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For The Many

Altfish

Altfish

Veteran Member
I'm a Labour supporter, I like the recently issued manifesto (although I've not looked in detail) but I don't like Corbyn.
The problem is that he is NOT a good leader. I am trying to get Labour voters that I speak to to vote Labour this time and they are all hesitant because of JC. He gives me no confidence.
Grief, even the Tories see him as their best asset.

He is making a lot a great noises but virtually every time a commentator asks, "How will you pay for that?" Labour trips up. It was Dianne Abbott last week, it is John McDonald this morning, it is poor, very poor. It shows a total lack of competence.

I will vote Labour, not that it'll do any good in my constituency as if they put a blue rosette on a donkey it'd get in.

I dread the next few years because all I can see is blue governments driving the Daily Mail agenda.
 
Rival

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
@Altfish what makes you think he's a bad leader? I've heard people bandying this assertion about and after watching Corbyn a few times I can't see what the problem is. He's much better than May. She won't even show her face and she's terrible at answering questions.
 
The Emperor of Mankind

The Emperor of Mankind

Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic
Rival said:
Not The Few!

What are your opinions about Jeremy Corbyn?

I hope that even if he loses the election he keeps going.

Note this is Socialist only.
Click to expand...

I don't like him much. He's a confused socialist at best, a champagne socialist at worst. He's doing a ****-poor job of leading the Official Opposition: he forced his MPs to back the triggering of Article 50 even though some of them might have wanted to vote against it to represent their constituents, he pressured his MPs into voting for another General Election when all he had to do was vote against and hold out to see if the CPS stripped the Tories of their Parliamentary majority for cheating the last election.

He wants to see Ireland completely free of British dominion he supports Palestinian independence but for some strange reason he wants to keep Scotland in the Union. It doesn't make much sense.

I used to think he was the socialist voice England so desperately needs but now I'm not so sure. He's willing to throw worker's rights & legal protections onto the sacrificial fire because he believes the EU is too cosy with corporations. I'm not sure how he's going to protect worker's rights when the Tories have dismantled them, asset-stripped Britain and turned the UK into a corporate tax-haven populated by people who are essentially indentured serfs on zero hours contracts.

That said, he does seem more of a leader than May. He at least makes decisions and stands up for his principles even if they're ones I don't always agree with.
 
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Altfish

Altfish

Veteran Member
Rival said:
@Altfish what makes you think he's a bad leader? I've heard people bandying this assertion about and after watching Corbyn a few times I can't see what the problem is. He's much better than May. She won't even show her face and she's terrible at answering questions.
Click to expand...
Nowadays, like it or not, leadership in a political sense is how you come over to the electorate when you are on the telly. He does not come over well on the telly. He is not better on the telly than May.
He is not better at PMQs than May, he has not inspired his parliamentary team to back him or the public at large to back him. He has a very loyal band of followers and he plays primarily to those.
He has not been an effective opposition, Strurgeon is the main opposition and she keeps May on her toes.
He has walked into this election with his eyes closed.
He, and his party, could have prevented this election taking place now, the Government needed 75% of parliament to call this election. If Corbyn had told his party to vote against, along with the Lib Dems and the SNP we'd have had an election in May 2020 as planned.
So what, you say?
In 2020 Brexit will have happened; that will not be nice for anyone in the early years (if at all)
In 2020 the economy will be much worse than it is now - this would demonstrate the lack of effectiveness of 5 more years of Tory cuts. After all the economy is already showing signs of a down turn.
In 2020 the NHS will be a mess.

But here we are in 2017 walking into a Tory landslide, despite May being all show and no substance.

No, Corbyn is a good backbench MP but no leader.
 
Rival

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
Altfish said:
Nowadays, like it or not, leadership in a political sense is how you come over to the electorate when you are on the telly. He does not come over well on the telly. He is not better on the telly than May.
He is not better at PMQs than May, he has not inspired his parliamentary team to back him or the public at large to back him. He has a very loyal band of followers and he plays primarily to those.
He has not been an effective opposition, Strurgeon is the main opposition and she keeps May on her toes.
He has walked into this election with his eyes closed.
He, and his party, could have prevented this election taking place now, the Government needed 75% of parliament to call this election. If Corbyn had told his party to vote against, along with the Lib Dems and the SNP we'd have had an election in May 2020 as planned.
So what, you say?
In 2020 Brexit will have happened; that will not be nice for anyone in the early years (if at all)
In 2020 the economy will be much worse than it is now - this would demonstrate the lack of effectiveness of 5 more years of Tory cuts. After all the economy is already showing signs of a down turn.
In 2020 the NHS will be a mess.

But here we are in 2017 walking into a Tory landslide, despite May being all show and no substance.

No, Corbyn is a good backbench MP but no leader.
Click to expand...
These are just your assertions though. A matter of opinion.
 
Altfish

Altfish

Veteran Member
Rival said:
These are just your assertions though. A matter of opinion.
Click to expand...

You see, this is how Corbynites come over, head in sand, hands over ears.
I'm a Labour supporter through and through and WILL vote Labour next month but I am a shrinking band of loyal followers.

If my comments are 'just my assertions'.
How many times has Corbyn troubled May at PMQ? c/w the number of times May has just batted him away.
I know opinion polls have been unreliable but at the moment, the question "Who would make the best PM?" is answered with something like May 45% to Corbyn 20%. These figures are NOT assertions but published polls.
Point me to a good interview he has done on the telly where he has won over voters.
If he has inspired his Parliamentary Party to follow him, why have so many MPs left his cabinet?
Do you think he should have voted for this election? If so why? What are the advantages of an election now rather than in 2020?
I could go on.
 
Rival

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
Altfish said:
You see, this is how Corbynites come over, head in sand, hands over ears.
I'm a Labour supporter through and through and WILL vote Labour next month but I am a shrinking band of loyal followers.

If my comments are 'just my assertions'.
How many times has Corbyn troubled May at PMQ? c/w the number of times May has just batted him away.
I know opinion polls have been unreliable but at the moment, the question "Who would make the best PM?" is answered with something like May 45% to Corbyn 20%. These figures are NOT assertions but published polls.
Point me to a good interview he has done on the telly where he has won over voters.
If he has inspired his Parliamentary Party to follow him, why have so many MPs left his cabinet?
Do you think he should have voted for this election? If so why? What are the advantages of an election now rather than in 2020?
I could go on.
Click to expand...
Hi Altfish

I am currently typing on a phone and have limited internet access. So for now I will only say that *opinion* polls are just that, opinion. Also, I'm not a 'Corbynite' I just think he's better than May; I like many of his Socialist policies and that's about it. I never said he is a wonderful charismatic magician who can work wonders, but when it comes to the election, the Brexit and relations with the EU, Jezza is better.
 
Altfish

Altfish

Veteran Member
Rival said:
Hi Altfish

I am currently typing on a phone and have limited internet access. So for now I will only say that *opinion* polls are just that, opinion. Also, I'm not a 'Corbynite' I just think he's better than May; I like many of his Socialist policies and that's about it. I never said he is a wonderful charismatic magician who can work wonders, but when it comes to the election, the Brexit and relations with the EU, Jezza is better.
Click to expand...

I did declare caution about opinion polls.
Anyone is better than May; but Sturgeon and Farron and Lucas are better than Corbyn.
I agree he is NOT 'a wonderful charismatic magician who can work wonders', I don't think anyone expects him to be.
How is he better at...
  • The election - I've already stated that he has cocked up here
  • Brexit - he has been useless, unsure of his stance all along
  • Relations with EU - totally unproven
 
Notanumber

Notanumber

A Free Man
Rival said:
I'd still vote leave. I'm just so appalled at how unprepared the government, every party, was to deal with it.
Click to expand...

At the time, I called Cameron and Osborne reckless for the way they were prepared to damage the country for their own ends. Then because they hadn’t bothered to prepare for the eventual outcome, Cameron cleared off and left others to sort out their mess.

Having said that I was glad that we were given the opportunity to free ourselves from the corrupt EU and Mrs May has done the right thing by calling this election to ensure that she has a mandate to wave at her EU opponents.

EDIT: General election 2017: Latest polls and odds tracker
 
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rocala

rocala

Well-Known Member
It is Corbyn or what exactly? The only options I have seen are same old, same old.
We have to at least try to get a change.
 
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