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Gun sales boom during the virus panic.

Yazata

Active Member
People are getting locked and loaded for what?

I'm not purchasing guns, but I already own a firearm.

I think that sales have increased recently because people fear a large scale social breakdown, Mad Max or zombie apocalypse style. They fear the stores being emptied one last time and not restocked. Police no longer showing up for work. 911 calls being answered by a recording. And people around them turning into predators in order to survive.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
If you used human behaviour logic, for a long time humans never had toilet paper.

It is a luxury....and luxuries are what humans think about first, because of the elitist s.o.b. that are causing this situation....as a message to their own inanity, not expressed as inanity in the sciences, as they claim they are super intelligent.

T rump.....American cause factually.....for the history and study of UFO radiation began intently in their country.

How it is actualized in cause and effect messaging.

Science has caused our atmosphere to attack our life....humans know viruses and flu symptoms give you diarrhoea.

Having a lot of toilet paper to the average basic human thinking ability says, so therefore fight over obtaining as much toilet paper as possible.

Trump stated to own verbal diarrhoea.

The natural status of any human feeling threatened is to hoard....we hoard for the winter.

Humans are therefore afraid because ICE melted.

Science tried to claim we began from a dinosaur when no ICE existed...then the Ice Age.……...all conscious subliminal messages that humans act upon in a shared conscious ideal. AI effect.

Congratulations scientists.
 

Shad

Veteran Member
So you linked one report in which police will not arrest people for NON-VIOLENT crimes. Petty theft. Shopflifting.

Ergo not enforcing laws.

But I can see your concern in stolen automobiles. Some of those crimes involve violent confrontation. However, theft, burglary, prostitution and vandalism do not.

Those are still crimes. If my house is tagged I want more than a promissory note all based on the word of a criminal.... who tagged my house.

That's one city.

Coronavirus in Florida latest: inmates released, beach closing, free buses
Coronavirus leads some overseas prisons to release inmates; Rikers, other US prisons consider the same
Cities in the US move to lower inmate populations as coronavirus fears grow - CNN
Cuyahoga County Jail inmates released as coronavirus spreads


Do you have more evidence that governments are requiring that people have to take the law in their own hands?

The right of defense already exists with or without government action or inaction. My point was about protecting the individual and their property not vigilante justice. If cops are not going to show up for non-violent crimes that means an individual must protect their own homes more than normally.
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
Ergo not enforcing laws.



Those are still crimes. If my house is tagged I want more than a promissory note all based on the word of a criminal.... who tagged my house.



Coronavirus in Florida latest: inmates released, beach closing, free buses
Coronavirus leads some overseas prisons to release inmates; Rikers, other US prisons consider the same
Cities in the US move to lower inmate populations as coronavirus fears grow - CNN
Cuyahoga County Jail inmates released as coronavirus spreads




The right of defense already exists with or without government action or inaction. My point was about protecting the individual and their property not vigilante justice. If cops are not going to show up for non-violent crimes that means an individual must protect their own homes more than normally.

Laws are still being enforced.
 

Shad

Veteran Member
Laws are still being enforced.

Not really as they handicap their own ability to enforce laws and punishment for criminal acts iva changing procedure. If my home is robbed but cops do not show because it wasn't violent they lose the chance to gather evidence before major contamination. They will not canvas the neighborhood looking for tips and other witnesses. Only taking a police report is not enforcing laws
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
Not really as they handicap their own ability to enforce laws and punishment for criminal acts iva changing procedure. If my home is robbed but cops do not show because it wasn't violent they lose the chance to gather evidence before major contamination. They will not canvas the neighborhood looking for tips and other witnesses. Only taking a police report is not enforcing laws

I understand your concern but I believe you are overstating what cities are doing. What is happening is that law enforcement officers in those cities are responding to crimes in which another individual's well being is not at risk so they are not arresting them.

In other words, police are responding as normal....before this pandemic......but allowed to exercise discretion in whether or not what they respond to requires an arrest and detainment.

If you are being robbed in your own home......they respond as they would before this pandemic. There is no difference in such a situation.

And yes.....just citing people rather than detaining them is still enforcing the law. The few cities that have enacted a measure of not arresting and detaining individuals for such crimes as prostituttion or other non violent crimes have not seen any increase in crime.

Do you get it now?

Laws are being enforced. Cities are determining that those low level offenders do not need to be detained and imprisoned.

What we do not need at this time is misinformation being spread.
 

Shad

Veteran Member
I understand your concern but I believe you are overstating what cities are doing. What is happening is that law enforcement officers in those cities are responding to crimes in which another individual's well being is not at risk so they are not arresting them.

Taking a police report is not enforcing laws.

In other words, police are responding as normal....before this pandemic......but allowed to exercise discretion in whether or not what they respond to requires an arrest and detainment.

Police are deferring charges. Read the links.

If you are being robbed in your own home......they respond as they would before this pandemic. There is no difference in such a situation.

As per the links it must be violent. Notice my example was not about violence but evidence.

And yes.....just citing people rather than detaining them is still enforcing the law.


How can they cite people they do not know about nor catch? You are not thinking about procedure here.

The few cities that have enacted a measure of not arresting and detaining individuals for such crimes as prostituttion or other non violent crimes have not seen any increase in crime.

Assertion

Do you get it now?

You provided nothing of substance. You merely asserted without thought.

How do you cite someone you do not know? Someone the police do not show up to interact with? Try again

Laws are being enforced.

Nope.

Cities are determining that those low level offenders do not need to be detained and imprisoned.

Cops are not even investigating nor showing up so how do they determine who is a suspect or not? Again another demonstration of you not thinking about your points.

What we do not need at this time is misinformation being spread.

So far you have offered nothing of substance nor even scrutinized your own points. Try again. You seem to think criminals are trust worthy thus are going to show for a citation if the police even know who a suspect is.
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
Coronavirus in Florida latest: inmates released, beach closing, free buses
“These defendants are the lowest public safety risk and were merely sitting in jail because they could not pay the amount to bond out,” Chronister said. “These defendants will still have to answer to the charges against them. It is my hope these individuals will make the most of this opportunity to be with their loved ones, help them prepare, comfort them and quarantine with them.”
Coronavirus leads some overseas prisons to release inmates; Rikers, other US prisons consider the same
“The only way we can possibly keep incarcerated people safe is to release them,” said Justine Olderman, executive director of the advocacy group Bronx Defenders. “The next best thing is to drastically reduce the number of people being held. Neither of those things are being done right now. As public defenders, what we’re actually seeing happen is the opposite, and it is terrifying.”

That article, while at the end had a complaint against releasing violent offenders, didn't state that anyone was doing such a thing.
Cities in the US move to lower inmate populations as coronavirus fears grow - CNN
"The low-level, nonviolent inmates have been released -- either by being placed on probation or by having their bond reduced to a manageable level -- or sentenced to the Ohio Department of Corrections prison."

I'm not bothering with the last link you provided because it was redundant.
 

Shad

Veteran Member
Coronavirus in Florida latest: inmates released, beach closing, free buses
“These defendants are the lowest public safety risk and were merely sitting in jail because they could not pay the amount to bond out,” Chronister said. “These defendants will still have to answer to the charges against them. It is my hope these individuals will make the most of this opportunity to be with their loved ones, help them prepare, comfort them and quarantine with them.”

Inmates are quarantined in jail

“The only way we can possibly keep incarcerated people safe is to release them,” said Justine Olderman, executive director of the advocacy group Bronx Defenders. “The next best thing is to drastically reduce the number of people being held. Neither of those things are being done right now. As public defenders, what we’re actually seeing happen is the opposite, and it is terrifying.”

Public safety is a greater concern than prisoners safety. That is why they are in prison.

That article, while at the end had a complaint against releasing violent offenders, didn't state that anyone was doing such a thing.
Cities in the US move to lower inmate populations as coronavirus fears grow - CNN
"The low-level, nonviolent inmates have been released -- either by being placed on probation or by having their bond reduced to a manageable level -- or sentenced to the Ohio Department of Corrections prison."

Non-violent does not mean not dangerous.
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
Inmates are quarantined in jail


Public safety is a greater concern than prisoners safety. That is why they are in prison.



Non-violent does not mean not dangerous.

You didn't even read the quotes from your own links that I quoted for you.
 
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gnomon

Well-Known Member
Sacramento County Releases Inmates Early To Curb Coronavirus Spread
Jails and prisons are ill-prepared for a coronavirus outbreak, thanks to poor sanitization, overcrowding, and the presence of elderly inmates. To reduce the risks to both inmates and staff—and, ultimately, to people on the outside as well—the Sacramento Superior Court authorized the sheriff's office to release inmates with fewer than 30 days left on their sentence.

A group of 31 prosecutors associated with Fair and Justice Prosecution released a joint statement this week asking local governments to adopt cite-and-release policies for low-level offenses, to release individuals currently jailed merely for technical violations or because they can't afford bail, to release non-dangerous inmates who are vulnerable to coronavirus or are within six months of the completion of their sentence, to ensure better medical care and contact with families and attorneys, and to reduce immigration enforcement, especially near medical centers.
Philly DA Larry Krasner urges for early release of low-risk prisoners to prevent spread of COVID-19
philly-da-larry-krasner-urges-for-early-release-of-low-risk-prisoners-to-prevent-spread-of-covid-19

– People who have already served their minimum sentence and are eligible for parole

– People who are serving their sentence and are worthy of early parole

– People who are elderly, ill, and/or infirm

– People who are being held pre-trial for non-violent and misdemeanor offenses simply because they could not afford bail

– People who are good candidates for alternative detention, such as house arrest or GPS monitoring

– Juvenile offenders who are deemed to pose no safety threat to the public


Ohio Releases 28 Low-Level Offenders To Reduce Spread of Coronavirus

edit: No matter how much we disagree.....stay safe. Don't hug a stranger. Or even a relative. Or even your spouse if not doused upon that which kills a louse.
 
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Shad

Veteran Member
You didn't even read the quotes from your own links that I quoted for you.

And I told you citations are not law enforcement. So the quotes mean nothing without looking at how that would work in the justice system. All citations do is place faith in people that are already criminals while bypassing procedure.
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
And I told you citations are not law enforcement. So the quotes mean nothing without looking at how that would work in the justice system. All citations do is place faith in people that are already criminals while bypassing procedure.

Citations are actually actions by law enforcement. Law enforcement officers issue citations regularly.
 
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Shad

Veteran Member
Citations are actually actions by law enforcement.

Nope. Those are just summons to appear not law enforcement.

Law enforcement officers issue citations regularly.

In the form of fines not summons.

You have failed consistently on this thread.

Nope. You just do not think beyond your quotes nor how the system will work.

Say something know.

I have. You just have no response to my points. You merely assume what the police say will work without thought.
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
citation






"Police officers also issue citations for minor offenses, especially for traffic violations. The citation that an officer gives to aviolator states the charge and requires an appearance before a judge on a specified date, subject to punishment for failure toappear. Citations issued by police officers for minor violations are typically only admissible for a criminal action that is basedupon the violation. In most jurisdictions, evidence of an arrest from a citation is not admissible in a civil action based upon the same facts."

A summons is a summon. A summons is issued by a court of law to bring someone in to face justice.

A citation is by law enforcement.

As I've just shown. How do you think people who speed or violate any ordinance show up in court?

They get a citation by a law enforcement officer.

Because that is what they do. Enforce the law. If you run a red light.....you get a citation.

edit: Either way. Stay safe.
 
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