Gay Christian

[mikkel_the_dane]

No, what Jesus said is that He doesn't judge, but if I judge my judgment is true.
Doesn't make sense as we receive that in modern bibles. What He meant is
that God alone decides on the outcome of people lives - he is The Judge.
But Jesus judged what was right and wrong. Without the ability to discern right
and wrong you are essentially an immoral person.

Okay, I am social misfit and an immoral person.
But you don't have to be able to judge what is right or wrong. Most people don't do that according to you, yet as far as I can tell, they still have good lives and try to live with love.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

As Steven Weinberg said,
"With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil - that takes religion.”

Well, the bold one is without evidence and thus nothing but a belief itself. So there is that.

 

[PruePhillip]

Well, I am a social misfit then.
But you see, I do this one below differently.
To kill another human is to me, remember I am a social misfit, neither right nor wrong. Nor is the killer good or bad. I know nothing of that, I leave that to God. What I can say, is that I don't want that to have happened and in some cases, I don't want the person out and about in society, because of the probability of it happening again.
The judgement of an other human as a human belong to God and not other humans.

By way of examples.
It has been said of modern Americans that the only place they will respect the law is in an airplane.
Now that's sad. It shows the Covid explosion in America in a predictable light.
America, only three times bigger than Japan, has as many Covid cases every eight hours as Japan
has in a year. And 100,000 Americans are shot a year, against half dozen in Japan.
In Asia people are more respectful. Americans struggle to even agree on whether there even IS such
a thing as right and wrong. And as you say, to killing isn't clear cut anymore.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

By way of examples.
It has been said of modern Americans that the only place they will respect the law is in an airplane.
Now that's sad. It shows the Covid explosion in America in a predictable light.
America, only three times bigger than Japan, has as many Covid cases every eight hours as Japan
has in a year. And 100,000 Americans are shot a year, against half dozen in Japan.
In Asia people are more respectful. Americans struggle to even agree on whether there even IS such
a thing as right and wrong. And as you say, to killing isn't clear cut anymore.

I don't think it is that simple as just to compare statics. But that is me.

 

[PruePhillip]

Okay, I am social misfit and an immoral person.
But you don't have to be able to judge what is right or wrong. Most people don't do that according to you, yet as far as I can tell, they still have good lives and try to live with love.

Depends on what you mean by "good life." Once you went to jail for gambling.
In 1900 there was anxiety because divorce had reached "epidemic" proportions.
It was just 3%. Now half of our kids come from "single parent" families, with all
the attendant social problems.
So "good lives" needs careful defining.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Depends on what you mean by "good life." Once you went to jail for gambling.
In 1900 there was anxiety because divorce had reached "epidemic" proportions.
It was just 3%. Now half of our kids come from "single parent" families, with all
the attendant social problems.
So "good lives" needs careful defining.

Yeah, and that defining is done subjectively by humans including you.

 

[PruePhillip]

As Steven Weinberg said,
"With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil - that takes religion.”

See how many people Mao and Stalin killed in the name of "dialetic materialism"?
The Inquisition killed about a million people over 600 years. These guys could do
that in a day. And Stalin was going to be a priest and Mao came from a Buddhist
household.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

See how many people Mao and Stalin killed in the name of "dialetic materialism"?
The Inquisition killed about a million people over 600 years. These guys could do
that in a day. And Stalin was going to be a priest and Mao came from a Buddhist
household.

Don't understand your point?

 

[Altfish]

Well, the bold one is without evidence and thus nothing but a belief itself. So there is that.

9/11
Shelley Shannon
Scott Roeder
Manchester Arena Bombing
....need I go on?

 

[Altfish]

See how many people Mao and Stalin killed in the name of "dialetic materialism"?
The Inquisition killed about a million people over 600 years. These guys could do
that in a day. And Stalin was going to be a priest and Mao came from a Buddhist
household.

So, because tyranical dictators (Very bad men to start with) are you saying that absolves religious people?

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

9/11
Shelley Shannon
Scott Roeder
Manchester Arena Bombing
....need I go on?

You haven't explained with evidence what good and bad people are. So now I wait. Further you have to explain what religion is within methodological and how "religion" causes "good" people to do "bad"? And if that is only "religion", which does that?

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

So, because tyranical dictators (Very bad men to start with) are you saying that absolves religious people?

Evidence as per science that they are bad.

 

[Altfish]

Evidence as per science that they are bad.

You are joking, of course.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

You are joking, of course.

Still waiting for evidence.

 

[Mock Turtle]

See how many people Mao and Stalin killed in the name of "dialetic materialism"?
The Inquisition killed about a million people over 600 years. These guys could do
that in a day. And Stalin was going to be a priest and Mao came from a Buddhist
household.

Perhaps the quote should have been - With or without ideology, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil - that takes ideology - and where the latter would encompass religions, political beliefs, etc., but then the quote would lose much of its strength perhaps, even if it was then true.

 

[stvdv]

Jesus, according to the Bible, was clear ... "Thou shall not judge"
Whether/how you want to follow this or not, is up to you. I do not judge you for interpreting it one way or the other. It's your believe, your call.

No

You said "NO" ... on the Bible verse I quoted + I was totally respecting whatever you want to believe

Do you ever say "YES"?

 

[stvdv]

Jesus, according to the Bible, was clear ... "Thou shall not judge"
Whether/how you want to follow this or not, is up to you. I do not judge you for interpreting it one way or the other. It's your believe, your call.

No. what Jesus said is that He doesn't judge

Why you say "NO" to my reply. The verse I quoted by giving a link said:

"1Do not judge, or you will be judged. 2For with the same judgment you pronounce, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you"

 

[stvdv]

Jesus, according to the Bible, was clear ... "Thou shall not judge"
Whether/how you want to follow this or not, is up to you. I do not judge you for interpreting it one way or the other. It's your believe, your call.

No. what Jesus said is that He doesn't judge

"NO"???

It does not say what you said Jesus had said in the verse I quoted:

"1Do not judge, or you will be judged. 2For with the same judgment you pronounce, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you"

 

[stvdv]

Jesus, according to the Bible, was clear ... "Thou shall not judge"
Whether/how you want to follow this or not, is up to you. I do not judge you for interpreting it one way or the other. It's your believe, your call.

Matthew 7:1 "Do not judge, or you will be judged.

"1Do not judge, or you will be judged. 2For with the same judgment you pronounce, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you"

No. what Jesus said is that He doesn't judge
but if I judge my judgment is true.

Strange sequence these 2. If Jesus does not judge ... why continue with "but if I judge", if He never judges?

 

[PruePhillip]

Matthew 7:1 "Do not judge, or you will be judged.




Strange sequence these 2. If Jesus does not judge ... why continue with "but if I judge", if He never judges?

So if someone kills another person you don't judge that as being wrong?
Why did the Apostles judge?