Mitty
Active Member
In other words you have no evidence that the biblical writers interviewed Jesus or his family.
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God the baby killer
- Thread starter Spiderman
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Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
Mitty
Active Member
Cool!!! But have you ever seen a god or had a face to face conversation with a god like Abraham did (Gen 18), or is that story just an imaginative fantasy?
Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
No, it was a true story.
No, I have never seen God face to face. But I do have the Holy Spirit, something Abraham did not have.
Good-Ole-Rebel
Mitty
Active Member
Is that why Abraham et al never went to heaven (John 3:13) given they didn't believe in Jesus and didn't repent and weren't born again?
And what evidence do you have that Abraham shared a meal with a god and had a face to face conversation about the number of righteous children in Gomorrah and that the god then walked down to Gomorrah to count them (Gen 18)?
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Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
Abraham is in Heaven. Prior to Christ's first coming faith was directed toward the promised Seed. (Gen. 15:3-6)
Compare (John 3:3) to (3:13). This speaks to origin. If ones origin is not from Heaven or above, then he cannot ascend into Heaven.
Good-Ole-Rebel
rational experiences
Veteran Member
God O a planet is not any baby killer.
Humans as 2 living adult selves own sexual intercourse, being their free will choice.
And it is the choice of adults to the inheritance of the baby life.
One condition on Earth that is historic to human choice, which is science of the occult.
Using the energy from the Sun that attacked Earth as O God historically to convert it.
Therefore if the Sun can convert stone, which sits in the same spatial history as a sun...then the Sun can convert human life also.
And the Sun was never God.
Therefore if you own common human sense and live on a planet that humans said I will name our planet O one, and give it title, by conditions of my human language, then they did.
And males were the writer/theist and story teller inventor of the statements for human science, versus God remaining natural.
Now God, a planet owns a natural body and that body owns conditions of laws of its forces.
Hence if you change the natural law, then forces also change.
How God attacks you.
Therefore if you know that living on a body of stone, by all conditions allows life to live, and own life itself....then you only own one other answer of blame....the Sun.
So humans who protest and claim God is Holy are not lying. Those who said the attack was Anti Christ lied. For the attack was about stone history in the sciences, matter/mass taken out of the stone to build a machine.
The heavenly gases cannot build nor own building of a machine, the body of God mass owned that history. Therefore when a male group decides to do science they were ANTI GOD in fact, but caused ANTI Christ, the heavenly gases...seeing we live inside of that heavenly gas body.
Reading from biblical texts therefore involves a spiritual Teacher. And it was always suggested that only a spiritual conscious self was the Teacher.
Titus 2:7-8
Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity, and sound speech that cannot be condemned, so that an opponent may be put to shame, having nothing evil to say about us.
2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
Humans as 2 living adult selves own sexual intercourse, being their free will choice.
And it is the choice of adults to the inheritance of the baby life.
One condition on Earth that is historic to human choice, which is science of the occult.
Using the energy from the Sun that attacked Earth as O God historically to convert it.
Therefore if the Sun can convert stone, which sits in the same spatial history as a sun...then the Sun can convert human life also.
And the Sun was never God.
Therefore if you own common human sense and live on a planet that humans said I will name our planet O one, and give it title, by conditions of my human language, then they did.
And males were the writer/theist and story teller inventor of the statements for human science, versus God remaining natural.
Now God, a planet owns a natural body and that body owns conditions of laws of its forces.
Hence if you change the natural law, then forces also change.
How God attacks you.
Therefore if you know that living on a body of stone, by all conditions allows life to live, and own life itself....then you only own one other answer of blame....the Sun.
So humans who protest and claim God is Holy are not lying. Those who said the attack was Anti Christ lied. For the attack was about stone history in the sciences, matter/mass taken out of the stone to build a machine.
The heavenly gases cannot build nor own building of a machine, the body of God mass owned that history. Therefore when a male group decides to do science they were ANTI GOD in fact, but caused ANTI Christ, the heavenly gases...seeing we live inside of that heavenly gas body.
Reading from biblical texts therefore involves a spiritual Teacher. And it was always suggested that only a spiritual conscious self was the Teacher.
Titus 2:7-8
Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity, and sound speech that cannot be condemned, so that an opponent may be put to shame, having nothing evil to say about us.
2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
Mitty
Active Member
Nonsense. Do you have any actual evidence to support your claim? John 3:13, however, clearly says that Abraham never went to heaven since he didn't believe in Jesus and wasn't born again and didn't repent and didn't tithe to preacher men selling after death-salvation, even though it wasn't morally wrong for him to commit incest with his sister Sarah and commit adultery with Hagar, given that the ten commandments etc didn't apply to him since they are just man-made. Or don't you believe what the bible says?
Or are you just pointing out some of the numerous biblical contradictions and inconsistencies and scientific untruths, given that the bible was written by men, for men, about a small group of men and their laws and history and myths, including the gods they created in their images and likenesses?
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Who of the Jews could have done the crowing? All the leaders seem to have been on knees to the Roman rulers.
And about Matt 13:55-58, by what I see, it is not about his family disbelieving. And interesting is that the people said:
Coming into his own country, he taught them in their synagogue, so that they were astonished, and said, "Where did this man get this wisdom, and these mighty works?
Matt 13:54
Why, if they think he was just ordinary man?
And John 7:5, I think it would be wise to read the whole text, not just that part.
Did Jesus ignore them, I don’t think so, he had just more important thing to do at that moment.
Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
Again, you're consistently inconsistent. You give verses from the Bible to make a point. I show your ignorance concerning the meaning of the verses and you ask for for evidence.
Again, people were saved prior to the New Testament. As I said, they were saved by faith. I showed you already that Abraham was saved by faith. (Gen. 15:6)
I am pointing out your ignorance of the Bible coupled with your desire to bash God, Christ, and the Bible, is apparent. The problem is you don't know the Bible.
If you have some 'contradictions' in the Bible that have convinced you it is not true and that there was no Jesus Christ and that none of it is true,...be happy. You have what you are looking for.
Good-Ole-Rebel
Mitty
Active Member
So why didn't Jesus' mother and his family believe him (John 7:5 Matt 13:55-58)?
But either way, it's still just a story in book which was written decades after Jesus was executed for sedition by the Romans, and long after Jesus' biological mother and father had kicked the bucket.
And where did Einstein or Newton etc get their knowledge, which is far more important than what Jesus said "in their synagogue"?
Mitty
Active Member
Nonsense. There's nothing in Gen 15:6 about Abraham being saved and going to heaven, given that John 3:13 clearly says that he didn't, nor did any of his ancestors. Nor did Noah or Moses or David, even though David was his god's begotten son (Psalm 2:7). Or don't you believe what the bible actually says?
And where does the bible say that Abraham was born again and that he repented for having an incestuous relationship with his sister Sarah and committing adultery with Hagar?
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Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
Sorry, but (Gen. 15;6) says that Abraham was saved.
Sorry, but (John 3:13) doens't say Abraham didn't go to Heaven.
It is not a question of being 'born-again' with Abraham. It is a question of being saved by faith.
Abraham didn't repent for his relation to Sarah or Hagar as there was nothing to repent for.
Good-Ole-Rebel
Mitty
Active Member
Have you ever actually read the bible? If so, where does the OT say that Abraham went to heaven, given that John 3:13 clearly says that Abraham & Moses & Noah & David etc never went to heaven, even though David was his god's begotten son (Psalm 2:7)? Or are you claiming that Abraham was "he that came down from heaven" (John 3:13)?
John 3:13 King James Version
13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
And Gen 15:6 doesn't say that Abraham was saved anyway, but only says that Abraham claimed that he was righteous and believed in his god.
Genesis 15:6 King James Version
6 And he believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
That's because biblical morality is obviously just man-made, including the ten commandments etc since they did not apply to Abraham et al or their ancestors. Which is why it wasn't morally wrong for Abraham to have a sexual relationship with his sister Sarah and commit adultery with Hagar. And why it wasn't morally wrong for Abraham to kill his son as a blood sacrifice, or for Cain(an) to kill his brother Abel, or for Noah's father to kill a young man who hit him (Gen 4), given that Cain(an)'s god even protected him from retribution after he relocated to Nod and married one of the Nod girls and lived happily ever after.
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Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
I already showed you. (Gen. 15:6). Abraham is declared righteous by God.
(John 3:13) doesn't say that as I explained already.
I'm not worried about your 'morals'. Neither is God.
Good-Ole-Rebel
Mitty
Active Member
Alas you have explained nothing. And doesn't change the fact that John 3:13 clearly says that Abraham & Noah & Moses etc never went to heaven. Or don't you believe what the bible actually says?
That's because the biblical gods were created in the images and likenesses of the biblical writers, and because biblical morality is obviously just man-made, including the ten commandments etc.
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TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
The only reason the bible gets so much attention in western secular democracies, is because SO MANY people try to import the religiously inspired rules of the book into secular law and otherwise try to stuff it down the throat of non-believers (and believers of a different denomination or another religion alltogether).
You know this, off course.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
Seriously? The all-knowing, all-powerfull, ever-present creator of the universe is INCAPABLE of making his presence and intentions known to humans except by having iron age peasants write texts in which they demonstrate that they didn't even realise the earth orbits the sun?
Please...
I don't hate the bible or god anymore then I hate Lord of the Rings or Frodo.
The dude you're responding to, btw, also didn't say he "hates" the bible. He said he didn't like it.
And lastly, asserting that the bible comes from this god, does not make it so.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
The problem with biblical / religious division, is the "dogma" part.
The "dogma" part introduces a certain level of non-negotiable, non-debatable differences.
At least with mere political division, there's at least an opening for talks and compromise.
With dogmatic theism, there is no such opening. You either do god's bidding (or what you perceive as god's bidding), or "you burn in hell" or similar.
Such dogma is what makes the division coming from religious disagreement, potentially FAR FAR deeper and thus also more dangerous.
As we can see today in the middle east.
And as we have seen in the past in christian sectarian wars and violence.
It also has plummeted people into darkness, poverty, slavery, etc.
Cherry picking is not a good argument.
Good-Ole-Rebel
Well-Known Member
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