Genetics are linked to same-sex behaviour, but there is no "gay gene"

[Ellen Brown]

I agree. It is likely to be more than just genetics. The point is that far too many Christians demand a "gay gene" to think that being gay is not a choice. The evidence keeps coming in that sexuality is not a choice.

Complex problems are not apt to have simple solutions. And let's not forget that many people can swing both ways. I think that many of the rather vehement anti-gay people are likely to belong to that class. For them it is a choice and they seem to think that is the case for everyone. Studies have shown a link between violent homophobia and latent homosexuality. In other words these people are fighting a conflict within themselves. And like many that put away something that is desirable in themselves they react rather strongly against it. As an ex-smoker I really don't like smokers around me. I think that in the same sense a person that has put that part of his nature aside will hate those that participate in it without any guilt.

I get confused. I was never gay, but was frequently accused of it. Years later they tell me I am XXY..... and a bunch of stuff. In the Christian culture I was in from 1974 to 2003, you had to be one or the other. They had no understanding at all. Of course life took another turn when the Psychological folk got me. Later, I tried to become a Nun but they weren't having it... We do the best that we can.

 

[Enoch07]

Which is no more poignant than saying radical conservatives are the loudest. I'm talking about movements, if modern feminism could even be called such, does not have the unified and violent radical political action like previous waves did.

Meh its debatable. A lot of radical feminist are in Antifa and other violent organizations, like BAMN. That's part of the advantage of being in these organizations, people use it to shield their identity and their ideologies. Then people like you can claim there is no organization/centralization. Which is true on a national or global level. But what you have instead is isolated insurgent cells unified by ideology, instead of a physical chain of command. Almost occult like, just without the Charles Manson figurehead.

**** Jordan Peterson. He is a stupid man's idea of a smart man, who makes Nostradamus like proclamations in their ambiguity then backpeddles whenever anyone pins him to a point which is how we got the 'lobster hierarchies' nonsense.

Incels got frustrated because they harbored the opinion that women owed them sex if they were nice. When that didn't work, they abandoned the idea that niceties could ever obtain anything and choose instead to isolate and attack the society they are convinced is broken and hopeless because they're ********.

They don't become murderers because they needed to be reached out to by women, they became murderers because they vilified women and any man with a few more centimeters of chin bone than them, which thereby make them pure Adonis lavished with sex. (I don't recommend spending any time in incel subreddits.)

I had to look up incel, never heard of it before so I don't know much about them specifically.

But yes as far as young people go, who spend a lot of time on social media like Twitter. Young men are ostracized and vilified on these sites by rad fems daily.

You can try to discredit Jordan but fact is he has a B.A. in political science and PHd in clinical psychology. So its safe to say he is more intelligent than most people on RF.

I blame incels for being ********. I blame people who shift blame for their behavior onto their victims.

Self reflection is needed. It's a combination of factors. It's not just a man or woman problem. It's a human problem. Everyone is culpable. I suggest you study the behavioral sink to educate yourself on it to understand my points better.

Evidence (like from the WHO)? Because, again, I see absolutely no global trend of neonatal fatality on the rise.

The CDC.

Maternal mortality in the United States - Wikipedia

"The CDC reported an increase in the maternal mortality ratio in the United States from 18.8 deaths per 100,000 births to 23.8 deaths per 100,000 births between 2000 and 2014, a 26.6% increase;[4] It is estimated that 20-50% of these deaths are due to preventable causes, such as: hemorrhage, severe high blood pressure, and infection."

 

[InChrist]

Why not try to find out if there's a gene for religion?

I don't believe there is any gene for religion, but I do think humans are wired to be in relationship with their Creator and nothing else can ever adequately fill God's place or bring real love and fulfillment.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Meh its debatable. A lot of radical feminist are in Antifa and other violent organizations, like BAMN. That's part of the advantage of being in these organizations, people use it to shield their identity and their ideologies. Then people like you can claim there is no organization/centralization. Which is true on a national or global level. But what you have instead is isolated insurgent cells unified by ideology, instead of a physical chain of command. Almost occult like, just without the Charles Manson figurehead.

How would you even begin to quantify 'a lot of radical feminists are in antifa'? Is there a poll or something? Lol.
Radfems, which is an actual movement (and a transphobic one I dislike) tend to be second wave, not modern feminists. And antifa has everyone because it literally just means anti fascist. The largest two antifa demographics at the Portland counter protest were, kid you not, teachers and bakers(with cute 'white flour' signs). Neither of which were violent.
In my city's history the tiny percentage of violent antifa have been overwhelmingly male anarchists.

I had to look up incel, never heard of it before so I don't know much about them specifically.

But yes as far as young people go, who spend a lot of time on social media like Twitter. Young men are ostracized and vilified on these sites by rad fems daily.

Misogynists certainly are. Incel are the most likely of which to be in mass shootings.

You can try to discredit Jordan but fact is he has a B.A. in political science and PHd in clinical psychology. So its safe to say he is more intelligent than most people on RF.

A call to authority if I've ever seen one. As I'm sure you'd be happy to tell any b.a. in political science and PhD in clinical psychology who is also a communist, being accredited doesn't make your arguments more acceptable.
I could give you plenty of both who've spent many hours writing criticism of Peterson's writing if you wanted.

Self reflection is needed. It's a combination of factors. It's not just a man or woman problem. It's a human problem. Everyone is culpable. I suggest you study the behavioral sink to educate yourself on it to understand my points better.

Sure, right after you take some gender study courses lol.

The CDC.

Maternal mortality in the United States - Wikipedia

"The CDC reported an increase in the maternal mortality ratio in the United States from 18.8 deaths per 100,000 births to 23.8 deaths per 100,000 births between 2000 and 2014, a 26.6% increase;[4] It is estimated that 20-50% of these deaths are due to preventable causes, such as: hemorrhage, severe high blood pressure, and infection."

1. That's US, not global.
2. It does not say that the increase isn't part of the half that are caused by preventable causes which would be explained by
3. Decreased scientific literacy in the community, increased poverty and poor accessibility to healthcare. Do other places which don't have these problems have higher neonatal death?
If not, this could very well be a case of the US' shifting priorities away from scientific literacy (which leads to things like doctor shortages and underfunded medical establishments) and low healthcare access (mostly due to its higher cost in the US.)

 

[leov]

If you have a point, why do you not just make it?

it is my point - epigenetics, which includes very many things as you know....

If you have a point, why do you not just make it?

i did.

 

[Enoch07]

How would you even begin to quantify 'a lot of radical feminists are in antifa'? Is there a poll or something?

The few that have been identified/apprehended are avid feminist/Identitarian folks. A lot are liberal professors so it's not a hard deduction to make.

Radfems, which is an actual movement (and a transphobic one I dislike

You mean Trans Rad Exclusionary Fems. I didn't want to use the acronym because it might count as a derogatory word. I recognize these as different than other radical feminist who I just call in general rad fems.

The rad fems I speak of are the ones that have hypothetical conversations about mutilating men and only using them as eunuch slave labor and a select few to be used solely for sperm farming.

A call to authority if I've ever seen one. As I'm sure you'd be happy to tell any b.a. in political science and PhD in clinical psychology who is also a communist, being accredited doesn't make your arguments more acceptable.

Not a call to authority, but it does discredit your accusation of he is only an intellectual for stupid people. You can disagree with him that's fine. But insulting his intelligence and the intelligence of his supporters only further proves his point of how feminist write off young men.

Sure, right after you take some gender study courses lol.

Sorry I don't buy into the patriarchy BS.

If not, this could very well be a case of the US' shifting priorities away from scientific literacy (which leads to things like doctor shortages and underfunded medical establishments) and low healthcare access (mostly due to its higher cost in the US.)

Maybe, I don't know the reason why exactly. But I do think it's a sign of the degradation of society.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

it is my point - epigenetics, which includes very many things as you know....

i did.

Sorry, that was complete nonsense, while not actually saying anything of meaning. If you are having trouble with English, then feel free to take as many words as you need. Those of us who are interested will make the effort to try to understand, just as we hope you will try to understand us.

Hint: use short sentences; use words whose meanings you understand; If you don't know what word to use, then use one from your own language and we'll try to figure it out. Those who are interested will not dismiss you because there are language issues...we'll try to help.

 

[leov]

Sorry, that was complete nonsense, while not actually saying anything of meaning. If you are having trouble with English, then feel free to take as many words as you need. Those of us who are interested will make the effort to try to understand, just as we hope you will try to understand us.

Hint: use short sentences; use words whose meanings you understand; If you don't know what word to use, then use one from your own language and we'll try to figure it out. Those who are interested will not dismiss you because there are language issues...we'll try to help.

Thank you.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

If sexual orientation is genetic then it is an evolutionary trait developed to limit/take that person's genes out of the gene pool. This is more evidence that Behavioral sink - Wikipedia is sound. Mind you being gay is not a problem in itself. Think of LGBT people as Sentinel species - Wikipedia. They are our sign of something dreadful coming (extinction).

If that were the case we could expect to see increased rates of homosexuality within populations sufficiently high enough that survival is not threatened, and decreased rates within populations that are threatened and endangered. But we don't see this. Nature/evolution gives not one damn if something lives or dies or how it all turns out. It makes no sense for nature to make a willful effort to remove something from the gene pool, individual or species. We care very much though - despite the varied claims of such homosexuality has nothing to do with survival, it seems, as it has been observed in very many sexual creatures, those both many and few.

 

[leov]

Thank you.

 

[Enoch07]

If that were the case we could expect to see increased rates of homosexuality within populations sufficiently high enough that survival is not threatened, and decreased rates within populations that are threatened and endangered.

There is a threshold. At a certain point overpopulation decreases the chance for survival.

And homosexuality is extremely rare in small secluded tribal people around the world. You can go there and ask them if a man wants to marry/have sex with another man and they will just look at you completely baffled. Its pretty much an alien concept to them. Not all of course but for the majority yeah, very rare.

Nature/evolution gives not one damn if something lives or dies or how it all turns out. It makes no sense for nature to make a willful effort to remove something from the gene pool, individual or species.

That's how evolution works though dear.

How do you think a wood packer could evolve a tongue that goes out a hole in its beak, wraps around its skull, then comes back in near the spine then up into the mouth to rest there.

There is no way these birds thought of the idea of an extra long tongue then willed it into existence.

We care very much though - despite the varied claims of such homosexuality has nothing to do with survival, it seems, as it has been observed in very many sexual creatures, those both many and few.

It has but you can't deny the fact in the natural world homosexuality produces no offspring. So any animal that exhibits this trait will fail to pass on its genes. We as humans can get around that due to technology. But should there come a day when technology is no longer available to us. Reproduction will be very important.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

And homosexuality is extremely rare in small secluded tribal people around the world. You can go there and ask them if a man wants to marry/have sex with another man and they will just look at you completely baffled. Its pretty much an alien concept to them. Not all of course but for the majority yeah, very rare.

It depends on how you ask. If you ask it from a Western perspective of strict homo/heterosexuality that tends to get a no because it's not understood or known in other cultures. Our concept of marriage, especially as a choice of love, is often not understood or known in other cultures. Even in the Tanakh those concepts and ideas are absent, but the action of a man sleeping with a man is there.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

The few that have been identified/apprehended are avid feminist/Identitarian folks. A lot are liberal professors so it's not a hard deduction to make

Source? Not just an example. but 'the few that have been apprehended' and 'a lot.' The ones doing the violence here were anarchists, leaving anarchy tags.

You mean Trans Rad Exclusionary Fems. I didn't want to use the acronym because it might count as a derogatory word.

Terf is a word with negative connotation, like white supremacist. And, like white supremacists calling themselves 'white nationalists'they are pushing from the term. But terfs call themselves radfems. The radfem forum is the terf forum.

I recognize these as different than other radical feminist who I just call in general rad fems

See above.

The rad fems I speak of are the ones that have hypothetical conversations about mutilating men and only using them as eunuch slave labor and a select few to be used solely for sperm farming

Sounds more like 'that thing I heard someone say about someone else I heard.' But sure extremists are in every camp. I doubt they're more numerous than incels though. Or, you know, the people who already mutilate and use women.

Not a call to authority, but it does discredit your accusation of he is only an intellectual for stupid people.

If being credentialed is all they need to assume he's a smart person then I rest my case. Once again, he's a drop in the bucket compared to the amount of credentialed people calling him on his BS.

You can disagree with him that's fine. But insulting his intelligence and the intelligence of his supporters only further proves his point of how feminist write off young men.

I insult his intelligence because he insults the academic discussion with lobster hierarchies. Much the same as I did during the hay day of Dawkins and 'Brights' and any other surface level pop science cult of personality.

Sorry I don't buy into the patriarchy BS.

Okay, I don't buy into the insecure male tin foil doomsday scenario where feminism brings about the end of civilization. Lol

 

[Enoch07]

It depends on how you ask. If you ask it from a Western perspective of strict homo/heterosexuality that tends to get a no because it's not understood or known in other cultures. Our concept of marriage, especially as a choice of love, is often not understood or known in other cultures. Even in the Tanakh those concepts and ideas are absent, but the action of a man sleeping with a man is there.

Yeup like I said earlier LGBT folk have been around forever, and will always be around. Don't mistake my reasoning as looking for a way to end homosexuality. That is not a fishing want to fry so to speak. I am more interested in the fundamental issues that could possibly be the cause of many of our woes as human beings.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

That's how evolution works though dear.

How do you think a wood packer could evolve a tongue that goes out a hole in its beak, wraps around its skull, then comes back in near the spine then up into the mouth to rest there.

There is no way these birds thought of the idea of an extra long tongue then willed it into existence.

That's Lamarkism, not evolution. A giraffe doesn't stretch its neck because it wants the leaves, the neck elongates and the giraffe finds itself being able to reach regardless of will. The mutation has no will. And the vast majority are neutral with neither positive nor negative benefit.
Woodpecker tongues, like giraffe necks, are not extraordinary structures, just elongated. Lots of birds have elongated hyoids without the wrapping about the back of the skull, with muscles that go the same direction to move it. So all you would have to do is elongate the structures further with no alteration to function. Birds with shorter but still long hyoids and tongues like flickers use the tongue for grabbing prey, but from the ground instead of wood cavities.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Yeup like I said earlier LGBT folk have been around forever, and will always be around. Don't mistake my reasoning as looking for a way to end homosexuality. That is not a fishing want to fry so to speak. I am more interested in the fundamental issues that could possibly be the cause of many of our woes as human beings.

It's probably because nature doesn't care about things being nice and neatly this or that. Humans, however, often do like to try to make everything fit into a box of this or that. But evolution doesn't happen if things operate perfectly. If genetic reproduction were perfect, we would still be single celled organisms swimming around thermal vents in the ocean. But instead of black and white nature gave us a rainbow of colors. And, really, are views of homosexuality and heterosexuality themselves are still pretty recent and new concepts. It's always been sex, and we've had it for this reason and that reason, said it's been ok to be attracted to this person but not that, but attractions and acts with one sex or the other has typically been viewed as sex with a same/different sex partner, a variation of the same act rather than two different acts of themselves. And it does seem research is "going full circle" and getting us back to when we didn't think of sex as an attraction to this sex or that but something that is sex, but minus arranged marriages (as we often are anymore) and pressures to reproduce because we are not in any immediate danger of going extinct. Kind of like the animals we are. We just do it because it's a part of our genetic wiring.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The rad fems I speak of are the ones that have hypothetical conversations about mutilating men and only using them as eunuch slave labor and a select few to be used solely for sperm farming.

I've met a lot of people. A lot of strange people, unusual people, interesting people, fascinating people, scary people, wonderful people and terrible people. But I've never met anyone like that. Not doubting they exist, but I doubt they are more than a few.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That's Lamarkism, not evolution. A giraffe doesn't stretch its neck because it wants the leaves, the neck elongates and the giraffe finds itself being able to reach regardless of will. The mutation has no will. And the vast majority are neutral with neither positive nor negative benefit.
Woodpecker tongues, like giraffe necks, are not extraordinary structures, just elongated. Lots of birds have elongated hyoids without the wrapping about the back of the skull, with muscles that go the same direction to move it. So all you would have to do is elongate the structures further with no alteration to function. Birds with shorter but still long hyoids and tongues like flickers use the tongue for grabbing prey, but from the ground instead of wood cavities.

And those difference arise naturally. In any population there will be variation. Take an early population of giraffes for example. If the climate changed so that giraffes with a longer neck would have an advantage there would be naturally more giraffes with longer necks since those with the genes for a long neck would be more likely to survive and pass their genes on. As long as the evolutionary pressure is on the genome of the species will change. No "wanting" no special helper needed.

 

[Enoch07]

Source? Not just an example. but 'the few that have been apprehended' and 'a lot.' The ones doing the violence here were anarchists, leaving anarchy tags.

Certainly,

Former Antifa member admitting college professors are pushing these ideologies (critical race theory, intersectionality, etc) onto students.
Do colleges 'incubate' Antifa violence? Fmr. member says yes (VIDEO)

Iowa Professor that supports Antifa.
Iowa professor resigns after saying he's affiliated with antifa

Yvette Felarca leader of BAMM a group who's member are also Antifa. She is a teacher by profession.
BAMN - Wikipedia

Eric Clanton a college ethics professor (lol) at Diablo Valley College. He smashed a man in the head with a heavy duty bike lock. Originally ally charged with 4 account if assault with a deadly weapon.
Former college professor takes 3-year probation plea deal in assault case

And more, it's an epidemic in U.S. colleges and it needs to be dealt with. Can't have professors inciting blind hatred and violence.

See above.

Fine zealot feminist then.

Sounds more like 'that thing I heard someone say about someone else I heard.'

No, twitter is rife with these girls. I've read many of these "hypothetical" conversations. At a certain point it's no longer hypothetical it's just blind hatred and bigotry.

But sure extremists are in every camp.

Agreed.

I doubt they're more numerous than incels though.

No clue, its hard to tell. There are lots on both sides on Twitter.

Or, you know, the people who already mutilate and use women.

Agreed, A-holes including abusive lesbians who rape other women at college at the same rate as men.

If being credentialed is all they need to assume he's a smart person then I rest my case. Once again, he's a drop in the bucket compared to the amount of credentialed people calling him on his BS.

Just have to agree to disagree. I haven't seen anyone touch Jordan yet. The best I've seen so far is a YTer named ContraPoints. While she had some good argument against him she also had some of his fundamental ideas completely wrong. Imo he is just top far ahead for most of his detractors to keep up.

I insult his intelligence because he insults the academic discussion with lobster hierarchies.

That's a cop out. We study and compare human and animals social structures all the time. Doesn't mean they are the Sam's but there are parallels to be drawn. We are animals at our core after all.

Okay, I don't buy into the insecure male tin foil doomsday scenario where feminism brings about the end of civilization.

Well feminism all by itself will not bring about the end of civilization.

But it might play a role (if I am correct) in the degradation fo society. This is evidenced by violent feminist of the past like Rote Zora - Wikipedia and the above mentioned Antifa/BAMN and other associated groups that have no issues using violence to further their political agenda.

 

[Enoch07]

The mutation has no will.

Of course not, but the purpose of evolution is to adapt/evolve. If we have a huge overpopulation problem it's possible homosexuality could be a evolutionary trait to combat overpopulation.