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Have you ever found a single bug in Islam?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Farrukh, Mar 7, 2014.

  1. Sha'irullah

    Sha'irullah رسول الآلهة

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    Many, unscientific claims about geography, cosmology, astrology, morality, theology and history.
    The issue though is that some are fundamentals in the faith
     
  2. Penumbra

    Penumbra Veteran Member
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    The whole thing, basically. The presentation of it did absolutely nothing positive for me.

    The religion appears to be about basically blind obedience, total submission of thought and action to what I consider to be a very man-made idea. It's so elementary, like "believe this, and do these things, and go to paradise" and "fail to believe this, and do these things, and be tortured forever". The Qur'an comes off as very tribalistic, the way it talks about unbelievers as though they are some unified block of people that have bad traits rather than what they actually are- the rest of the diverse world. I simply have no reason to believe that a religion like Islam is true, and view it as a very harmful religion, created by men.

    And for Islam in practice, most Islamic countries get internationally ranked among the lowest countries for gender equality (relating to economic participation, political influence, education, health), and many of them have laws against homosexuality with punishments ranging from imprisonment up to death. Most of the extremely sexist things I've seen written on this forum were by Muslims from the Middle East. Some other Muslims here have been better about that, but the worst statements I've seen have been from religious Muslims, and their statements are basically just supporting the Qur'an.

    The Qur'an has a verse for beating wives although people debate about the translation, and talks about women getting half inheritance, and women counting as half an eye witness compared to a man. One of the Hadiths says that most of the people in hell are women (especially women that are ungrateful), and another Hadith also says that women count as half an eye witness due to deficiency of mind.

    And the amount of detailed violent and sadistic threats of hell for unbelievers where it talks excitedly about the tortures just pushes the whole thing into really unethical territory. And so much tribalism, just literally all over the place. I mean, just a few samples:

    Violent threats pop up in hundreds of verses throughout the book, sometimes for unbelievers and sometimes for people that do bad things. Such detail too- burning skins being replaced for more agony, beating with maces, boiling water, scalding molten brass, chains, yokes around the necks, dragged on faces.

    Really, really barbaric stuff, man.
     
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  3. Truthisnotyourenemy

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    Very funny.
    Yes can communicate via basic sounds, but they don't talk like humans as the Koran quotes them:


    027.018
    YUSUFALI: At length, when they came to a (lowly) valley of ants, one of the ants said: "O ye ants, get into your habitations, lest Solomon and his hosts crush you (under foot) without knowing it."

    The point I made was that an ant managed to recognize Solomon and his army as they approached! :D
    And it seems the other ants were aware of who he was.

    Which is obviously ridiculous. I once asked a Muslim how can an ant recognise a human approaching it from a distance. He responded by saying Solomon was famous!!:facepalm:
     
    #183 Truthisnotyourenemy, Mar 9, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2014
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  4. Ingledsva

    Ingledsva HEATHEN ALASKAN

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    The horrors of Sharia Law are from man - not God!



    *
     
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  5. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    No it isn't a matter of training,but it is the amazing creation of God.

    Do you think that you can sniff the same as dogs if you are well trained ?

    Ignorance is different than stupidity and i think it is stupid to think that ignorance means stupid.

    It was believed that ants were communicating by touching their antennas and not by producing sounds and only in the year 2009 it was discovered that ants speak by sound.

    Old belief

    Ants communicate (talk to each other) by touching each other with their antennae
    Reference: Ants

    Recent belief

    [youtube]AkZ56u3ZUk8[/youtube]
    What Ants Are Saying - YouTube
     
  6. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    I ain't that kind of person to believe in stupid fatwas.

    Some scholars say disbelievers should be killed,does that mean that they are correct.
    If the scholar is an evil person and interpret the verses for his own evil purposes,should we then listen to his fatwas.

    I am not inventing from my own mind but the verse is very clear talking about immigrants women except if you want to pretend of not seeing that word.

    O you who have believed, when the believing women come to you as emigrants

    I ain't telling you that for you to believe,but i only inform you what i know and i don't care of what you want to believe.


    Good guy.
     
  7. technomage

    technomage Finding my own way

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    Does that mean that you disregard all fatwas as stupid, or that you decide which ones are stupid and which ones are not?
     
  8. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    I use my mind.

    For example some scholars say music is harram and their evidence for that is one hadith while the quran never mentioned it,so how it is harram and neglected by the quran.

    I listen to music and i don't believe it to be harram.
     
  9. technomage

    technomage Finding my own way

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    I can agree with this. While I have no knowledge of any God, I am firmly persuaded that if God exists, He gave us our minds to use--to think, to evaluate, and to choose wisely to the best of our ability.
     
  10. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    No,not because he was famous,but just have a look to the verse before it

    And gathered for Solomon were his soldiers of the jinn and men and birds, and they were [marching] in rows.(27:17)

    Jinn is known to have the ability of shapeshifting by the power of possessing any physical body,be it human or insect.

    Until, when they came upon the valley of the ants, an ant said, "O ants, enter your dwellings that you not be crushed by Solomon and his soldiers while they perceive not." (27:18)

    Study shows that ants talk with each other,so i think your point here is that the quran should say that the ant said "zeezooozeezazezazee"
     
  11. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    You are ignoring the fact that it was already known that ants communicated amoungst themselves...

    You are merely nit picking the way they communicate with out addressing how they were understood by Solomon.
     
  12. shawn001

    shawn001 Well-Known Member

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    Ants mainly communicate by chemical signalling for the most part.



    Skip the Ants, though, I am wondering how Adam and Eve were 90 feet tall, twice as tall as T-REX?
     
  13. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    The quran didn't mention that humans were made giants in ancient times.
     
  14. Truthisnotyourenemy

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    The claim an ant recognised Solomon is just absurd.
    Ants don't talk like humans as the Koran quotes, they have simple noises for basic commands, they don't have a unique sound for Solomons' name!!?:facepalm:
    To claim such nonsense as a miracle is just embarrassing.
     
  15. technomage

    technomage Finding my own way

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    The Hadith does, stating that the Prophet directly said this thing: "The Prophet said, "Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall." Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 55, Number 543. There are three other references in the Hadith as well.
     
  16. Pastek

    Pastek Sunni muslim

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    I think FearGod is a Quranist as he posted in this section many times in the Islamic DIR.
     
  17. technomage

    technomage Finding my own way

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    Quranist = only accepts the Quran, while rejecting Hadith?

    If that is the case, then thank you for the clarification. I am new to the forum, and had not seen FearGod's statements to that effect.
     
  18. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    It is noise to you but to the ants it has a meaning.

    How the ants learned those words of commands ?

    We can never know that the ants produce any sound if we don't have the sensitive microphones,so people in the 7th century should be more surprised than you to believe that the ants can talk or produce any kind of sound and even the prophet will find it hard to be believed but he is only a messenger,he has to pass the message as he received it.
     
  19. Pastek

    Pastek Sunni muslim

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    I can't say they reject them all but i think they reject many of them.
    They have a section in the Islamic DIR.
     
  20. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

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    Oh, come'on, FearGod. :eek: :tsk:

    You expect us to believe in a shapeshifting, smoke-made jinns to be more believable than talking birds or insects?

    Can you even prove that jinns exist? :confused:

    :sorry1: Sorry, man. But jinns is even more far-fetched than humans and animals can communicate like you and I can.

    The Muslims' belief in the jinns, is the by-product in pre-Islamic Arabic superstitions and fables. That's the origin of the jinns, from pre-Isalmic fairytales, no more believable than elves, ghouls and goblins.

    I have seen no evidences of jinns, except in make-believe stories and fairytales, of which is found in the Qur'an.

    I wouldn't dream of saying what you can or cannot believe, but if you are going to say that these ants were actually jinns in ant-form as valid answer to truthisnotyourenemy, then you really shouldn't be surprised when he scoff at your claim.

    As to your quote in 27:17, the verse is distinguishing them as jinns, humans and birds; it doesn't say the humans and birds were jinns that have taken on their forms.

    So your claims that these humans and birds are really jinns - you are reaching - you're trying to change the original context of the verse.

    Likewise, the verse about the Solomon and the ants, doesn't say the ants were really jinns, so you're trying to manipulate the verse to say differently.

    And ants may be able to talk to one another, but I doubt very much they could understand the speech of men, or I doubt very much that people could possibly understand what the ants were saying.

    We know that birds can mimic the sounds and words of men, but they really have no idea what they are saying.
     
    #200 gnostic, Mar 10, 2014
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2014
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