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Featured "Get Out of Her"

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Eyes to See, Sep 12, 2020.

  1. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    What if there was imminent danger and you were given a warning to get clear?

    Something that comes to my mind was when I was a kid and Mt Saint Helens became active. It started to spew smoke, many small tremors growing in intensity and size, leading scientists to declare that an eruption was eminent and to evacuate the mountain.

    What happened to the people who didn't listen to the warnings given long in advance? Many people refused to listen, some were on the mountain hiking, camping. I read of a person who lived on the mountain and said he would never leave his home. Well, all of them died because they refused to heed the warning message.

    Now, let's put another scenario. You're walking by an apartment building on an urban street and you clearly see flames coming out of the windows above and you notice that some of the occupants are unaware of the danger. Would you feel it now your responsibility to act and warn the occupants the apartment complex is on fire? If some of the people who were ignorant of the danger died because they received no warning, and you were able to warn them, would you have a guilty conscience? Would you indeed be responsible for their deaths, in part, by not warning them?

    Now with those examples in mind read the prophecy in Revelation 18:4. It is directed to God's people who are in "her." They are told to get out of her, because if they don't they will share with her in her sins and receive the plagues she receives:

    "And I heard another voice out of heaven say: “Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues."-Revelation 18:4.

    This is an ominous warning. The voice is from heaven. If you read the context it talks about a world-wide organization that is given a mystery name Babylon the great. She is called a prostitute that commits sexual immorality with the kings of the earth.

    So here is the question...does a warning like this stir you to think? If you are part of her surely you want to know!

    Why are God's people warned to get out of her? Who is she?

    Notice that she is held responsible for the bloodshed of all humankind in God's eyes:

    "Yes, in her was found the blood of prophets and of holy ones and of all those who have been slaughtered on the earth.”-Revelation 18:24.

    To those who think God will never hold people and organizations responsible for their actions. What does this tell you about him? He says about her:

    "For her sins have massed together clear up to heaven, and God has called her acts of injustice to mind.  Repay her in the way she treated others, yes, pay her back double for the things she has done; in the cup she has mixed, mix a double portion for her. To the extent that she glorified herself and lived in shameless luxury, to that extent give her torment and mourning."-Revelation 18:5-7.

    How does it feel to know that God is going to hold everyone and every organization accountable for their acts? And the way they deal is the way they will be dealt with?

    How does it make you feel to know there is no one too mighty to surpass heaven? Does not even scripture state:


    "If you see any oppression of the poor and a violation of justice and righteousness in your district, do not be surprised about the matter. For that high official is being watched by one who is higher than he is, and there are others who are still higher than they are."-Ecclesiastes 5:8.

    So who is she? Who would want to remain part of this bloodguilty world-wide empire? And who knows and is warning before it is too late?
     
    #1 Eyes to See, Sep 12, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2020
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  2. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    I would warn those who had not seen it coming.
     
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  3. Altfish

    Altfish Veteran Member

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    BUT ...

    A rational person assesses the threat, weighs up the evidence for the impending doom and them makes a decision to flee or ignore the perceived threat.

    So when my grand daughter shouts "snake", I look at what is worrying her and see it is a worm (Night crawler to those in the US) and ignore or educate my off-spring.
     
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  4. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    Good and responsible. As would be your responsibility. God says:

    "When I say to someone wicked, ‘You will surely die,’ but you do not warn him, and you fail to speak in order to warn the wicked one to turn from his wicked course so that he may stay alive, he will die for his error because he is wicked, but I will ask his blood back from you."-Ezekiel 3:18.
     
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  5. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    I believe it is our obligation to warn those who can not see or hear Gods/ Allahs warning :) it does not matter if the warning is to people of other faiths or to non believers. Its to save them from destruction.
     
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  6. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    Fair enough.

    When Jesus was on earth he did many many things that proved he was the son of God. God himself said so from heaven on 3 different occasions. Anyway, after all that he did, including bringing dead people back to life, after being in the grave for over 3 days, the Jewish religious leaders blindly asked for a sign.

    Jesus said they had this saying:

    When evening falls, you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is fire-red,’  and in the morning, ‘It will be wintry, rainy weather today, for the sky is fire-red but gloomy.’ You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but the signs of the times you cannot interpret."-Matthew 16:2, 3.


    I was raised with a similar saying. Red sky at night, sailors delight. Red sky at morning, sailors take warning.

    So assessing the signs of the times with Bible prophecy and perceiving the imminent fulfillment of such Bible prophecies a person would rationally want to take action.
     
  7. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    Agreed. Now notice you mention God or Allah. Do you know Allah's name?
     
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  8. Altfish

    Altfish Veteran Member

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    But again, if someone claims to be "The son of god", I'd need good evidence for bot the existence of god and the son's claims.
    I have read much of The Bible, listened to priests and preachers and don't see that evidence,
     
  9. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    Great title, great OP.

    I have been exactly in this situation:

    On one of my longer trips to the Ashram of Sai Baba, my Guruji and "God", on which I decided not to take any vaccination, because He claims to be a Poorna Avatar (Direct incarnation of the Divine with all the 16 attributes like the 3 omni's etc) AND He will take personal care of all who come to Him, and I wanted to fully surrender and maybe a tiny bit to check out if He really is, so I was willing to risk my life for the science of getting real proof that he is Omniscient, Omnipresent etc

    After 1 year, if I recollect it well, one night Sai Baba comes in my dream and says "Malaria will come, and you will die; your immunesystem is not strong enough."

    I left, and I was saved and I even got my proof that Sai Baba indeed is the Poorna Avatar of Kali Yuga.
    Many others ended up in hospital. I did have the thought "should I have told the others? I decided not tell anyone"
     
    #9 stvdv, Sep 12, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2020
  10. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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  11. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    It reminds me of the account of doubting Thomas. Did you hear of it before? Perhaps. It was after Jesus was raised from the dead. He appeared in the middle of a locked room before his disciples and Thomas wasn't there.

    Well Thomas refused to believe it. He said, unless I see him and am able to stick my fingers through the holes in his hands, I won't believe it.

    Later Jesus materialized into human form again in the midst of his disciples while they were worshiping God in a lock room and then he turned to Thomas and said stick your fingers through my hand. He obviously appeared with holes as Thomas wanted.

    Then Thomas recognized the Christ. Jesus said something very enlightening:

    "Jesus said to him: “Because you have seen me, have you believed? Happy are those who have not seen and yet believe.”-John 20:29.

    Have you ever read the four gospel accounts? They don't take that long to read. Mark, the shortest only takes maybe half an hour to read all the way through.

    There are 4 accounts for a reason. They each give different eye-witness testimony. And that testimony is trustworthy. In any court of law the word of 2 or 3 witnesses is enough to establish something as truthful.

    Peter said:

    "No, it was not by following artfully contrived false stories that we made known to you the power and presence of our Lord Jesus Christ, but rather, we were eyewitnesses of his magnificence. 17 For he received from God the Father honor and glory when words such as these were conveyed to him by the magnificent glory: “This is my Son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.” 18 Yes, these words we heard coming from heaven while we were with him in the holy mountain."-2 Peter 1:16-18.
     
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  12. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    Thank you for giving me that link. I see it is a list of titles. The same as Lord and God are titles. I am wondering if you are aware God not only has titles, but also a personal name.
     
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  13. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    As far as i know no teaching of a personal name og Allah in the Quran :)
    But if Christianity teach you God has a personal name that is good for you.
     
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  14. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    Mount Saint Helens was real. Its something that
    doesn't require verification to acknowledge any and all potential danger associated with it. Everyone for the most part recognise volcanos and are aware of its potential. Its different than perceived dangers that lack tangibility.

    Putting that aside for the moment, there are others who recognise dangers, yet decides to take the risk. Some win, some don't.

    I would think it depends upon risk assessment weither one chooses to ignore or heed warnings.
     
  15. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    Ok.
    He does have a name. In the Hebrew scriptures the prophet Joel was inspired to write:

    "And everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved."-Joel 2:32.

    And Zephaniah a prophet of Jehovah said that a time would come when people around the world, even though speaking different languages, would all speak one "pure language" of truth and would all call upon the name of Jehovah:

    "For then I will change the language of the peoples to a pure language, So that all of them may call on the name of Jehovah, To serve him shoulder to shoulder."-Zephaniah 3:9.
     
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  16. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Active Member

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    In order to assess the risk wouldn't you want to have more information? Someone may perhaps want to know who the woman in Revelation 18 is, seeing as she is going to have to respond for her acts of bloodshed. And since it is someone who sits on all the peoples of the earth it is an empire stretching around the world with great influence and who has much blood-guilt because of all the people that have died because of her.
     
  17. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
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    Actually double payment would be unjust, besides, if she is responsible for the death of all the prophets how would God pay her double by only taking away her one life?

    Doesn't make sense IMO
     
  18. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    As I've said before, Revelation reads to me like an old man's acid trip;). So I think its rather wild allegories need to be approached with circumspection.

    The woman referred to is commonly thought to refer to the Roman Empire, the evils of which obviously exercised the writer considerably. I am not sure it has a great deal of meaning for us today.
     
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  19. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium Advaita Vedantin
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    Yes.

    Babylon the great? Revelation 18:2
     
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  20. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Veteran Member
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    Waste of time.
    It was polemic against the Roman Empire. It doesn't have to do with us today. Putting Revelation in the Bible was such a dumb idea.
     
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