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Featured From Whence Cometh This Nonsense?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Rival, Sep 14, 2020.

  1. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    I keep hearing certain folks going on about how Jesus was a king. Josephus wrote the Gospels. Jesus is buried in England. Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene. All this.

    Where does this, frankly, rubbish come from? Any New Testament scholar will tell you that we know next to nothing about the historical Jesus so who came up with these ramblings and from where?
     
    #1 Rival, Sep 14, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2020
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  2. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
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    Some people sit firmly behind "you can not prove it wrong, there fore it is right".
    Though they hide it behind "I am right until proven wrong"

    And since the vast majority of the life of Jesus is missing from the Bible....
     
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  3. The Hammer

    The Hammer Virtue, Piety, Study
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    Probably due to misinterpretations of the KJV. Which was meant to make the Religion appear and sound more "Kingly".
     
  4. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    This doesn't make the text say anything different though.
     
  5. The Hammer

    The Hammer Virtue, Piety, Study
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    Didn't it replaced the word "Lord" with "King" I thought, in a lot of instances? This could lead to things like Jesus is King, etc.
     
  6. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    No. And it hardly makes any mention of Jesus surviving the crucifixion and going to England. I have no idea where this comes from.
     
  7. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    I've never heard these claims before.

    Edit: except for "Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene." I think that's from the Da Vinci Code.
     
  8. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    My Dad comes out with them all the time and he listens to this radio programme called Truth Frequency.....

    Seems to spout lots of conspiratorial nonsense about religion, mostly Judaism and Christianity.

    And, well, is pretty all about conspiracies in general.
     
  9. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    One man's rubbish is another man's midrash. I'm not convinced that "Josephus wrote Luke" is any more speculative than is "Keturah is Hagar."
     
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  10. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    This is true. It's the reason I'm asking. It does sound like rubbish to me, since no-one has ever pointed to any foundation for these beliefs or anything to indicate any provenance whatsoever. I just hear them bandied about by conspiracy theorists a whole lot without any sources backing them up. If they wanted to come out and say it's just a religious belief I'd be fine with that, but most of the folks I know who spout this are not religious at all.
     
  11. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    Never heard of that show either. :D
     
  12. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Let me see what I can find. I recall reading (too many years ago) about someone who had done some statistical analysis of Josephus and (if I recall correctly) and Acts. I didn't find it compelling at the time and I doubt that it's improved with age.
     
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  13. crossfire

    crossfire Antinomian feminist heretic freak ☿
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    Perhaps from this: from his birth story: Matthew 2. From his death story: Matthew 27
    no clue
    I dunno, maybe where Mary anointed Jesus' "feet" (compare Ruth 3:3-4) with the expensive spikenard oil in John 12:1-3? :eek:
     
  14. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    But from the rest of the story we learn that he clearly wasn't a king.
     
  15. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Don't worry about it, its just the lifelong work of that small branch of the christian aluminium foil hat society
     
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  16. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Ov Fire and the Void
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    The Da Vinci Code got it from this book: The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail - Wikipedia
     
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  17. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

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    A book calles Holy Blood, Holy Grail, which even the author admits is a speculative what-if.
    That one is rooted in his parables and metaphors along with primary influence found in Revelations.
     
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  18. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    @Rival, continuing for post 12, the person I had in mind was likely Steven Mason.

    The following in from Richard Carrier: Luke and Josephus (2000)

    There has long been the observation that Luke-Acts contains numerous parallels with the works of Josephus, generating three different theories to account for this: that Josephus used Luke, that Luke used Josephus, or that they both used some common but now lost source. Steve Mason has reviewed the arguments [1] and in summarizing the evidence concludes that, besides generic parallels of genre and form and the use of identical historical events, which are inconclusive as proofs, the "coincidence ... of aim, themes, and vocabulary ... seems to suggest that Luke-Acts is building its case on the foundation of Josephus' defense of Judaism," and therefore that Luke is consciously and significantly drawing on Josephus to supplement his use of Mark and Q and to create the appearance of a real history, a notable deviation from all the other Gospels which have none of the features of a historical work.​

    ,
     
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  19. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    Thanks Jay; this is the kind of thing I'm looking for.
     
  20. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson Well-Known Member

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    Brits no doubt; from Eddi's muse "Butterfly".
     
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