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Genesis 1

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by Mister Emu, Jul 12, 2005.

  1. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    I really enjoy the King James Version, both because I find the language beautiful, and because I find the translation not too literal so as to be unreadable, nor too contemporary(I can't think of the word, as in when you paraphrase).

    I believe that this describes a literal event that occured at a specific point, the beginning of earthly creation.
     
  2. Steve

    Steve Active Member

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    I too agree that this describes a literal event. Although im not sure that KJV is the best translation in parts. Genesis is also written as history and as such should be taken as history by those who claim to belive the Bible.
    In Mark 10:6 Jesus makes it clear that he belives that humans were created at the beginning not towards the end. "But at the beginning of creation God 'made them male and female.'

    I think the author of life would know.


    http://answersingenesis.org/creation/v16/i1/genesis.asp - Should Genesis be taken literally
     
  3. jewscout

    jewscout Religious Zionist

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    I think the Gan Eden story was to show a few things,
    The first being the dual nature of Man, being both of the material and spiritual world (this can be seen in the word "vayyitzer" which is usually spelled w/ just 1 "yod")
    i think it also shows the first instance where man's yetzer ra (evil inclination)takes control and causes the first transgression against HaShem.
    I think it is also there to show where man could be (a spiritual perfection ie Eden) and how through not abiding by HaShem's law man lost that, but that, i believe, it can be regained through good deeds and mitzvot...

    but that's just my personal opinion...i could be wrong....
     
  4. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    To me Genesis 1... is seting out the mythology of the start of everythig as understood by the Jewish people at that time.
    It is not stating factual events except that God was the creator of the universe.
    Terry
    ________________________________

    Blessed are the pure of heart, they shall behold their God.
     
  5. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    I must admit that I thought the same.:)
     
  6. Original Freak

    Original Freak I am the ORIGINAL Freak

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    well I agree with that.
     
  7. Katzpur

    Katzpur Not your average Mormon

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    Well, if we want to drag this out and/or make our discussion more interesting, we could debate the doctrine of an ex nihilo creation (which I believe to be false) as well as the generally accepted belief that when God said He created us in His image and after His likeness, He was speaking figuratively as opposed to literally (a belief I also take issue with). Or I could just keep my mouth shut. ;)

    Kathryn
     
  8. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    I will go along with that.
    The problem with the man image thing is, when we eventualy meet inteligence from space, will they look just like us if they were also created on their own worlds in the image of God.
    I belive God has no Image as such, Christ was a man and had an image though we have no record of it.
    Terry
    _______________________________
    Amen! Truly I say to you: Gather in my name. I am with you.
     
  9. Linus

    Linus Well-Known Member

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    It depends on how you interpret the phrase "made in God's image". I do not take this as saying "let's make man to look like us." I believe it is saying something more like, "let's make man to have a spiritual side, an eternal side, like we have." After all the text says, "Let us make man in our own image" If we are talking about physical appearances, then we must assume that whomever God was talking to looked just like God Himself.

    So, if we ever do meet intelligent life, I believe they can look different and still have a spiritual side. Who knows, God may have a completely different plan for them...
     
  10. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    I agree Linus; it would not make sense if it was to be taken literally, because it would imply that God has corporeal form; I am far happier with your interpretaion as 'being able to do good deed, to heal others....':)
     
  11. Katzpur

    Katzpur Not your average Mormon

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    Yes, it definitely would imply that.

    I'd be interested in hearing your interpretation of Genesis 5:1, in which we are told that "...Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth." The wording is identical to that in Genesis 1:26 where we read, "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness."

    Why are you so sure that God does not have a corporeal form? Aside from John 4:24 ("God is spirit..."), which is also correctly translated as "God is life," what scriptures can you cite to support your position? There are quite a number of verses which I believe support mine.

    Kathryn
     
  12. Katzpur

    Katzpur Not your average Mormon

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    Hi, Terry.

    So are you saying that we weren't created in God's image, or that we were, but He doesn't have one? And what do you mean when you said that Christ "had an image though we have no record of it"?

    Also consider Hebrews 1:1-3, which says, "God… hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person… sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high…"

    If God the Father has no image and is an invisible essence, why does this scripture say that the Son was in the express image of his person? If Paul were trying to describe the similarities between the Father and the Son, he could easily have come up with a great many words that would be less ambiguous. Why the use of a phrase which seems pretty clear in stating that Jesus looks like His Father?

    Kathryn
     
  13. Katzpur

    Katzpur Not your average Mormon

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    Hi, Linus.

    I'm curious what the basis for your belief is, other than that it is probably what you've always been taught to believe.

    Kathryn
     
  14. jewscout

    jewscout Religious Zionist

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    Deut. 4:15-16

    HaShem has no form, if He were to have a form then we could create images of Him, this would lead to idolitry which He points out often is a big no-no

     
  15. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    My belief is that much of the Bible was never intended to be taken literally. amongst primitive peoples there is a long oral tradition and most are accustomed to interpret what they hear. I am sure the same is true of the Biblical stories which would have been known a spread verbally before they were written down. Even stories in Pauls epistles were second hand as he never met Christ.

    Even though I believe Bible stories should not be taken literally, they would not have survived if they did not have a message to tell, and a lesson to learn.

    As for man being in Gods image , this I believe to be no more than a fable.

    Terry
    ______________________________
    Blessed are the poor in spirit, the kingdom of heaven is theirs.
     
  16. Melody

    Melody Well-Known Member

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    While looking for some other information, I found this site. I thought you might find the following article interesting as it deals with the cultural background of Genesis. Here's another link you might find useful.

    I do not believe in the literal interpretation of Genesis in that there was an actual Adam and Eve who populated the entire earth. I think it is more of an allegory and Adam and Eve represent humanity. The same for the creation of the universe. I had a wonderful OT professor at the Quaker college I attended and he neatly tied creationism with the big bang theory and its various eras. Wish I could find my notes.
     
  17. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    I agree Jewscout - but the representations of Jesus on the cross, and of Mary, with the infant Jesus are often 'idolotrized'.:)
     
  18. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

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    I claim emphatically, and without equivocation, and this claim you MUST accept:

    I don't have a stinking clue. I am at a loss as to how I am supposed to take Genesis and the account of creation. Next question?
     
  19. jewscout

    jewscout Religious Zionist

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    well again the rule against idolitry is a thing for the Jews. The way i view the words of the Torah, a non-jew can worship HaShem in any manner they choose, they have that luxury.
     
  20. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    Thanks Melody
    Two excellent references.

    Terry
    _____________________________--
    Blessed are the poor in spirit, the kingdom of heaven is theirs.
     
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