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Featured God and Evolution

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Vaziri, Jul 9, 2019.

  1. Vaziri

    Vaziri Islamic Philosopher

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    It seems to be a popular trend that people who believe in God do not believe in evolution. And people who believe in evolution do not believe in God.

    Obviously, there's exceptions because I am one. I believe in God and evolution. As a Muslim who believes the Quran to be true there are several scripture to support this.

    It also says we come from the clay of the Earth just as Christians and Jews believe.

    So if science proves we are made up of stardust and God says the same thing why do so many think otherwise?

    Everything science has discovered about existence dating back to the big bang is also verifiable in the Quran.

    I'm not trying to revert everyone to Islam here.. Just want to know if you believe in one and not the other then just your reason behind it.
     
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  2. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    I also believe in God and evolution. Although I am not a Muslim. For me, the creation story in Genesis could be true if God is creating in the same way that an author creates.
     
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  3. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    Many Muslims do not accept the evolution of life includes the evolution of humanity, and consider Genesis as in one way or another to describe the origins of humans.

    Form:Islamic views on evolution - Wikipedia

    "Islamic views on evolution are diverse, ranging from theistic evolution to Old Earth creationism.[1] Some Muslims around the world believe "humans and other living things have evolved over time," yet some others believe they have "always existed in present form."[2]Muslim thinkers have proposed and accepted elements of the theory of evolution, some holding the belief of the supremacy of God in the process. Usaama al-Azami suggested that both narratives of creation and of evolution, as understood by modern science, may be believed by modern Muslims as addressing two different kinds of truth, the revealed and the empirical.[3] Muneer Al-Ali argues that faith and science can be integrated and complement each other."

    I do not consider the Quran gives consistent guidance on the science of evolution, and this results in a diverse difference in the interpretation of the Quran.
     
  4. Altfish

    Altfish Well-Known Member

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    Don't believe in either but I do accept evolution to be by far the best explanation of the diversity of life on earth.
     
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  5. Katzpur

    Katzpur Not your average Mormon

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    I'm a Christian and I am convinced that evolution takes place. I see God's work as no less marvelous if He created the universe over a period of 7 days or a few billion years. I can't conceive of a universe as grand as ours taking place without some direction of some sort, though, so I firmly believe God is at the helm.
     
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  6. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    People with any sense know your dichotomy isnt
    so. Of course not all christians are anti science.

    No need to set up your argument with an S-man.

    The bible does NOT say "stardust". It says
    "dust". It might be vaguely impressive if it
    said "star", but that would just be poesy,
    not deep wisdom.

    And what is "dust"? Powdered aluminum?
    Dust curls from under bed? May as well
    call it "stuff". That would be better, coz it at least
    could include water, our main ingredient!

    Lots of native myths have the great spirit make
    people from clay. It is false anyway, people
    were not just "made".

    MOREOVER, "science proves" is ignorant
    nonsense. Science never proves anything,
    you've a most fundamental
    misunderstanding there!

    "Everything sience has discovered...is verifiable
    in the koran".

    This claim in its many forms is about too
    silly for words.

    One thing you would eventually have to
    learn if you were to succeed in a study
    of science is the concept / practice of
    objectivity.

    The easiest person to fool is yourself,
    and you have sure succeeded.

    You are seeing the same thing in your
    koran that astrologers see in the stars
    or fans of Nostradamus see in his
    "prophecy". Namely, they take the
    thinnest thread of imaginary connections
    and force-fit meanings to get the conclusion
    they want.

    Perhaps you mean "convert" rather than
    "revert"? :D

    No worries on that. As for the rest of your
    post-

    Try again with something a little more
    intellectualer?
     
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  7. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    At the King Abdulazizz Center for Science and Technology they have some very sophisticated exhibits of geological changes in the Arabian Peninsula over the past 30 million years or so. KAUCST is pretty cool as universities go and they are geared towards petroleum and chemistry as well as hy-solar technology.

    Next to each exhibit they have a small brass plaque with a creation verse from the Koran. It doesn't seem to be a problem for them.
     
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  8. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

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    First of all, the surveys that I have seen indicates that most American do accept the ToE and believe in God but that there's a difference when one considers education, party affiliation, and which denomination/branch one identifies with.

    As for myself, I accept the ToE, but how I view God is rather unorthodox [see "My Faith Statement" at the bottom of my posts for clarification].
     
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  9. viole

    viole Metaphysical Naturalist
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    So, you agree that humans and pigs share a common ancestor.
    Right?

    You also asked if I believe in one and not the other. i do not believe in neither. I don’t believe in God because i know there is none, and I don’t believe in evolution because I do not need to. Believe is left for things without evidence, and it is therefore not applicable to evolution.

    Ciao

    - viole
     
    #9 viole, Jul 9, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
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  10. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    Except maybe the force-fit?
     
  11. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    Eeewwwh, not PIGS! Worse than kryptonite!!!
     
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  12. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    What "force-fit"?
     
  13. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    Don't know why it seems that way because it certainly isn't true.


    [​IMG]


    .
     
  14. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    We do have some people who post in the Evolution/Creation debate section, and they will persistently support a young Earth creation. Most on the site do not argue for it.
     
  15. Windwalker

    Windwalker Integralist
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    I view evolution as God creating. What is problematic however is to take one's reading of their scriptures and try to force fit vague verses into statements that are scientific. If one hinges their faith on their scriptures being magically scientific somehow when they were written in ancient times, one places their faith in God on very thin strings. It is better to read those verses in the context of the times they were written, which was not to a modern context with scientific knowledge. That's a house of cards that one card that doesn't fit, takes down the entire faith structure of God.

    It is vastly more probable to understand they were not thinking in terms of carbon and various other minerals. They were very much imagining dust that was literally spit into by God, fashioned into figurines, and magically given the breath of life direct from God. And that's fine. Why should they think in terms of supernova created star dust out of which planets and the evolution of life on that. No way they would have known that. And it should not be important to anyone today if they had not. Do you think otherwise?

    Because ancient man did not know the facts of modern science. That's not what they were saying. That's known as reading backwards into an ancient time a modern understanding. That does not work.

    Only if one bends and twists the meanings to make them fit. Christians do that with their scriptures too. It's not valid in either case.

    I've never been a Muslim, so I could not "revert" to being one. :)
     
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  16. David T

    David T Well-Known Member
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    Well not to believe and to believe are irrelvant so after that its just confusion actually..
     
  17. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    Yes, Islam in general accepts the scientific view of the physical history of the earth.This exhibit does not deal with evolution, nor does it necessarily reflect the believers view of evolution.
     
  18. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member
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    Most creationists I know believe in evolution, what an evolution scientist named micro evolution. He also coined the term macro evolution.

    Simply put, micro evolution postulates the environmental and genetic driven adaption of an organism to a certain point, and not beyond.

    Macro evolution, as displayed in the somewhat bogus chart that hung in my science classroom in jr. high, is not accepted. That is, the chain of evolution from a simple organism through all types of evolved creatures to the animals, humans, and plants of today. The evidence is lacking.
     
  19. Wasp

    Wasp Active Member

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    The centre of the earth formed from dust in space.
    No, because everyone is born a Muslim.
     
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  20. Wasp

    Wasp Active Member

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    This exhibit does not deal with evolution? What does that mean?
     
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