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Featured Guided evolution?

Discussion in 'Science and Religion' started by Eddi, Mar 2, 2021.

  1. Eddi

    Eddi reformed crackpot

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    I am familiar with the idea of "guided evolution"

    That humans are the product of evolution, but that evolution has been "guided" so that intelligent humans ended up being evolved

    The fact of evolution is thus reconciled with the notion that God created humans - that he created us through evolution

    Is this something people believe in?

    It makes sense to me
     
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  2. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    This article is worth a read: Theistic evolution

    As far as "guidance" goes, I would be careful. As Francis Collins notes in his 6 points, the theistic view of evolution is that no supernatural intervention in the processes of nature was required. Furthermore, there is nothing teleological about evolution: it goes on all the time and has no goal. So there is, in my view, something of a question of what "guidance" can mean.

    It seems to me the best way to think of it is that God's laws of nature are such that morally aware beings - in need of help - can arise. They have done so on Earth and may well have done so elsewhere in the universe too.
     
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  3. Altfish

    Altfish Veteran Member

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    Why bring god into it? It makes perfect sense without god.
     
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  4. Regiomontanus

    Regiomontanus άντρας των αστεριών

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    We are the cosmos made conscious.

    You might like this: What is Evolutionary Creation? - Common-questions
     
  5. Regiomontanus

    Regiomontanus άντρας των αστεριών

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    I used to think so too.
     
  6. cOLTER

    cOLTER Well-Known Member

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    Yes! But patterns were inherent in the original life forms. if one frog line didn't make it to humans then others could have.

    Also, the presence of the Cosmic Mind has been stimulating to brain growth for all evolutionary creatures.
     
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  7. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
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    For believers, it eliminates evolution's perceived threat to God.
     
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  8. janesix

    janesix Active Member

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    I believe in orthogenesis. Which means that things evolve for and towards a purpose. That human-like beings are an archetype or pattern that will emerge(as other archetypes and patterns also emerge). I think human type beings are an early stage of some type of beings that are much more advanced than we are.
     
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  9. viole

    viole Metaphysical Naturalist
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    I don't think it makes a lot of sense. If I were God and wanted to create Woman, I would just create Woman, more or less like in literal Genesis.

    For sure, I would not go through the painstaking, inefficient and bloody process, lasting billions of years, leaving 99% of all species down, based on killing the weak, with continuous tweaking, including the deviation of huge asteroids wiping out mammals competitors, together with other calamities, and mass extinctions.

    Too complicated. And immoral. Not in line with an infinite almighty being with a clear goal in mind.

    Ergo, if the God of the Bible existed, I would say that a literal reading of Genesis is the correct one. But since Genesis is obviously factually wrong, we can safely conclude that such God does not exist.

    Ciao

    - viole
     
  10. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Well...
    I think that God has conceived us as perfect beings in His mind but Nature is chaotic, and even if it struggles for perfection, it is the randomness that prevails.
    And that is Evolution.
    I guess because God gave nature freedom.:)
     
  11. Mock Turtle

    Mock Turtle Silent Generation - so don't expect much
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    So all the other primates are just back-ups, in case H. Sapiens failed?

    Both views seem possible to me but it makes more sense to go with the one not requiring a lot of extra stuff as explanation. Since it is just as plausible that this is what has happened.
     
  12. Brian2

    Brian2 Well-Known Member

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    A literal reading is correct and evolution is correct.
     
  13. Brian2

    Brian2 Well-Known Member

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    That perception is in the mind of atheists. A defence of the Bible is necessary.
     
  14. cOLTER

    cOLTER Well-Known Member

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    Primates would have branched off much earlier from our same Lemur ancestors. Plenty of dead ends of kinds that mutated off of lines that continued on.
     
  15. Eddi

    Eddi reformed crackpot

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    I don't think an almighty God could find anything painstaking, or inefficient

    And I doubt that time would matter to such a being, either

    I wouldn't

    Because I would want my humans to come to understand the universe naturalistically

    Hence I would create them through nature, to make a naturalistic account true

    I'd give them an authentic, true backstory: that they evolved from a previous species of ape

    A clear goal in mind?

    Who's to say we humans are what it's all about?

    Maybe God didn't have a "clear goal" to create humans?

    Maybe God just wanted to create nature? To see what happens? And that's enough for him?

    If he's so almighty then why would he need intelligent companionship?

    Would he actually need his ego stroking by adoring worshippers?

    And if he is infinite and almighty he would have no need to be efficient with his time and energies as these would be literally infinite

    And maybe there is a God and evolution is unguided? I think that would actually make more sense than there being a God who guided evolution.

    I can perfectly well imagine a God who on one hand set up a universe to work naturally and with no intervention yet on the other hand wanted civilised beings to emerge
     
  16. Brian2

    Brian2 Well-Known Member

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    With reasons like that, even if the Bible could be read to accommodate evolution, that would mean nothing to you when it came to belief in the God of the Bible.
    And it can be read to accommodate evolution.
    It sounds as if it is not evolution per so which is the problem, but the general problem of evil and suffering.
     
  17. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
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    I'm inclined to believe that there is not only no evidence of guidance in evolution, there is evidence that seems contrary to guidance such as the evolution of threats which could potentially wipe humans out, or the emergence of threats which possibly will wipe humans out at some point.
     
  18. Brian2

    Brian2 Well-Known Member

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    Or maybe an asteroid will hit the earth or aliens might attack or, or........ Thus God cannot exist.
    A creator would have it all under control. And if you say God does not exist because of that then what could be coming as predicted in Revelation will not turn you towards God (as the one who is judging us with plagues etc and so that we see the truth of His word and turn to Him).
    It actually says things will get so bad that He will have to step in and put an end to it.
     
  19. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
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    I still believe in God, I just think God allowed evolution to be a blind process.

    And I doubt that plagues turn us toward God, because they are random and affect believer and unbelievers alike.

    If you wanted to turn kids towards you or your rule in a school you wouldn't randomly discipline them, you would discipline the ones that broke the rules in accordance with the severity of their deviation.

    That's why I in my opinion plagues etc are part of a blind process.

    Although there are other good arguments that evolution is a blind process as well. Such as things that are poorly designed in the human body.
     
  20. Tiberius

    Tiberius Well-Known Member

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    Such a shame that we don't see people who display un-Christian-like behavior being punished more often than people who do behave in the way Jesus instructed.
     
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