God: Trinity or Unity?

[Soapy]

I am discussing unity or trinity of God and the possibility that there might even be none. I again say that OP said nothing about Christianity.

I don’t think you are discussing anything. Read the opening few responses to the OP and you will see that all responders refer to the Christian belief!

What is the point of asking if GOD is a multiple of three, or a unity (?what is that??) and someone responding:
1) They don’t believe in [a] God
2) That there is no God (almost same as point 1)

It’s a pity that the OP poster cannot interject here and state what fuller premise of the question but to my mind the FACT that the OP is concerning a TRINITY of GOD or a UNITY stands to reason the point is about the CHRISTIAN GOD as there is no other religious belief system that profanes itself by claiming an impossible multiplicity (nor similar UNITY) of persons in their GOD.

Simply saying that a belief system professes THREE (or more) INDIVIDUAL, INDEPENDENT, SEPARATE, persons who are EACH A GOD in themselves, is not an aspect of the purpose in the question. The question pertains to three (trinity of) persons AS THE SAME and ONE GOD... (which is a total stupidity.)

Bug worse, inputting ‘NONE’ is not even a relevant point here. The question is EXPLICITLY concerning (the ridiculous, and facile) notion that there may be three persons who are equally and exactly the same ‘HEAD PERSON’ while being ‘persons’ themselves.... And then, a UNITY? A unity presupposes that there were a number of persons (or GODS) who JOINED TOGETHER to claim themselves as ONE GOD... NONE of these are confessions of any faith.

I think maybe the word you are trying to say is:

• NEITHER

In that, I would support you. Yes, ‘GOD’ is neither a THREESOME (trinity) nor a UNITY.

Simply, the premise of the question is false and is in fact a TRICK QUESTION.

‘YHWH IS ONE GOD’.

The Israelites were told to worship YHWH, and YHWH ALONE. This is ECHAD.

Worshipping THREE is not ECHAD!
Worshipping a UNITY is not ECHAD!
Worshipping ONE is ECHAD!

 

[Soapy]

In the concept of Unity. God is One indivisible and undefinable as in the traditional Christian Trinitarian belief.. The dominant Jewish, Islamic and Baha'i view of God.

The Trinitarian view may be awkwardly interpreted as united, but it remains Trinitarian defining God as three persons, and the Son of God, Jesus Christ seated on the right hand of God the Father.

How are you saying that trinity is three - yet only expressing TWO persons (the Father and the Son).

But that’s how trinity fails itself. You rightly point out that only TWO persons were seen (in vision) by Saint Steven) - there was no THIRD PERSON.

And, besides, maybe put more emphasis on the fact that GOD is SEATED on the Throne (a position of POWER and AUTHORITY), but Jesus is STANDING next to him (a position of SUPPORT and PRIVILEGE).

As scriptures states, Jesus Christ was GRANTED to be seated at the right hand of GOD, just as DAVID was GRANTED to be seated at the right hand of the first king of the Israelites, Saul. A position of PRIVILEGE.

 

[shunyadragon]

How are you saying that trinity is three - yet only expressing TWO persons (the Father and the Son).

No three including the Holy Ghost.

But that’s how trinity fails itself. You rightly point out that only TWO persons were seen (in vision) by Saint Steven) - there was no THIRD PERSON.

And, besides, maybe put more emphasis on the fact that GOD is SEATED on the Throne (a position of POWER and AUTHORITY), but Jesus is STANDING next to him (a position of SUPPORT and PRIVILEGE).

As scriptures states, Jesus Christ was GRANTED to be seated at the right hand of GOD, just as DAVID was GRANTED to be seated at the right hand of the first king of the Israelites, Saul. A position of PRIVILEGE.

A very unfortunate anthropomorphic view of God.

 

[Soapy]

No three including the Holy Ghost.



A very unfortunate anthropomorphic view of God.

A very unfortunate but true property of trinity: It always fails itself.

Trinity fails to honour, praise, glorify it’s three person-God at the same time but always rushes in to claim the three are worshipped if only one is worshipped.

Funny how it always fails the Holy Spirit third person ...:

• “I and the Father are one!”
• “Worship the Father alone!”
• “When you pray, say like this: ‘Heavenly Father...!’”
• “I am going to the Father”
• “Father... this means eternal life that they should believe in YOU, the ONLY TRUE GOD... and Jesus Christ... WHOM YOU SENT”
• Stephen, seeing in vision Heaven open, saw ALMIGHTY FOD sat on the throne ... and Jesus Christ STANDING at his right hand!”

Of course there are many many more of these but I guess you get the picture.

It’s also testament to the fallacy of trinity that ALL ALTERATIONS and ADDITIONS to the Holy Scriptures is designed to TRY TO PROVE A TRINITY in the scriptures.

Of course, if trinity were true then there would not need to be ANY ALTERATIONS OR ADDITIONS.

And even when many of these profanities have been pointed out, Trinitarians STILL USE THEM...

Now THAT is desperation!!

 

[shunyadragon]

A very unfortunate but true property of trinity: It always fails itself.

Trinity fails to honour, praise, glorify it’s three person-God at the same time but always rushes in to claim the three are worshipped if only one is worshipped.

Funny how it always fails the Holy Spirit third person ...:

• “I and the Father are one!”
• “Worship the Father alone!”
• “When you pray, say like this: ‘Heavenly Father...!’”
• “I am going to the Father”
• “Father... this means eternal life that they should believe in YOU, the ONLY TRUE GOD... and Jesus Christ... WHOM YOU SENT”
• Stephen, seeing in vision Heaven open, saw ALMIGHTY FOD sat on the throne ... and Jesus Christ STANDING at his right hand!”

Of course there are many many more of these but I guess you get the picture.

It’s also testament to the fallacy of trinity that ALL ALTERATIONS and ADDITIONS to the Holy Scriptures is designed to TRY TO PROVE A TRINITY in the scriptures.

Of course, if trinity were true then there would not need to be ANY ALTERATIONS OR ADDITIONS.

And even when many of these profanities have been pointed out, Trinitarians STILL USE THEM...

Now THAT is desperation!!

I do not believe in the Trinity

 

[Soapy]

I do not believe in the Trinity

Glad to hear it.

 

[Soapy]

I do not believe in the Trinity

I believe:

Almighty God is a SPIRIT Being, the only true deity.

He decided to create a physical world and fill it with living physical beings to worship him.

He did that - and wonderfully so.

This one true God also decided that he wanted a being from within the physical world to rule over the physical world just as he, almighty God, rules over the Spirit world (and by descent, the physical world also, at this time)

Trinity claims that this earthly ruler is to be none other than the SAME ALMIGHTY GOD who decided that an earthly being was to rule over the earth..., does that make sense?

Trinity says that almighty god put flesh on himself and became ‘man’ so he could rule over the very creation he ALREADY RULES OVER...

Trinity implies that almighty God, three persons as one God, tore off one part of himself and enclosed it in flesh.... but didn’t do that.... what????

The ‘what???’ is the conundrum which arises when you ask questions arising from this ridiculous notion that almighty God split off part of himself to rule over what he already rules over yet still claims to be an undividable United (?) Single God.

Ask how an indivisible entity can divide itself and apportion what it has created to itself.... make sense?

Test this: would it make sense that the Spirit ruler of the spirit Heaven created a physical world, earth, and appointed a physical man from the earth to rule over the physical world.

How does scriptures align with this concept:

• “It was made BY ALMIGHTY GOD”
• “It was made FOR HIM (the appointed Righteous man)”
• And he (the appointed man) will rule with appointed sub-kings and priests but will be also a High Priest to the ALMIGHTY GOD.

 

[101G]

Yachid

That's God's Name? or is it "YESHUA"/JESUS? who is the Yachid or the Ordinal First who made man male and female.

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[shunyadragon]

That's God's Name? or is it "YESHUA"/JESUS? who is the Yachid or the Ordinal First who made man male and female.

PICJAG,
101G.

This is only a belief based on a Christian interpretation of scripture, which does not remotely relate to Hebrew Tanakh thousands of years old.

 

[101G]

This is only a belief based on a Christian interpretation of scripture, which does not remotely relate to Hebrew Tanakh thousands of years old.

thanks for the reply, second, it this your interpretation of scripture. did not John 1:3 states, "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made" is this not the Lord JESUS? who is the Ordinal First?

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[cataway]

That's God's Name? or is it "YESHUA"/JESUS? who is the Yachid or the Ordinal First who made man male and female.

PICJAG,
101G.

Strong's Concordance
yachid: only, only one, solitary

 

[101G]

Strong's Concordance
yachid: only, only one, solitary

is that ONE "LORD" who is God or ONE "GOD?".

see your error.

understand God is the H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m. and in the plural, he is H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem').... do you understand the difference?

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[cataway]

is that ONE "LORD" who is God or ONE "GOD?".

see your error.

understand God is the H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m. and in the plural, he is H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem').... do you understand the difference?

PICJAG,
101G.

i understand you dont know what your talking about

 

[101G]

i understand you dont know what your talking about

thanks for the reply, but do you know the difference of God in being the H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) who is God, (the ONE PERSON) and the same God who is H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') in plurality, (NOT IN PERSONS), but in NATURE, as the ECHAD of himself in flesh and Blood his OWN image. and this plurality, or the ECHAD of himself is expressed in the desigination of "First", and "Last".... do you now understand my speech?

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[cataway]

which g are you tiring to apply G or g ? God or god

 

[101G]

which g are you tiring to apply G or g ? God or god

"G" in God, example, Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God."

God is H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.
אֱלֹהֵי 'elohiy (el-o-hee') [alternate plural]
1. (literally) supreme ones.
2. (hence, in the ordinary sense) gods.
3. (specifically, in the plural, especially with the article) the Supreme God (i.e. the all supreme).
4. (sometimes) supreme, used as a superlative.
5. (occasionally, by way of deference) supreme magistrates, the highest magistrates of the land.
6. (also) the supreme angels (entities of unspecified type).
[plural of H433]
KJV: angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
Root(s): H433

NOW THIS,

Isaiah 44:8 "Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any."
God here is H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m.
אֱלֹהַּ 'eloahh (el-o'-ah) [shortened (rarely)]
1. one with supreme strength and ability.
2. the Supreme Being, God the Creator, Yahweh by name.
3. a supreme entity, a god-like creature (that is, one of God's supreme creations, or one of man's inventions).
[probably prolonged (emphat.) from H410]
KJV: God, god.

now, did you notice how this can be translated as "god", small case "g". well not in God, and heres why, Deuteronomy 32:39 "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand."

notice "god" here, small case "g" is in the plural, as in Genesis 1:1
H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.
אֱלֹהֵי 'elohiy (el-o-hee') [alternate plural]
1. (literally) supreme ones.
2. (hence, in the ordinary sense) gods.
3. (specifically, in the plural, especially with the article) the Supreme God (i.e. the all supreme).
4. (sometimes) supreme, used as a superlative.
5. (occasionally, by way of deference) supreme magistrates, the highest magistrates of the land.
6. (also) the supreme angels (entities of unspecified type).
[plural of H433]
KJV: angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
Root(s): H433


now do you see the difference?

 

[cataway]

"G" in God, example, Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God."

God is H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.
אֱלֹהֵי 'elohiy (el-o-hee') [alternate plural]
1. (literally) supreme ones.
2. (hence, in the ordinary sense) gods.
3. (specifically, in the plural, especially with the article) the Supreme God (i.e. the all supreme).
4. (sometimes) supreme, used as a superlative.
5. (occasionally, by way of deference) supreme magistrates, the highest magistrates of the land.
6. (also) the supreme angels (entities of unspecified type).
[plural of H433]
KJV: angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
Root(s): H433

NOW THIS,

Isaiah 44:8 "Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any."
God here is H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m.
אֱלֹהַּ 'eloahh (el-o'-ah) [shortened (rarely)]
1. one with supreme strength and ability.
2. the Supreme Being, God the Creator, Yahweh by name.
3. a supreme entity, a god-like creature (that is, one of God's supreme creations, or one of man's inventions).
[probably prolonged (emphat.) from H410]
KJV: God, god.

now, did you notice how this can be translated as "god", small case "g". well not in God, and heres why, Deuteronomy 32:39 "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand."

notice "god" here, small case "g" is in the plural, as in Genesis 1:1
H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.
אֱלֹהֵי 'elohiy (el-o-hee') [alternate plural]
1. (literally) supreme ones.
2. (hence, in the ordinary sense) gods.
3. (specifically, in the plural, especially with the article) the Supreme God (i.e. the all supreme).
4. (sometimes) supreme, used as a superlative.
5. (occasionally, by way of deference) supreme magistrates, the highest magistrates of the land.
6. (also) the supreme angels (entities of unspecified type).
[plural of H433]
KJV: angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
Root(s): H433


now do you see the difference?

again you are confusing which ''g'' to use and how it applies

 

[101G]

again you are confusing which ''g'' to use and how it applies

Let me be clear as I can. God, THE "LORD" JESUS of the OT is the
H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m.
אֱלֹהַּ 'eloahh (el-o'-ah) [shortened (rarely)]
1. one with supreme strength and ability.
2. the Supreme Being, God the Creator, Yahweh by name.
3. a supreme entity, a god-like creature (that is, one of God's supreme creations, or one of man's inventions).
[probably prolonged (emphat.) from H410]
KJV: God, god.

notice cataway this is the Ordinal First of God as the ECHAD of himself. now, when he came in flesh and blood, he SHARED himself, (the ARM of God, HIS OWN ARM, Isaiah 63:5), as the LAST Adam, ot the Ordinal Last of himself in flesh as a man, which is why he is called the H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.

let me be clear as I can,

H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh el-o'-ah (the "LORD" the Ordinal First, OT). title "Father"

H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym el-o-heem' (the Lord" the Ordinal Last, NT), title "Son"

PICJAG,
101G

 

[cataway]

Let me be clear as I can. God, THE "LORD" JESUS of the OT is the

here you have made 2 mistakes . Jesus is not God. at best all he can be is a god . note small case g
LORD in the bible ,note upper case letters , uses upper case letters to indicate that the name Jehovah was removed .
its very well known i am surprised you missed it

 

[Soapy]

"G" in God, example, Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God."

God is H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.
אֱלֹהֵי 'elohiy (el-o-hee') [alternate plural]
1. (literally) supreme ones.
2. (hence, in the ordinary sense) gods.
3. (specifically, in the plural, especially with the article) the Supreme God (i.e. the all supreme).
4. (sometimes) supreme, used as a superlative.
5. (occasionally, by way of deference) supreme magistrates, the highest magistrates of the land.
6. (also) the supreme angels (entities of unspecified type).
[plural of H433]
KJV: angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
Root(s): H433

NOW THIS,

Isaiah 44:8 "Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any."
God here is H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m.
אֱלֹהַּ 'eloahh (el-o'-ah) [shortened (rarely)]
1. one with supreme strength and ability.
2. the Supreme Being, God the Creator, Yahweh by name.
3. a supreme entity, a god-like creature (that is, one of God's supreme creations, or one of man's inventions).
[probably prolonged (emphat.) from H410]
KJV: God, god.

now, did you notice how this can be translated as "god", small case "g". well not in God, and heres why, Deuteronomy 32:39 "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand."

notice "god" here, small case "g" is in the plural, as in Genesis 1:1
H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') n-m.
אֱלֹהֵי 'elohiy (el-o-hee') [alternate plural]
1. (literally) supreme ones.
2. (hence, in the ordinary sense) gods.
3. (specifically, in the plural, especially with the article) the Supreme God (i.e. the all supreme).
4. (sometimes) supreme, used as a superlative.
5. (occasionally, by way of deference) supreme magistrates, the highest magistrates of the land.
6. (also) the supreme angels (entities of unspecified type).
[plural of H433]
KJV: angels, X exceeding, God (gods)(-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.
Root(s): H433


now do you see the difference?

Isaiah 44:6:

• “.... BESIDES ME there is no God!”

God said “Bilade” which means:

• Apart from, Except, Without
• Besides, Nothing except, Other than, Without

Check it out. The context changes slightly if you say ‘Beside me’. ‘Beside’ might imply that there are others who are ‘God, bug just not next to Yahweh. Like there are OTHER Kings in the world - just not next to THIS one. Whereas ‘Besides me’ is an absolute. There is no other ANYWHERE.

Just a little ironing out for all. I have heard arguments surrounding the trinity whereby Jesus seated next to God produces a problem if God said there is no God beside me. It’s foolish, I know, but wrongful interpretation even on a small part can lead to big differences down the line - see what I mean?

God said that BESIDES HIM there are no others who are God (contextually, Spirit). Thus, God is ONE. There are no others.

The more arguments rage about the impossible trinity three the more people are dissuaded from ‘crazy Christianity’... and the more Satan laughs with glee as he perceives God as being destroyed by disbelief.