God is cruel

[Luciferi Baphomet]

yes that is true, but there are those who can be dangerous because of believing in their cruel god, and wanting to please their cruel god.

Yep I have encounterd those types before. They are insane.

 

[Milton Platt]

God could have not given us all free will, and then we could all be His puppets or drones. With positive things coming from free will, unfortunately also comes bad things. I've heard that people feel God giving His creation free will is what makes Him cruel, but I think differently.

There are numerous instances in the Bible where a person's "free will" was subverted. Besides, you are presenting a false dichotomy......it isn't an all or none proposition.

 

[Thief]

God could have not given us all free will, and then we could all be His puppets or drones. With positive things coming from free will, unfortunately also comes bad things. I've heard that people feel God giving His creation free will is what makes Him cruel, but I think differently.

yeah.....God gave Man dominion

that's as generous as He could be.....
the rest of the animal kingdom does not have such favor

 

[Thief]

Free will is not what I have a problem with. If God would speak up, we would use our free will differently

nay.....denial is trademark of freewill

you need the ability to say.....nay

 

[loverofhumanity]

I think I just may have lost a friend I prayed the Rosary with because we got in a conversation about the book of revelation and I said I thought it was ridiculous. Then I said the Bible contradicts itself. Then I said God is cruel.

Truly I think God is cruel. He watches so many people in agony and refuses to console them. But what I find very cruel is he wont even speak clear messages to people. He watches throughout history Muslims persecute and kill non-muslims, non-muslims kill Muslims, Christians kill pagans, Catholics kill protestants and vice versa, and repeatedly God refuses to speak clear messages to people, but by doing so he could end such division and killings. The reason there is so much division is God could guide people and he refuses.

For God to see so much agony and refuse to speak up is just cruel. I'm not saying God can be to blame for everything. People need to take some responsibility for our choices and our misery, but I don't think people would make a lot of those choices if they would hear God speak clear messages to them.

If I were God, there would be no such thing as Atheists because I would speak up to people. Would there seriously be Atheists if God actually was willing to speak to everyone?

I would console all hurting people. If I saw a kid getting raped, tortured, and murdered, I would defend them. To not do so is just plain cruel! God could do so without it costing him a thing and he refuses. It's just disgusting!

Shame on you Mr. God! I know you're reading this!!

It's we who are cruel. God has given us freedom of choice to choose His ways or our own and we have chosen our own way so we must live with it.

Our fate is in our own hands. God sends Messengers to offer guidance but then it's up to us to choose our path.

Why are we pleading with people to choose the path of Baha'u'llah? Because we want unity, love, peace and an end to unhappiness but it falls on deaf ears so it's people who are to blame not Baha'u'llah.

 

[Deidre]

There are numerous instances in the Bible where a person's "free will" was subverted. Besides, you are presenting a false dichotomy......it isn't an all or none proposition.

I never said it was.

 

[paarsurrey]

It's we who are cruel. God has given us freedom of choice to choose His ways or our own and we have chosen our own way so we must live with it.

Our fate is in our own hands. God sends Messengers to offer guidance but then it's up to us to choose our path.

Why are we pleading with people to choose the path of Baha'u'llah? Because we want unity, love, peace and an end to unhappiness but it falls on deaf ears so it's people who are to blame not Baha'u'llah.

"It's we who are cruel"
I agree with what I have colored in Magenta.
Regards

 

[capumetu]

I think I just may have lost a friend I prayed the Rosary with because we got in a conversation about the book of revelation and I said I thought it was ridiculous. Then I said the Bible contradicts itself. Then I said God is cruel.

Truly I think God is cruel. He watches so many people in agony and refuses to console them. But what I find very cruel is he wont even speak clear messages to people. He watches throughout history Muslims persecute and kill non-muslims, non-muslims kill Muslims, Christians kill pagans, Catholics kill protestants and vice versa, and repeatedly God refuses to speak clear messages to people, but by doing so he could end such division and killings. The reason there is so much division is God could guide people and he refuses.

For God to see so much agony and refuse to speak up is just cruel. I'm not saying God can be to blame for everything. People need to take some responsibility for our choices and our misery, but I don't think people would make a lot of those choices if they would hear God speak clear messages to them.

If I were God, there would be no such thing as Atheists because I would speak up to people. Would there seriously be Atheists if God actually was willing to speak to everyone?

I would console all hurting people. If I saw a kid getting raped, tortured, and murdered, I would defend them. To not do so is just plain cruel! God could do so without it costing him a thing and he refuses. It's just disgusting!

Shame on you Mr. God! I know you're reading this!!

I can assure you that God is not cruel. James 1:13-15 As a matter of fact in the very near future God is going to fulfill this passage found in your Bible:

(Revelation 21:3, 4) . . .With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.” We are all looking forward to that time.

There is an issue going on that is behind the scenes. Would you be interested in learning about that issue, it affects each and every individual on the earth.

 

[Spiderman]

It's we who are cruel. God has given us freedom of choice to choose His ways or our own and we have chosen our own way so we must live with it.

Our fate is in our own hands. God sends Messengers to offer guidance but then it's up to us to choose our path.

Why are we pleading with people to choose the path of Baha'u'llah? Because we want unity, love, peace and an end to unhappiness but it falls on deaf ears so it's people who are to blame not Baha'u'llah.

I like Bahaullah btw...wish I could be more like the guy

 

[Sonny]

I think I just may have lost a friend I prayed the Rosary with because we got in a conversation about the book of revelation and I said I thought it was ridiculous. Then I said the Bible contradicts itself. Then I said God is cruel.

Truly I think God is cruel. He watches so many people in agony and refuses to console them. But what I find very cruel is he wont even speak clear messages to people. He watches throughout history Muslims persecute and kill non-muslims, non-muslims kill Muslims, Christians kill pagans, Catholics kill protestants and vice versa, and repeatedly God refuses to speak clear messages to people, but by doing so he could end such division and killings. The reason there is so much division is God could guide people and he refuses.

For God to see so much agony and refuse to speak up is just cruel. I'm not saying God can be to blame for everything. People need to take some responsibility for our choices and our misery, but I don't think people would make a lot of those choices if they would hear God speak clear messages to them.

If I were God, there would be no such thing as Atheists because I would speak up to people. Would there seriously be Atheists if God actually was willing to speak to everyone?

I would console all hurting people. If I saw a kid getting raped, tortured, and murdered, I would defend them. To not do so is just plain cruel! God could do so without it costing him a thing and he refuses. It's just disgusting!

Shame on you Mr. God! I know you're reading this!!

You kind of answered your own question with 'people need to take some responsible for what THEY (not God) do'. God did all He could when He sent Jesus to die for us. God, also, gave us a brain to think with, research with and learn with. The problem, tho, is men.
Plus, God gave each of us a wonderful gift called free will. And, He also gave us His word, the Bible. Look, when men write books and call them 'God's word' there are always major contradictions in them. That isn't so in the Bible. But, the seeming contradictions that some find in the Bible are easy to disprove, at least the ones I've seen.
If all of us would do a bit of study we would see the fakes and frauds and go to the real source. Sadly, people would rather not do the research needed to know the truth- about anything except Trade school or college to better themselves in this life. Why not 'better' ourselves for the next life and this one? IDK, but people don't. And, that, my friend, is why we are where we are today. My 2 cents worth.

 

[Spiderman]

You kind of answered your own question with 'people need to take some responsible for what THEY (not God) do'. God did all He could when He sent Jesus to die for us. God, also, gave us a brain to think with, research with and learn with. The problem, tho, is men.
Plus, God gave each of us a wonderful gift called free will. And, He also gave us His word, the Bible. Look, when men write books and call them 'God's word' there are always major contradictions in them. That isn't so in the Bible. But, the seeming contradictions that some find in the Bible are easy to disprove, at least the ones I've seen.
If all of us would do a bit of study we would see the fakes and frauds and go to the real source. Sadly, people would rather not do the research needed to know the truth- about anything except Trade school or college to better themselves in this life. Why not 'better' ourselves for the next life and this one? IDK, but people don't. And, that, my friend, is why we are where we are today. My 2 cents worth.

God did everything he could for us??...why not give us clear messages now and then...

 

[Rise]

Truly I think God is cruel. He watches so many people in agony and refuses to console them. But what I find very cruel is he wont even speak clear messages to people. He watches throughout history Muslims persecute and kill non-muslims, non-muslims kill Muslims, Christians kill pagans, Catholics kill protestants and vice versa, and repeatedly God refuses to speak clear messages to people, but by doing so he could end such division and killings. The reason there is so much division is God could guide people and he refuses.

Isn't it a bit ironic though, that on the one hand we have people accusing God of being evil and cruel for not doing enough to put a stop to people committing evil; yet on the other hand we often have the same people complaining that God is evil and cruel because he's too judgemental when He puts to death people who are committing evil?

What do you really want?

2 Peter 3:9

For God to see so much agony and refuse to speak up is just cruel. I'm not saying God can be to blame for everything. People need to take some responsibility for our choices and our misery, but I don't think people would make a lot of those choices if they would hear God speak clear messages to them.

According to the Bible, God has already spoken clearly.
Yet we see even in the Bible that people of the past routinely ignored Him, to their detriment.

They rejected Jesus Himself, and the words He spoke and the works He did, while on earth.

Today, people continue to reject or ignore what God has and is speaking, to their detriment.

If I were God, there would be no such thing as Atheists because I would speak up to people. Would there seriously be Atheists if God actually was willing to speak to everyone?

Jesus said otherwise: Luke 16:31
It's not a lack of evidence that causes people to turn from God, it's a lack of desire.
There is already sufficient evidence for those who have a heart that genuinely desires truth, and is willing to obey the truth.

And we see in Matthew 11:24-25, clear speaking and demonstrations from God are no guarantee that people will believe and accept God.

In fact, Israel during the Exodus from Egypt, heard the audible voice from God and saw Him physically/visibly and miraculously manifest in ways so incredible that it had probably never happened before at any point in history prior - Yet all but a handful of them still rejected God and refused to trust or obey Him, which is why they all died in the wilderness after 40 years of wandering rather than entering into the promised land.

Obedience to God's ways is necessary to abide with Him. If you aren't prepared to obey God, then having more clarity and proof that you should obey Him is probably only going to just increase your condemnation on the day of judgement for having continued to reject God in the face of such clarity. We do see this principle at work with ananias and sapphira in the NT, and the Korah rebellion during the Exodus. In both cases you were dealing with people who had personally experienced such a high level of God's presence, spiritual gifts, miracles, and spiritual revelation, that their rejection of God had consequences far more severe than they would otherwise be.
In that sense, we have to wonder if it's actually God's mercy to not reveal Himself clearly to someone He knows is not ready or willing to act on that revelation.

 

[Mary Blackchurch]

You're assuming that God is watching and simply refusing to help, but how do you know that God is watching?

Or, it could be just like a parent practicing tough love on a child, such as when a child gets a cut for the first time - it's just a little "owie." Or maybe something like a physical trainer putting a trainee through their paces, using the familiar cliche "no pain, no gain." (But that may not be much of an argument, since I find those guys irritating as well.)

What would be the point in calling such a thing a deity? Why not say "a cosmic band-aid giver and typical dead-beat dad?"

 

[Mary Blackchurch]

Truth tells us what to believe

Who is this Truth character? Because s/he it is telling a lot of different nations and peoples a lot of different "truths".

 

[Mary Blackchurch]

God is not omnicient ,your free will is sacrosanct , otherwise you wouldn't have been able to write negative stuff about Him .However we are also made / created to have fellowship with Him, to enjoy a faith based two way relationship , with His blessing and favour. Note , although I've hardly missed church in 43 years, church itself does not reinstate my relationship , it only helps to maintain it !

Please reread my take on "free will" regarding my ability to write bad stuff about "him".

Also, a relationship is a two way street. When was the last time you dined out at a restaurant with your god? How about just went to the pub together, or played some video games? Have you been to the park with him recently? Are you intimate? If so, what does he look like?

If you can't answer the last question; you don't have a god, you have an illusory idea of what your god should be. And I am guessing that he's a lot like you -which is why he told you somehow that he's not omniscient and that "free will" is sacrosanct. Otherwise, how would you know?

 

[Willamena]

Who is this Truth character? Because s/he it is telling a lot of different nations and peoples a lot of different "truths".

Truth speaks to each of us, alone.

 

[Mary Blackchurch]

Truth speaks to each of us, alone.

Then that's certainly a lot of different truths - which means that "truth" is not universal and is many things including lies. It's certainly it's own problem. That makes it appear as if "truth' is just a word and not really any form of guidance. For example: if Ted Bundy's truth was (and it was) that women should be bludgeoned to death; was it good that he abided by that "truth?" Maybe, if Truth tells us what to believe, there are times that we shouldn't. Thus making it a lie.

 

[1robin]

I think I just may have lost a friend I prayed the Rosary with because we got in a conversation about the book of revelation and I said I thought it was ridiculous. Then I said the Bible contradicts itself. Then I said God is cruel.

Truly I think God is cruel. He watches so many people in agony and refuses to console them. But what I find very cruel is he wont even speak clear messages to people. He watches throughout history Muslims persecute and kill non-muslims, non-muslims kill Muslims, Christians kill pagans, Catholics kill protestants and vice versa, and repeatedly God refuses to speak clear messages to people, but by doing so he could end such division and killings. The reason there is so much division is God could guide people and he refuses.

For God to see so much agony and refuse to speak up is just cruel. I'm not saying God can be to blame for everything. People need to take some responsibility for our choices and our misery, but I don't think people would make a lot of those choices if they would hear God speak clear messages to them.

If I were God, there would be no such thing as Atheists because I would speak up to people. Would there seriously be Atheists if God actually was willing to speak to everyone?

I would console all hurting people. If I saw a kid getting raped, tortured, and murdered, I would defend them. To not do so is just plain cruel! God could do so without it costing him a thing and he refuses. It's just disgusting!

Shame on you Mr. God! I know you're reading this!!

1. Exactly how much evil and suffering exists?
2. How did you know that?
3. How can you have love without freewill, how can you have freewill if we could not use to do evil, how can we have evil without suffering?
4. Exactly how much evil and suffering can God allow and remain God?
5. How did you know that?
6. To make the argument you have made you need to show that God could have created a possible world where the same number of people would freely choose him, but which had less evil. Can you show that?


The problem of suffering and evil has two components. 1. The philosophical aspect. and 2. The emotional aspect.

1. Philosophers rarely even mention the philosophical aspect of evil and suffering because it just does not have any teeth.

2. However no one can do anything about the emotional aspect of evil and suffering. We don't like suffering and never will.

 

[Willamena]

Then that's certainly a lot of different truths - which means that "truth" is not universal and is many things including lies. It's certainly it's own problem. That makes it appear as if "truth' is just a word and not really any form of guidance. For example: if Ted Bundy's truth was (and it was) that women should be bludgeoned to death; was it good that he abided by that "truth?" Maybe, if Truth tells us what to believe, there are times that we shouldn't. Thus making it a lie.

Truth is universal, it's the same truth that speaks to each of us. What you're referring to is "truths" (propositions) about the world. Truth doesn't speak in words; but we elevate our capacity for language above all else, put it on a pedestal, and make words "truths" about the world.

It's not about what Ted Bundy believes: truth speaks to each of us, alone. If you genuinely believe, for yourself, that "if Truth tells us what to believe, there are times we shouldn't," then that's it.

 

[paarsurrey]

Truth is universal, it's the same truth that speaks to each of us. What you're referring to is "truths" (propositions) about the world. Truth doesn't speak in words; but we elevate our capacity for language above all else, put it on a pedestal, and make words "truths" about the world.

It's not about what Ted Bundy believes: truth speaks to each of us, alone. If you genuinely believe, for yourself, that "if Truth tells us what to believe, there are times we shouldn't," then that's it.

Truth is one name/attribute of G-d who has also conversed with Words to the righteous people in all times and regions of the world. Please
Regards