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Hinduism and Christianity

sayak83

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
omega2xx said:
I know it from the Bible. If the Bible is true, then you only think you know it from spiritual revelation and meditation. IOW you believe it because you want to believe it. Nothing wrong with that.

It is spiritually illogical to use 2 sets of Scriptures that contradict each other. Both can't be right.
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yes, and the bible isn't. Next?
 
Lorgar-Aurelian

Lorgar-Aurelian

Active Member
RedDragon94 said:
Yes, the problem I have is you think your worldview is the only legitimate one and therefore you need to spread it.
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Dragon I think you are forgetting something here. You are a dragon. You can just breath fire on them and call it good. Oh and You should let me ride you into combat so that we can spread the word of the chaos gods. This is the best plan.

Though honestly people who insist on being right are everywhere. After all the most pervasive lie ever told is the one people tell themselves every day. That they are right and they alone are right.
 
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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
RedDragon94 said:
I can't answer something that I believe is based on an assumption rather than evidence. You assume that there is one based on what the Bible says, maybe not even on what the Bible says. The fact that there are more religions that teach there is no hell is evidence that there probably isn't a literal hell.
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The English word Hell is definitely mentioned in KJV Scripture.
When the word Gehenna was translated into King James' English as hell or hellfire, then that is where flames entered the Bible's picture.
The old Hebrews believed the dead just sleep, Not burn - Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, the Bible's hell is a literal hell, but definitely Not a burning hell, rather it is just mankind's temporary grave.
According to Scripture, the day righteous Jesus' died he went to biblical hell - Acts of the Apostles 2:27
Since Jesus' taught unconscious sleep in death, then biblical hell is the grave for the sleeping dead - John 11:12-14
The grave (Bible hell) comes to a final end according to Revelation 20:13-14, so biblical hell is literal but just the literal grave until Resurrection Day when the grave will be No more.
 
RedDragon94

RedDragon94

Love everyone, meditate often
Lorgar-Aurelian said:
Dragon I think you are forgetting something here. You are a dragon. You can just breath fire on them and call it good. Oh and You should let me ride you into combat so that we can spread the word of the chaos gods. This is the best plan.

Though honestly people who insist on being right are everywhere. After all the most pervasive lie ever told is the one people tell themselves every day. That they are right and they alone are right.
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Right, you just want them to be at peace though and quit shoving it down people's throats. Thanks for being a friend.
 
RedDragon94

RedDragon94

Love everyone, meditate often
URAVIP2ME said:
The English word Hell is definitely mentioned in KJV Scripture.
When the word Gehenna was translated into King James' English as hell or hellfire, then that is where flames entered the Bible's picture.
The old Hebrews believed the dead just sleep, Not burn - Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, the Bible's hell is a literal hell, but definitely Not a burning hell, rather it is just mankind's temporary grave.
According to Scripture, the day righteous Jesus' died he went to biblical hell - Acts of the Apostles 2:27
Since Jesus' taught unconscious sleep in death, then biblical hell is the grave for the sleeping dead - John 11:12-14
The grave (Bible hell) comes to a final end according to Revelation 20:13-14, so biblical hell is literal but just the literal grave until Resurrection Day when the grave will be No more.
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Hmm interesting. So Jesus was or was not dead when he died on the cross?
 
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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
RedDragon94 said:
Hmm interesting. So Jesus was or was not dead when he died on the cross?
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Since Jesus taught 'sleep in death ' (John 11:11-14) then the day Jesus' died he was in an unconscious sleeping state until God later resurrected the dead Jesus out of the grave, for the dead know nothing - Ecclesiastes 9:5
 
arthra

arthra

Baha'i
As to Christianity and Hinduism.. What I learned many years ago is the similarities between the Bhakti devotional attitude expressed in the Bhagavad Gita with the Gospel of John ...particularly the fourteenth chapter. Such verses as follows:

I am alike for all! I know not hate,
I know not favour! What is made is Mine!
But them that worship Me with love, I love;
They are in Me, and I in them!

(Hindu, Bhagavad Gita Chapter Nine (Edwin Arnold tr))



14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

(King James Bible, John)


~ Gospel of John

I recall attending a devotional at the church I used to attend as a child and reading some devotional passage from the Gita... The hearers believed it was from the Gospel. So I've seen from personal experience how close the Gospel and the Gita are.

There's also a book by a Catholic priest which I would recommend called The Vedic Experience

The Vedic Experience. Mantramañjari.
 
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omega2xx

Well-Known Member
RedDragon94 said:
Yes, the problem I have is you think your worldview is the only legitimate one and therefore you need to spread it.
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I think my religious view is the only correct one. This is a forum, forums discuss things. It is not about spreading my view. Are you here to spread your world view?
 
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whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
sayak83 said:
Recently, a podcast show was aired where the leader of a Hindu association in UK was in a discussion/debate with a Christian apologist who was claiming the superiority of Christianity and Jesus over other world religions and religious figures (here Krishna specifically). The discussion was a civil one, but I do not think that Dipen did a good job in articulating the ideas driving Hinduism that makes it distinctive. Watch the episode here:-

Unbelievable? Krishna, Christ and Hinduism debate – Ken Samples and Dipen Rajyaguru : Saturday 04 March 2017 2:30:00 pm - Premier Christian Radio

My own preliminary views on the matter that I posted in the comments might be useful to kickstart a discussion here. So here they are:-

I am a practicing Hindu. I personally found the above discussing a bit scattered in terms of content. After carefully looking at Christianity over a course of 6-7 years (I went to Bible study circle out of interest with a group of my Christian friends), I would have to say that Christianity does not stand up well against either Hinduism or Buddhism. I would mention certain basic points:-
1) No eternal Hell:-Firstly Hinduism does not believe in the concept of eternal Hell. While the concept of the ultimate state of existence, moksha, differs a bit between the schools, most agree that all beings attain it over the course of their (multiple) lifetimes.

2) No place for original sin:- Hinduism does not believe that there has been any alienation between the world and its material condition and God (Brahman). The world is not not fallen, and humans are not alienated from God. This world of shape and form retain its original nature as the aesthetic expression of creativity of Brahman (lila) and will never lose it.

3) Origin of Suffering:- Some beings, over the course of their many lifetimes, temporarily becomes too enamored with the moment-by-moment unfolding of this world and forget that they are more than changeable, mortal selves that is their outer form. This forgetting causes them to assess their condition differently than they would have if they remembered their correct nature( as part of Brahman connected to the world of shape and form as locii of creative action). Actions and decisions they then make out of this ignorance create conditions that put them out of sync with their own true selves and this disjoint is perceived as suffering.

4) Diversity of practice:- Since the problem is forgetfulness of the self and its true relationship with both the world and the transcendental reality, the solution is practices that help one remember them. There are many modes of doing this, and one can latch on to any or multiple combinations.

a)The theistic strands do this by love and worship of God or Gods (Bhakti-Yoga) who are personal manifestations of Brahman who, knowing their own correct nature, seek to aid more forgetful beings in their own path to realization. That is the nature of Gita, where Krishna instructs Arjuna in this vein. Forms of Mahayana and Pure Land Buddhism are also of this nature.

b) Meditative strands where, instead of building a loving relationship with a God, one looks within oneself through meditation and self reflection (yoga) to uncover one's true nature as Atman who is non-different from Brahman. The Upanisads encapsulate this insight while the Yoga texts describe the disciplines by which one achieves this. It is to be noted that Buddhist meditation practices are essentially of this vein though there are differences between Hindu-s and Buddhist on what is the nature of the thing that is uncovered by this. Most renouncers (sannyasins) fall in this category.

c) Analytical methods whereby one uncovers the true nature of the world and the self through rational inquiry and philosophical and scientific investigation (Anviksiki). A very very important strand of classical and medieval Hinduism, these include the logical and epistemic investigation of realist and rationalist Nyaya school, the ontology and metaphysical investigation of atomistic Vaisesika school and the investigation of language and meaning by Mimansa school. An Indian Hindu will be practicing Anviksiki if he is in an academic discipline and his/her toil and effort in uncovering philosophical, mathematical, linguistic or mathematical knowledge would ideally be part of his yoga within Hinduism.

d) Uncovering oneself through acting in the world (Karma-Yoga). Emphasized in the Gita, this method of how to act in the world so that it produces fruits of enlightenment is the subject matter of dharma and constitute the largest fraction of Hindu texts. They span principles of ethical action(the epic literature, the Dharmashastras), principles of politics and wealth acquisition (Arthshastra, Shantiparva in Mahabharata etc.) principles of cultural refinement, art and aesthetic (Natyashastra) and principles of lovemaking, family duties and filial relationships (Grihya-sutras, Kama-sutra etc.) While the principles are fixed, their application in the world changes as conditions of the world change. Hence texts in this subcategory continues to written in every age by the masters. Thus, the writings of Gandhi form as much a part of Dharmashastra texts as more ancient writings.

While individuals and schools focus on different aspects of the four categories of enlightenment activities discussed above. However, a dharmic society as a whole is expected to pay equal emphasis in all four, and it is believed that all beings participate in all of the above through their multiple lifetimes.

That's an incomplete gist. The corpus of texts and associated disciplines is so vast that no Hindu is expected to know or master all. So no Hindu can present a complete picture and one needs to talk to many to get a sense of the ecosystem of the Hindu worldview.

Comments? Impressions?
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In Christianity, salvation is wrought in the righteousness of God and love is wrought in the love of God. That is better than pulling oneself up by one's bootstraps

A righteousness wrought in God is just better. As Jonah said 'Salvation is of the Lord'

Hosea and his family, a portrait of grace
 
sayak83

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
whirlingmerc said:
In Christianity, salvation is wrought in the righteousness of God and love is wrought in the love of God. That is better than pulling oneself up by one's bootstraps

A righteousness wrought in God is just better. As Jonah said 'Salvation is of the Lord'

Hosea and his family, a portrait of grace
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In Hinduism, human's are not damned. So there is no need to be saved. They simply lack correct knowledge, and hence they need to learn it. One can argue about which picture is true (if any), but the differences explain the different thrusts of the two worldviews.
 
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whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
sayak83 said:
In Hinduism, human's are not damned. So there is no need to be saved. They simply lack correct knowledge, and hence they need to learn it. One can argue about which picture is true (if any), but the differences explain the different thrusts of the two worldviews.
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Some say the focus of the religious that came out of India concern the problem of human suffering. Would you say that's true?
 
sayak83

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
whirlingmerc said:
Some say the focus of the religious that came out of India concern the problem of human suffering. Would you say that's true?
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For Buddhism that is true. Hinduism is primarily concerned with removing ignorance which it considers the root of all problems including suffering. It is called "knowing that by which all else is known."
 
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