Genesis of Genesis: Where Did the Biblical Story of Creation Come From?

[sooda]

Do you believe Jesus existed?

Yep...……...

 

[sooda]

so.....in the beginning....
creation was not a tried and true method
some unusual shapes took form
and then needed to be …..undone

got it

If anything, the author seems to go out of his way to negate the older creation myths. For example, if the ancient Canaanite myth pits God against sea monsters before creating the world, the author of Genesis 1 has God creating them: “And God created great whales” (1:21).

However, those “great whales” are a mistranslation of the Hebrew word "taninim", which today means "crocodile" but back in ancient times, meant "serpentine sea monster".

In other words, Genesis 1 describes God creating the very sea-serpents that he vanquished in the ancient Canaanite myth (and that also appeared in Isaiah, Job and Psalms).

 

[Thief]

If anything, the author seems to go out of his way to negate the older creation myths. For example, if the ancient Canaanite myth pits God against sea monsters before creating the world, the author of Genesis 1 has God creating them: “And God created great whales” (1:21).

However, those “great whales” are a mistranslation of the Hebrew word "taninim", which today means "crocodile" but back in ancient times, meant "serpentine sea monster".

In other words, Genesis 1 describes God creating the very sea-serpents that he vanquished in the ancient Canaanite myth (and that also appeared in Isaiah, Job and Psalms).

hmmmm……..

some photos of deep sea creatures display forms of life that are truly
a nightmare

and bump

all the way back to a thread I posted years ago
does God dream?

 

[YoursTrue]

If anything, the author seems to go out of his way to negate the older creation myths. For example, if the ancient Canaanite myth pits God against sea monsters before creating the world, the author of Genesis 1 has God creating them: “And God created great whales” (1:21).

However, those “great whales” are a mistranslation of the Hebrew word "taninim", which today means "crocodile" but back in ancient times, meant "serpentine sea monster".

In other words, Genesis 1 describes God creating the very sea-serpents that he vanquished in the ancient Canaanite myth (and that also appeared in Isaiah, Job and Psalms).

It is possible (likely) that there were transmissions from generation to generation that reflected what happened "in the beginning" until the time Moses (who you don't believe existed as a particular person as described in the scriptures,but allowing for the possibility of verbal and written transmission) wrote down what he did, and which was preserved by the Jews. As far as words and translations and etymologies, some of those things (remember I said 'some,' and not 'all') are not that important. To clarify that point, some words that have been translated erroneously or from a lingual aspect are important for scholars to detail as more knowledge is attained.

 

[sooda]

It is possible (likely) that there were transmissions from generation to generation that reflected what happened "in the beginning" until the time Moses (who you don't believe existed as a particular person as described in the scriptures,but allowing for the possibility of verbal and written transmission) wrote down what he did, and which was preserved by the Jews. As far as words and translations and etymologies, some of those things (remember I said 'some,' and not 'all') are not that important. To clarify that point, some words that have been translated erroneously or from a lingual aspect are important for scholars to detail as more knowledge is attained.

Well, no. The Hebrews got it from the north coast Canaanites.

Elohim

Bible scholars have been studying the Ugaritic tablets for years now.

Ugarit

 

[YoursTrue]

Yep...……...

You DO believe Jesus existed?? On what basis, since some say he did not exist as written in the scriptures commonly known as the Bible.

 

[sooda]

You DO believe Jesus existed?? On what basis, since some say he did not exist as written in the scriptures commonly known as the Bible.

Already told you I did. Are you familiar with Early Christian Writings?

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha ...
earlychristianwritings.com
Early Christian Writings is the most complete collection of Christian texts before the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. The site provides translations and commentary for these sources, including the New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers, and some non-Christian references.

 

[YoursTrue]

Well, no. The Hebrews got it from the north coast Canaanites.

Elohim

Bible scholars have been studying the Ugaritic tablets for years now.

Ugarit

Well, not necessarily. Languages change, they can morph. Elohim doesn't matter what 'language' it stems from in particular.

 

[sooda]

Well, not necessarily. Languages change, they can morph. Elohim doesn't matter what 'language' it stems from in particular.

You don't read any of the links I offer you, do you?

The word Elohim occurs more than 2500 times in the Hebrew Bible, with meanings ranging from “gods” in a general sense (as in Exodus 12:12, where it describes “the gods of Egypt”), to specific gods (e.g., 1 Kings 11:33, where it describes Chemosh “the god of Moab”, or the frequent references to Yahweh as the “elohim” of Israel), to demons, seraphim, and other supernatural beings, to the spirits of the dead brought up at the behest of King Saul in 1 Samuel 28:13, and even to kings and prophets (e.g., Exodus 4:16).[5] The phrase bene elohim, translated “sons of the Gods”, has an exact parallel in Ugaritic and Phoenician texts, referring to the council of the gods.[

 

[sooda]

Overview of the Texts of Ugarit
All of the texts found at Ugarit come from the Late Bronze Age (c. 1550 BCE – c. 1200 BCE). Currently eight different languages are attested in texts from Ugarit: Sumerian, Akkadian, Hittite, Luwian, Hurrian, Egyptian, Cypriot-Minoan, and Ugaritic. While five distinctive writing systems were used at Ugarit, the two most common were the Sumero-Akkadian logo-syllabic and Ugaritic.

The former was used to write Sumerian, Akkadian, Hittite, and Hurrian. The latter was used to write Ugaritic, Hurrian, and, to a lesser extent, Akkadian. Included among the myriad texts found at Ugarit are a number of bi- and trilingual texts. Despite composing a minority of the corpus, the most famous of the Ugaritic texts are the mythical poetic texts, such as the Baal Cycle, due to the light they shed on the Hebrew Bible.

Found among the texts of Ugarit are the typical Ancient Near Eastern texts such as the Epic of Gilgamesh and the Mesopotamian Flood Story. Yet, there were a number of texts unique to Ugarit discovered. Due to its length, approximately 2350 lines, and relative completeness of the six tablets, the most important text found at Ugarit is the Baal Cycle (CTU 1.1-6).

 

[YoursTrue]

Already told you I did. Are you familiar with Early Christian Writings?

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha ...
earlychristianwritings.com
Early Christian Writings is the most complete collection of Christian texts before the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. The site provides translations and commentary for these sources, including the New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers, and some non-Christian references.

So you believe he existed but take what you want from various texts as you see it. I believe in the generally accepted 66 books of the holy scriptures, put together and sealed by God. Maybe you believe someone substituted for him on the cross. Or that he was married to Mary Magdalene. There were other Jewish writings outside of the Torah or Tanach, but not sealed by the Jews.
You believe Jesus existed, you're answering me pretty quickly now so I figure you're online right now. I will ask you another question, sorry if I am repeating it, but didn't see it answered. Did Jesus speak truth?

 

[YoursTrue]

You don't read any of the links I offer you, do you?

The word Elohim occurs more than 2500 times in the Hebrew Bible, with meanings ranging from “gods” in a general sense (as in Exodus 12:12, where it describes “the gods of Egypt”), to specific gods (e.g., 1 Kings 11:33, where it describes Chemosh “the god of Moab”, or the frequent references to Yahweh as the “elohim” of Israel), to demons, seraphim, and other supernatural beings, to the spirits of the dead brought up at the behest of King Saul in 1 Samuel 28:13, and even to kings and prophets (e.g., Exodus 4:16).[5] The phrase bene elohim, translated “sons of the Gods”, has an exact parallel in Ugaritic and Phoenician texts, referring to the council of the gods.[

I already know much of that about elohim. Not sure about the number of times it appears, but I do know it has a range of meaning. Glad you know something about it, too. There are instances of those (in the Bible) where some claimed to call upon the true God, but they did not worship Him. So yes, elohim can have various applications.

 

[sooda]

Well, not necessarily. Languages change, they can morph. Elohim doesn't matter what 'language' it stems from in particular.

The cuneiform writings are in 5 languages so they were highly literate. You can't know if you don't read. Elohim is plural and used many different ways over 2500 times in the Bible.

The Ugaritic tablets have helped them translate the Dead Sea Scrolls.

This stuff isn't supernatural.

 

[YoursTrue]

The cuneiform writings are in 5 languages so they were highly literate. You can't know if you don't read. Elohim is plural and used many different ways over 2500 times in the Bible.

The Ugaritic tablets have helped them translate the Dead Sea Scrolls.

This stuff isn't supernatural.

OK, but allow me to ask you how many gods does the Bible speak of.

 

[Wandering Monk]

There is an interesting bit in a Jewish publication called 'Bible Basics' by Jerome S. Hahn (ISBN 0-87306-748-7.)

On page 31 of the paperback version:

For example, the Hebrew word for "man" is adam. The name itself is derived from the word adamah meaning "ground," from which the first man was created. It is also a composite of the word dam, which means blood, and the first letter of the Hebrew alphabet, alef, which alludes to God.
​

Once could infer here that this second reading indicates that man was created from the blood of God.

I find this very interesting in light of the Babylonian creation account that man was created from the blood of the god Kingu.

 

[sooda]

There is an interesting bit in a Jewish publication called 'Bible Basics' by Jerome S. Hahn (ISBN 0-87306-748-7.)

On page 31 of the paperback version:

For example, the Hebrew word for "man" is adam. The name itself is derived from the word adamah meaning "ground," from which the first man was created. It is also a composite of the word dam, which means blood, and the first letter of the Hebrew alphabet, alef, which alludes to God.
​

Once could infer here that this second reading indicates that man was created from the blood of God.

I find this very interesting in light of the Babylonian creation account that man was created from the blood of the god Kingu.

Yep.. During the Exile in Babylon the Hebrews realized they needed a foundational myth of their own. They must have been very impressed with the Babylonians. Read up on the good figs and the bad figs. Only the good figs were taken into exile in Babylon.

 

[sooda]

OK, but allow me to ask you how many gods does the Bible speak of.

There are many to include Baal, El, Ashera and Yam..

The Bible’s Many Gods | Gerald McDermott | First Things
Web Exclusivesthe-bibles-many-gods

Jan 20, 2014 · The idea that there are other “gods” who exist as real supernatural beings, albeit infinitely inferior to the only Creator and Redeemer, pervades the Bible. The Psalms fairly explode with evidence. “There is none like you among the gods, O Lord” (86:8); “For great is the Lord, and greatly ...

 

[Wandering Monk]

Though you will find Jews and Christians tap dancing on this point, one of the names of God in the Genesis accounts is 'elohim' which is a plural, literally, 'gods.'

In the beginning gods created the heaven and the earth.

Another interesting aside: in the Enuma Elish the god got tires of tedious labor and so created man to do their work for them. The gods needed a 'Sabbath rest' so to speak.

 

[sooda]

Though you will find Jews and Christians tap dancing on this point, one of the names of God in the Genesis accounts is 'elohim' which is a plural, literally, 'gods.'

In the beginning gods created the heaven and the earth.

Another interesting aside: in the Enuma Elish the god got tires of tedious labor and so created man to do their work for them. The gods needed a 'Sabbath rest' so to speak.

The Jews emerged from the Canaanites. They had the same gods and were polytheistic. Read up on the Ugaratic Tablets. There's no doubt.

The Bible’s Many Gods | Gerald McDermott | First Things
Web Exclusivesthe-bibles-many-gods
Jan 20, 2014 · The idea that there are other “gods” who exist as real supernatural beings, albeit infinitely inferior to the only Creator and Redeemer, pervades the Bible. The Psalms fairly explode with evidence. “There is none like you among the gods, O Lord” (86:8); “For great is the Lord, and greatly ...

 

[sooda]

OK, but allow me to ask you how many gods does the Bible speak of.

El, Baal, Yam, Asherah and Nehushtan for starters... and Molech.