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Featured From where did the "wives" of Cain and Abel come?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Jonathan Bailey, Nov 12, 2019.

  1. firedragon

    firedragon Well-Known Member

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    Sorry bro. I dont have any faith in Saul. I mean not even compared to the Genesis. So this is completely invalid for me. But I do understand the Christian faith so all good.

    This part I didn't understand.
     
  2. 101G

    101G Member

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    sure, man/Adam was formed on day 3. supportive scripture, Genesis 2:4 "These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens," Genesis 2:5 "And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground." Genesis 2:6 "But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground." Genesis 2:7 "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

    man was "Formed" from the dust of the earth BEFORE any plans was in the earth, and BEFORE any herb grew. ok, when did the plants & herbs grew? answer Genesis chapter 1,

    Genesis 1:9 "And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so." Genesis 1:10 "And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good." Genesis 1:11 "And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so." Genesis 1:12 "And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good." Genesis 1:13 "And the evening and the morning were the third day."
    so, the Grass/herb, and the plants/trees grew in the earth on day 3. but "before" this God formed man. so chapter 2 gives us more detail as to what happen in chapter 1.

    PICJAG.
     
  3. RedDragon94

    RedDragon94 Lectio Divina

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    My theory: In essence the same way Adam and Eve were.

    As a Theistic Evolutionist I believe that Adam and Eve were the first evolved species. Cain and Abel's wives were probably a very close species to what humans are now. But I don't know. I wonder what a 6 day creationist would say.
     
  4. 101G

    101G Member

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    THE BIBLE IS CLEAR, Adam the first man with his wife produce children "in" the Garden without sin, before they had children "outside" the garden in sin. this is where the sons of God in chapter 6 comes from.

    for there are two lines from Adam. a fallen line ..... us, (which came from outside the garden). and a unfallen line .... the sons of God, without sin (from within the garden). other words the save and the unsave meet, just as today.

    PICJAG.
     
  5. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    You read that in the Bible? Where, may I ask?
     
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  6. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    Was wondering the same thing myself.....:shrug:
     
  7. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    If Adam and his wife produced sinless children "IN" the garden before they had sinful children "outside".....where are these children now? If God flooded the whole world because of what these sons of God did back then, how could they have been sinless? Sin is the cause of death. If someone is sinless, there is no natural cause of death. They would still be alive.

    Spirit beings can materialize and the ones who were responsible for God bringing the flood were materialized angels who took human women and produced children from them.....monstrous freaks with a violent and immoral disposition.
    Your story does not line up with the scriptures I'm afraid.

    There is nothing like this in the Bible.....you have made it up by imagining your own scenario.

    Do you understand the mechanics of the ransom sacrifice of Jesus Christ? If you did then you would understand why your story is way off the mark.
     
  8. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    Good points. I was wondering where Romans 5:12, and Acts 17:26 would fit, but then some persons have said outright, they don't deal with Paul, so some have ripped thirteen whole books out the Bible... apparently.
     
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  9. firedragon

    firedragon Well-Known Member

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    Ok brother. Thanks a lot for the kind elaboration. I understand now.
     
  10. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    The Nephilim are from a much, much older Babylonian myth.
     
  11. 101G

    101G Member

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    GINOLJC, to all.
    We'll give you the scriptures first and see if you obtain the understanding, if not we'll discuss the scriptures given. scripture #1. Genesis 3:16. scripture #2. Genesis 3:20. both of these scriptures give us the understanding of the children of Adam and Eve in the garden before they had Cain and Abel outside the garden. now one more that indirectly tells us the same thing, Genesis 2:24. I pray that your understanding be open.

    PICJAG.
     
  12. 101G

    101G Member

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    Good question, I'll get stright to the point, listen, Daniel 4:13 "I saw in the visions of my head upon my bed, and, behold, a watcher and an holy one came down from heaven;" a watcher is an "angel", but who is the holy one?. those who was sinless, who was born in the garden. a holy one is human, just as we, who was fallen are to be holy like our father. Leviticus 20:7 "Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the LORD your God." and this is confirmed in the NT, 1 Peter 1:15 "But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;" 1 Peter 1:16 "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy." these holy ones, who was without sin, had a right to heaven in the beginning.
    ERROR, those are fables, old wives tales. the sons of God mention in Genesis 6 is the same people of Genesis 4:13 -14 "And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear." 14 "Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.". ok, who are these that find Cain and find out what he did might kill him? yes, that's right those who was born in the Garden and now is or are filling the earth. understand the unfallen females mated with the fallen line in the beginning, hence where Cain got his wife. and in Genesis 6, the males of the unfallen line started to mate with the fallen line from Adam and Eve. the question remains, "how long was Adam and Eve hading children in the garden before they sinned and was kicked out of the garden. now one other evidence, Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God. this is not a pre-incarnate of the Lord Jesus. no, this was a living breathing man. and no one had any record of his birth nor his death, he never died. the difference between Melchisedec and the Lord Jesus is Melchisedec was a "Priest" not a "High Priest", but a priest of the most high. our lord Jesus is the most high, who is the "High Priest".
    so we suggest you study this, for there are two lines from Adam. one line sinless born in the garden, and a line born outside the garden in sin. for the bible is written for us who are in that line outside the garden, now available to be restored to pardise lost..

    PICJAG.
     
  13. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    Genesis 3:16 ? What is the relevance of that to "Adam the first man with his wife produce children "in" the Garden without sin"?
    Genesis 3:20 Adam gave his wife a name, in anticipation of what God purposed for them at Genesis 1:28 ? Again. I don't see the relevance.

    Genesis 2:24 Ah. Marriage. Why a man must consider his wife as one with him - his own flesh, so that his father and mother should not come between them. Good for mother-in-laws to keep in mind. ? I still don't see where "THE BIBLE IS CLEAR, Adam the first man with his wife produce children "in" the Garden without sin, before they had children "outside" the garden in sin. this is where the sons of God in chapter 6 comes from."

    You have presented an idea, but no scripture says anything to support that idea. So I have no problem if you want to discuss the scriptures given.
    Bear in mind though, I am not discussing personal ideas and views, but scripture.
     
    #113 nPeace, Nov 15, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
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  14. Kelly of the Phoenix

    Kelly of the Phoenix Well-Known Member

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    This is why I like other cultural creation myths. While Greeks might not have been able to discuss genetic bottlenecks, they still understood you needed more than two people, which is why they handwaved magic explanations for lots of humans, like dragons' teeth or rocks or whatever to make a lot of people.
     
  15. 101G

    101G Member

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    Thanks for the reply, second, here's the relevance. listen closely, Genesis 3:16 "Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee."

    1st revelation, "I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception". one cannot multiply or increase something that has not yet happen. example, if I was in a car, I cannot increase my speed unless i'm in motion first. knowing that God could not increase Eve sorrow/pain in child birth, for the word "conception" here is the Hebrew word H2032 הֵרוֹן herown (hay-rone') n-m. which means,
    הֵרָיוֹן herayown (hay-raw-yone')
    pregnancy.
    [from H2029]
    KJV: conception.

    now "sorrow" here in this verse is the Hebrew word, H6093 עִצָּבוֹן `itstsabown (its-tsaw-ɓone') n-m.
    worrisomeness, i.e. labor or pain.
    [from H6087]
    KJV: sorrow, toil.
    see it now. understand, one cannot INCREASE a labor pain if it have not already happen. just like increasing or multiplying the speed in your car. one first have to be already moving first. so in order to "increase"/multiply Eve labor pain, (because of the sin), she had to already been having labor pain, (meaning in pregnancy), in order to have them "INCREASED". so that means she was having children already before she sinned, with little or no labor pain, hence the increase, because of sin.
    listen, Genesis 3:20 "And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living."
    see, the name EVE means Mother of all "LIVING". the children she had in the garden before she sinned was "ALIVE" to God. and after the fall all here children born now are dead, Spiritually to God, hence the reason why we need to be "BORN AGAIN" ... Spiritually. see, sin kills. and when she sinned, all the children after are dead "Spiritually" to God. Pardise lost. now the Children born before the fall meet the children after the fall. no fallen angles here. just like today a save person meet a unsaved person. no difference, as to those H1368 גִּבּוֹר gibbowr (ghib-bore') adj. or "giants", again old wives tales, which lord willing we will get to later.

    now the Adam named his wife "EVE". name in the bible have meaning. and Eve have meaning, "she WAS, WAS, WAS, past tense the MOTHER of all LIVING. was designate past tense, she was the Mother of all Living, because now all she will produce from now on are DEAD, or none LIVING. so all her children before was, was ALIVE, sons of God because they was born alive with the Spirit from natural birth without sin. see, one is not called a MOTHER unless she have Children. so if Adam called his wife Eve meaning MOTHER of all living, and had not yet had children, then Adam would have been lying. but by having children she is rightfully is called Mother because she already had children. see the revelation in just the name alone.
    ok, Lastly. punch line, why put this verse in here at this time, "a man leave his father and his mother". this is chapter two, that haven't suppose to have had any children yet? think about it.

    PICJAG.
     
  16. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    So you have no scriptural support. Okay. These are just ideas and views, which I said I am not discussing.
    Also, in Genesis 1 the word multiply is used, but maybe you have other ideas on how you can explain that.

    I'm wondering... Why do you pray that people's understanding be open? Is it because you feel yours is?
     
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  17. 101G

    101G Member

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    First thanks for the reply. second, these are not ideas, but scriptures to read. if you cannot understand it that's ok, just ask the Holy Spirit, and he will teach you.

    now as for the multiply in Genesis, I'm assuming this, Genesis 1:28 "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth."
    here is your answer, see the "Be Frutiful" before the multiply, which have an "AND" in between. this was the command while in the Garden. so they was, was, was, frutiful in the garden, and now ..... multiply ... and replenish the earth. those are three actions. 1. Be fruitful, 2. multiply in that fruitfulness, and 3. cover the earth with that Fruitfulness, which is a state of being extremely productive or prolific. so they had children in the garden. and just as any children that grow up, they leave father and mother and go out into the world... hence the verse Genesis 2:24 ;)

    see, these scriptures are not ideas, but facts, the truth.

    PICJAG
     
  18. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    So. It seems you are saying you have the holy spirit, and understand. Is that correct?
     
  19. 101G

    101G Member

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    YES

    PICJAG.
     
  20. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    @101G the scriptures are indeed not ideas.
    I was referring to your ideas about scripture.
    There is a difference there. Your ideas are not supported by scripture, therefore your ideas cannot be truth and facts, but what we read in scripture is.
    We just need to understand them.
     
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