empowers you to love God amidst any circumstances. I suppose I should spruce up my altar from its simpler furnishings to something more extravagant to keep me company.

In our Vaishnava story of Sri Prahlada Maharaja and Narasinghadeva (an incarnation of God in His strength and power), Sri Narasingha teaches me that God is everywhere, even in a pillar or in one's own home, and God will always protect His devotee, who loves Him much.

Perhaps I need a little more faith, a little more shraddha. I know in my community, there are lots of the youth and young adults who grew up with the religion, and only come during festivals, or come and have darshana instead during off times. I perhaps should only come during off times in the week instead. And I will definitely refurbish my altar at home.
 
Gaura, sweet soul, I am so sorry you are going through this; I truly am.

Thank you. I have been active at that temple for years, so it hurts quite a bit. But the good Lawd knows that no one is really perfect, save the pure saints and devotees of God.

But if the environment is hurtful, and it sounds like it certainly is, why torture oneself and try to "force the issue" of making oneself continue in uncomfortable company. I'm not passing judgment on the other people, but some situations are not suited to everyone.

No one needs to account to or explain anything to anyone except themselves. Not even to God. God doesn't want an explanation or to be accounted to, only to be loved. I think it was Paramahansa Yogananda who said that God craves our love, and is the one thing that makes God happiest in addition to our happiness.

Yes, it can be difficult to practice spirituality alone. I suppose that e-sangha is probably a newer thing, since it adds a new element to what it means to take association with like-minded individuals, yet without the need to meet together. We all come from different countries and different cities or towns, and yet we can all take darshana of each other!

Its only downfall for me, is that interpersonal appreciation. Being able to share meals, worship together, etc. That is something that would be lovely if possible!

I guess I began to feel that it was like a slave going back to its master continuously, even if the master is not the best and most kind person. Why should I take association when people continually see me as freaky?

The only thing I can think of to fulfill the need or desire to be in the company of gentle and accepting people, though they are most likely not Hindu, is to attend a Friends' Meeting House. I've read some very nice things about them.

I'm glad that you're thinking of going. The Religious Society of Friends seem like a goodly people.
 
It's karma. That part is tough to admit, but once you do ... well, then it distances you from the presence. Next lifetime, maybe later in this lifetime. Have you tried the sanatan style temples like the one out on 5th in Richmond, or the MahaLakshmi one off Fraser. Maybe they would be close enough to what you're used to.

Yes, I admit that whatever most horrible thing I've done in the past, is giving me my environment for this present. It's always harder to practice without association of other Vaishnavas though.

"The verdict of all revealed scriptures is that by even a moment's association with a pure devotee, one can attain all success." -- Sri Chaitanya-charitamrta, 2.22.54

Maybe next lifetime I will have a better birth. Maybe later in this lifetime I will find a more harmonious arrangement, Krishna willing. I have never been to the temple on No. 5 Road... maybe I will visit them this coming week. We also apparently have Kabir Panthis (followers of Kabir) here in my province, but I don't think they have any programs at the moment.

I may just also go my temple during off times. I can take darshana of the Deities during the weekday without necessarily having to deal with others. Inasmuch as association is not the best in my situation, I should still try to see the Deities once in a while.
 
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Twilight

Member
Sorry to hear you are feeling like this.

This just goes to prove that being a devotee is a learning curve and even those who follow all the regulative principles and believe themselves to be well on the way to self-realization are far from it. If you can, continue to use the temple as usual for you. Treat everyone with the kindness and respect that you usually would and perhaps, in the long run, you will help them on their path to Krishna. Let them see your devotion is not marred by their ignorance. We are all spirit and things such as gender, which are purely mundane, should not be of importance.

If you continue attending temple remember that you have people, including me, 'standing by your side' as it were. I hope your situation soon improves. :group:
 
you may no longer feel welcome in that temple which is teribly sad especialy for one who has been so devoted and offered so much serva , but do not worry things have a strange way of working themselves out another oppertunity will occur . the sadest thing is that we do need association , but not bad association so for now please accept me as a god sister as I would be more than happy to serve along side such a devoted soul .

Thank you so much for your empathy and support. But there are many devotees that I know that do not like the temple atmosphere, and prefer to practice Vaishnava Dharma in their own home instead.

It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the fact that the religion speaks of sadhu-sangha as the highest. Vaishnava association is the most important, especially with bhakti.

"The thoughts of My pure devotees dwell in Me, their lives are surrendered to Me, and they derive great satisfaction and bliss enlightening one another and conversing about Me."-- Bhagavad-gita, 10.9

I can only say one more thing if krsna wants your service he will make a new oppertunity for you , and I see no reason why he would shun the love of a devote with such a large heart , and should anyone ever say such insencitive things to you again remember this and you will laugh inside , how many times have you heard it taught that...."we are not this body" !

"Oh, I'm spirit soul, eternally in bliss,
Knowledge and ever un-ending happiness!
Chanting 'Hare Krishna,' my life will be sublime!
I just need to remember this all of the time.

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna,
Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare,
Hare Rama, Hare Rama,
Rama Rama, Hare Hare!
"

That's a children's song I learned off the other gurukulis (second-generation ISKCONites). I used to sing this all the time, lol.

I guess it was difficult for me to fathom how people would say that we should not focus on one's body, while someone is focussed on mine. A friend gave me a message regarding this whole context, about Bhakti Tirtha Swami. If you don't know, Bhakti Tirtha Swami was a disciple of Srila Prabhupada, and as far as I know, the first black Vaishnava guru. Bhakti Tirtha Swami was complaining to Srila Prabhupada that many devotees were having problems with him because he was black.

09.jpg


Srila Prabhupada responded, "That is their nonsense. And if you're disturbed because they see you in that way, then you are also nonsense." In a way, Bhaktivedanta Swami thought that if people are disturbed from us on a superficial level, then that is their problem. If one takes that superficiality too personally, then one can also be disturbed.

I suppose one could reject that statement, but it certainly made His Holiness Bhakti Tirtha Swami into a fine guru, who brought Vaishnavism to Africa, and who left his body not too long ago.

this is one of my favorite pictures srinathji hugging valabacharia , .....just to remind you that krsna never deserts his devotees :bow:

Thank you so much, Ratikala didi; I really appreciate it. I love Sri Vallabhacharya's mood of devotion to Sri Nathaji. If only I could learn more about His pure sentiments to Krishna!

Thank you, mataji. I really appreciate your guidance and devotion so much!

Haribol.
 
Sorry to hear you are feeling like this.

This just goes to prove that being a devotee is a learning curve and even those who follow all the regulative principles and believe themselves to be well on the way to self-realization are far from it. If you can, continue to use the temple as usual for you. Treat everyone with the kindness and respect that you usually would and perhaps, in the long run, you will help them on their path to Krishna. Let them see your devotion is not marred by their ignorance. We are all spirit and things such as gender, which are purely mundane, should not be of importance.

If you continue attending temple remember that you have people, including me, 'standing by your side' as it were. I hope your situation soon improves. :group:

Thank you so much. I do have a select few friends there, and even when not all are accepting, there are one or two that I can still converse with without having to falsify even a smile. I think I may just move my visits from Sunday feast to either the morning program once a week, or darshana visits during the weekdays.

Thank you, didi, for your concern. I still appreciate a few devotees, the temple, Srila Prabhupad, and Srila Sridhar Maharaj. I suppose that the 'other' devotees should be the least of my concern, but due to my own false ego, I've made a mountain out of a mole hill. I should only need even the slightest association with those who are favourable to me, and forego that which is unfavourable.

Thanks again. Haribol!
 

Maija

Active Member
Hare Krsna Gaura!
This will be short, im at work- but its a sobering moment to realize there is no religious community free from judgemental characters. what happened in your community could have happened anywhere- your family and true friends have been loving because they are educated on the subject and know your history- certainly anyone who took the time would feel the same way. often when people shun or shame us it we dont speak out, if we did many others would stand with you. dont tolerate this, remind them of Krsna's love for everyone.
Dont change your faith or beliefs because of them, follow your heart and think of your love for Krsna, He doesnt require you put labels on yourself but just live with a pure heart for Him
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I think its important to realise this isn't just a temple discrimination thing, but also reflects society. Temples, in many ways, are just cross-sections of society in general. Indeed, what you have found at the temple may be far more tolerant that general society is.

Part of the problem there is that the people know your history.
 

Maija

Active Member
Thank you so much. I do have a select few friends there, and even when not all are accepting, there are one or two that I can still converse with without having to falsify even a smile. I think I may just move my visits from Sunday feast to either the morning program once a week, or darshana visits during the weekdays.

Thank you, didi, for your concern. I still appreciate a few devotees, the temple, Srila Prabhupad, and Srila Sridhar Maharaj. I suppose that the 'other' devotees should be the least of my concern, but due to my own false ego, I've made a mountain out of a mole hill. I should only need even the slightest association with those who are favourable to me, and forego that which is unfavourable.

Thanks again. Haribol!
i agree especially with your last statement. Devotee friends are a sweet blessing, you only need a few and they are like a sweet single rose- eventually you'll get that beautiful bouquet of a sangha you so seek. ill be your devotee friend. :)

plus, re: returning to Christianity- i think at this point you have cultivated such a love for Prabhupad, the bg, guru shishya system as well as love for Sri Krsna that youd find much lacking not to mention your previous beliefs looked down on. You could be leaving only to be welcomed by ppl who would view transgender ppl the same way. Accept that you dont need ppl to agree to your sweetness and beauty inside and out to recognize it yourself.
 
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ratikala

Istha gosthi
haribol gaura didi , :namaste
Thank you so much for your empathy and support. But there are many devotees that I know that do not like the temple atmosphere, and prefer to practice Vaishnava Dharma in their own home instead.

it is sad this seems to happen in some temples , why ? I think it is krsnas test to us ,
will we learn to overlook human frailties , and will we be strong enough to hold on regardless , he is strengthening us .

if there are a few people feeling like this , prehaps you sould start some home satsang programs this would be very nice .

It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the fact that the religion speaks of sadhu-sangha as the highest. Vaishnava association is the most important, especially with bhakti.
There have been times when I have also asked these questions and it is true that good association is very important , but if there is no 'good' association then you do not have to tollerate ignorance if it is too hurtfull there is no point .

"The thoughts of My pure devotees dwell in Me, their lives are surrendered to Me, and they derive great satisfaction and bliss enlightening one another and conversing about Me."-- Bhagavad-gita, 10.9
there was on more than one occasion times when I was so appauled by the behavior of so called higher devotees that I nearly got up and walked out in total disgust thinking take me from this un holy place , but a little whisper inside me said you will not leave us , who will help put us to bed , who will arange our shrine , and you will not leave us to go without your love so in the end I learnt to focus only on the good in people and to forgive them their inadequacies . I didnt want my service tainted by my dissatisfaction with others so the descision was to egnore the behavior of children ...."forgive them lord they know not what they do" .


one of my favorite verses is .....

"one who is equal to freinds and enimies who is equipoised in honour and dishonour , heat and cold , happiness and distress , fame and imfamy , who is allways free from contaminating association , who is silent and satisfied with anything , who doesnot care for any residence , who is fixed in knowledge and engaged in devotional service , such a person is very dear to me " B.G. ch 12 .. v 18 .

"Oh, I'm spirit soul, eternally in bliss,
Knowledge and ever un-ending happiness!
Chanting 'Hare Krishna,' my life will be sublime!
I just need to remember this all of the time.

Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna,
Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare,
Hare Rama, Hare Rama,
Rama Rama, Hare Hare!
"

That's a children's song I learned off the other gurukulis (second-generation ISKCONites). I used to sing this all the time, lol.
so beautifull in its simplicity , but it also needs to be taught that whilst we might rise above all enjoying bliss that one should also remember "to be as humble as a blade of grass , more forbearing than a tree , ......." and never to trample upon the sencitivities of another devotee
I guess it was difficult for me to fathom how people would say that we should not focus on one's body, while someone is focussed on mine. A friend gave me a message regarding this whole context, about Bhakti Tirtha Swami. If you don't know, Bhakti Tirtha Swami was a disciple of Srila Prabhupada, and as far as I know, the first black Vaishnava guru. Bhakti Tirtha Swami was complaining to Srila Prabhupada that many devotees were having problems with him because he was black.

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Srila Prabhupada responded, "That is their nonsense. And if you're disturbed because they see you in that way, then you are also nonsense." In a way, Bhaktivedanta Swami thought that if people are disturbed from us on a superficial level, then that is their problem. If one takes that superficiality too personally, then one can also be disturbed.
Ha this is so typical of srila prabhupada , never minces his words :)
he hits hard but he can he is guru , he hits with love .


I suppose one could reject that statement, but it certainly made His Holiness Bhakti Tirtha Swami into a fine guru, who brought Vaishnavism to Africa, and who left his body not too long ago.
Ahh with those tough words come many blessings :)
Thank you so much, Ratikala didi; I really appreciate it. I love Sri Vallabhacharya's mood of devotion to Sri Nathaji. If only I could learn more about His pure sentiments to Krishna!
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this is the most close to the first picture I saw and fell in love with


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and here srinath ji accepts the offerings of the brijvasi's

valabacharia is also krsna as chaitanya is krsna in the gise of a devotee , simmilarly mahaprabu ji came to give the loving service of krsna to the decendants of the original brijvasi's , as I understand it the devotion to srinathji is pure loving serva , (to many used to worship this is a difficult understanding )... srinath ji is accepting the love of his pure devotees so he is to me very loving very mercifull and very forgiving of our idiosyncracies , I will find you the title of a very sweet book , you may be able to find it then you can read many beautifull stories :bow:


sri krsna sharinam mamah :bow:
 
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