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God as a Designer

Onyx

Active Member
Premium Member
From "The Nature of Man and the Meaning of Existence" by Dr. Harold Saxton Burr:

Since the Universe and all that therein lies, is a growing, a developing design, the conclusion is inescapable that a Designer is at work. In the beginning was the Law and the Law was God. Needless to say, this concept of God as a Designer is at sharp variance with the Christian concept of a Deity. The notion of an all-powerful deity, sitting on the Universe and dictating every aspect of existence, interrupting Nature's Laws at will to satisfy the pleas of properly oriented humans, is absurd. Such a stultifying, dogmatic, authoritarian picture of God is hardly tenable in the face of the evidence. It precludes the possibility of change. There is no room in it for the exciting, stimulating, and almost explosive aspects of the cosmos. God is the Designer, working always toward a better Universe, but working always through the Laws which He established. Like every creative mind, He constantly seeks new ways of building a more perfect Universe.

What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?
 

DavidFirth

Well-Known Member
From "The Nature of Man and the Meaning of Existence" by Dr. Harold Saxton Burr:



What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?

He's just a man not filled with the Holy Spirit. His opinion is no more valuable or worse than that of any other man.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?
It seemed a bit old school for me; dualistic (God and creation are two). I see a more pantheistic non-dual (God and creation are not-two) multi-dimensional universe.

I even believe in miracles, or higher beings involving themselves in the affairs of the lower plane. This is not violating any natural law but rather applying energy governed by laws from a higher plane to affect the lower planes (but look like miracles to us).
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?

Lost me at "...the conclusion is inescapable that a Designer is at work..."

Just more "intelligent design" rhetoric.
 

Mister Silver

Faith's Nightmare
If god is real, I have always imagined him as the designer who did not know what he was doing when he did it, that watching our lives unfold without interfering was his way of learning just as much about himself as about us. At least that was the more plausible scenario to which I adhered when I was a theist.
 

DavidFirth

Well-Known Member
If god is real, I have always imagined him as the designer who did not know what he was doing when he did it, that watching our lives unfold without interfering was his way of learning just as much about himself as about us. At least that was the more plausible scenario to which I adhered when I was a theist.

Ignorance is bliss. So it is true.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
From "The Nature of Man and the Meaning of Existence" by Dr. Harold Saxton Burr:



What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?

I wouldnt see the christian god siting in the sky dictating the universe. That sounds star trekish. If anything, he has a too literal view of who god is. I like the phrase "in him, with himx and through him". Its an interaction with spirit. Christians just personify it and go off the bible's definition. But Im sure no christian today and even probably 2,000 years ago dont see a god floating in the sky unless they believe in gods like Zues and Athena. Reminds me of Xena series.

Probably non-christians take it more literal than christians themselves. But his definition of god is similar but withiut reference to jesus, its a sharp difference in beliefs rather than varieation.

I just hope other christians here are not being unchristian and skeptical of anything that contrast with their faith.

I hope.
 

idav

Being
Premium Member
From "The Nature of Man and the Meaning of Existence" by Dr. Harold Saxton Burr:



What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?
That is an interesting view on design. He isn't saying God created and then sat back but continues to design through the laws, like a god that works through nature. I agree with his take that the Christian God concept as described in the excerpt is absurd and not tenable. The concept sounds a bit pantheistic but normally I don't like using the word design, that word is misleading when nature is just doing what it does in accordance with universal laws.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
From "The Nature of Man and the Meaning of Existence" by Dr. Harold Saxton Burr:



What do you make of Dr. Burr's concept of "God as a Designer"?

You could easily replace all references to "design" and "Designer" with "Natural Laws" and it would be in line with the objective verifiable evidence. To argue against Natural Law would require falsifying a hypothesis that Natural Law could not be the cause, which is impossible.

The concept of a "design" and a "designer" is an anthropomorphic projection to argue the necessity of a an outside 'Source' for our physical existence.

God is a Creator and not a designer.
 

WalterTrull

Godfella
God is a Creator and not a designer.
Did you ever think that maybe God is the Creator, the power, the stuff of the universe, but we are the designers? Nah, I can already think of a dozen "why nots", an interesting thought though. The answer is probably in the description of the 6th day. Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion...
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Did you ever think that maybe God is the Creator, the power, the stuff of the universe, but we are the designers? Nah, I can already think of a dozen "why nots", an interesting thought though. The answer is probably in the description of the 6th day. Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion...

I am not a fan of the mythology and the 'hands on' anthropomorphic God(s) of Genesis.

My belief in God is simply the 'Source' and Creator. Ancient scripture by in large is an ancient human view of God, and not particularly useful in developing a more 'apophatic' universal view of God.
 

WalterTrull

Godfella
I am not a fan of the mythology and the 'hands on' anthropomorphic God(s) of Genesis.

My belief in God is simply the 'Source' and Creator. Ancient scripture by in large is an ancient human view of God, and not particularly useful in developing a more 'apophatic' universal view of God.
Cool. Another word I had to look up. I kind of like ancient scripture. Not that I take it literally, but those old guys weren't dumb. I think they were trying to impart something they knew, using a format they found familiar. I think we just need a bit more familiarity.
 

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
normally I don't like using the word design, that word is misleading when nature is just doing what it does in accordance with universal laws.
My problem with the article has less to do with design as it does his statement about laws, which you make reference to here. "In the beginning was the Law and the Law was God," he states. This notion of "laws" of the universe comes from the Christian assumption that there are fixed laws laid down in the universe from the moment of creation that everything must follow, that these laws existed eternally in the mind of God in other words. That's where the language we use about these things comes from is that assumption.

In reality however these are not preexisting conditions before creation. What they are are stable patterns that things tend to follow. They get "laid down", like cutting a groove into the ground that the water will then follow again and again making the groove deeper. They are really 'cosmic habits' as opposed to fixed laws in the fabric of the universe that everything is subject to. Instead, everything actually made these "laws" (patterns) from themselves. If there were fixed laws, there would be no novelty, and the universe of full of novelty, which once repeated becomes itself a new cosmic habit. In other words, we try a bunch of stuff and what works gets repeated until it becomes so entrenched it is followed into stable patterns.
 
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