For in the way you judge...

[e.r.m.]

Matthew 7:1-3 "Do not judge so that you will not be judged. [2] For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. [3] Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?

I think I understand this one a little better now. It doesn't say don't judge at all. I once wrote a thread where I concluded something like that people were just being overly critical and unmerciful, but I think now that Jesus said this in response to people using a greater measure of judgement on others than they were using on themselves. I believe this is why Jesus said "by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you" and "look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye". I believe he was addressing the inequality. "Your faults are great and deserve judgement, while my faults don't exist or are inconsequential" kind of behavior. I think Jesus was telling them to use the same measure on themselves. That makes a big difference when helping others.

What are your thoughts?

Thank you.

 

[Skwim]

Here's the passage in the Message Bible.

Matthew 7:1-5The Message (MSG)
A Simple Guide for Behavior

7 1-5 “Don’t pick on people, jump on their failures, criticize their faults— unless, of course, you want the same treatment. That critical spirit has a way of boomeranging. It’s easy to see a smudge on your neighbor’s face and be oblivious to the ugly sneer on your own. Do you have the nerve to say, ‘Let me wash your face for you,’ when your own face is distorted by contempt? It’s this whole traveling road-show mentality all over again, playing a holier-than-thou part instead of just living your part. Wipe that ugly sneer off your own face, and you might be fit to offer a washcloth to your neighbor.
​

As I see it, it's not so much about judging people, which is sometimes necessary, but picking on them. So, if I was Jesus I would have said: Don't pick on people unless you want to be picked on yourself. But we're all apt to make mistakes now and then. Even Jesus.


.

 

[Augustus]

It's not an absolute prohibition on judging others, just a general maxim. People have a tendency to see the faults of others far more easily than they see the faults in themselves.

We all practice self-deception, which makes us (partially) blind to our own failings. Other people can see them as easily as we see those of others though. So when you criticise others, you can expect that you might be forced to face some home truths as well.

Basically, avoid pointing out the faults of others unless you want them to point out your faults too.

 

[e.r.m.]

Here's the passage in the Message Bible.

Matthew 7:1-5The Message (MSG)
A Simple Guide for Behavior

7 1-5 “Don’t pick on people, jump on their failures, criticize their faults— unless, of course, you want the same treatment. That critical spirit has a way of boomeranging. It’s easy to see a smudge on your neighbor’s face and be oblivious to the ugly sneer on your own. Do you have the nerve to say, ‘Let me wash your face for you,’ when your own face is distorted by contempt? It’s this whole traveling road-show mentality all over again, playing a holier-than-thou part instead of just living your part. Wipe that ugly sneer off your own face, and you might be fit to offer a washcloth to your neighbor.
​

As I see it, it's not so much about judging people, which is sometimes necessary, but picking on them. So, if I was Jesus I would have said: Don't pick on people unless you want to be picked on yourself. But we're all apt to make mistakes now and then. Even Jesus.


.

I agree with the picking. Thank you. Sorry, I disagree with everything else.

 

[e.r.m.]

It's not an absolute prohibition on judging others, just a general maxim. People have a tendency to see the faults of others far more easily than they see the faults in themselves.

We all practice self-deception, which makes us (partially) blind to our own failings. Other people can see them as easily as we see those of others though. So when you criticise others, you can expect that you might be forced to face some home truths as well.

Basically, avoid pointing out the faults of others unless you want them to point out your faults too.

I agree with everything except not pointing out faults since Jesus said
"...then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye."

I think Skwim's picking on others describes it well.

 

[Burl]

It doesn't say don't judge at all.

I think the adoption of civil code addresses this issue by setting standards of resolution. Resolving problems by civil procedure gives a standard of conduct for everyone within a group. Problems arise when the adopted law favors one segment of the group over another, and then, perhaps, one can reject the code and start by setting one's own standards of conflict resolution such as being patient and not involving the law courts.

 

[e.r.m.]

I think the adoption of civil code addresses this issue by setting standards of resolution. Resolving problems by civil procedure gives a standard of conduct for everyone within a group. Problems arise when the adopted law favors one segment of the group over another, and then, perhaps, one can reject the code and start by setting one's own standards of conflict resolution such as being patient and not involving the law courts.

Thank you. So it comes back to the same problem which Jesus addressed.

 

[Burl]

We can't rely on the written word, in my opinion, because it gets adjusted over the ages by well-meaning clerics.
So I rely on one thing: How do I resolve conflict; Do I lie, kill, ostracize or imprison? Walking the talk is an adventure.

 

[Thief]

Quite often ....my own quote....

if you judge by sight.....you will be judged on sight
if you judge by rumor.....you will be judged by hearsay

if you judge.....make certain your own mind and heart .....first

 

[Politesse]

I think a good moral to take from Matthew is that it is safest to avoid judging others, because we tend toward hypocrisy when we look at our neighbor. The Samaritan is bad because of his blood (but he knows compassion that the Pharisees had long forgotten), the tax collector is bad because he betrays his people to the Romans (but opens his house and larder to a stranger). We are good at finding reasons to hate our neighbor, but we forget that there are as many reasons to love them as Christ loves us all, first before all and all very obviously "undeserving".

Criticizing others is the easy route. Acknowledging your own failings is painful, so we find our failings in others and criticize them there. It is easy, but it is not the path to the Dominion of God.

 

[e.r.m.]

We can't rely on the written word, in my opinion, because it gets adjusted over the ages by well-meaning clerics.
So I rely on one thing: How do I resolve conflict; Do I lie, kill, ostracize or imprison? Walking the talk is an adventure.

This is a common concern, but the Bible has shown itself reliable, as with the dead sea scrolls.

 

[e.r.m.]

I think a good moral to take from Matthew is that it is safest to avoid judging others, because we tend toward hypocrisy when we look at our neighbor. The Samaritan is bad because of his blood (but he knows compassion that the Pharisees had long forgotten), the tax collector is bad because he betrays his people to the Romans (but opens his house and larder to a stranger). We are good at finding reasons to hate our neighbor, but we forget that there are as many reasons to love them as Christ loves us all, first before all and all very obviously "undeserving".

Criticizing others is the easy route. Acknowledging your own failings is painful, so we find our failings in others and criticize them there. It is easy, but it is not the path to the Dominion of God.

Thank you, but Jesus didn't suggest to not help the other person. It's supposed to be about helping them, not bringing them down. Not doing or saying anything is abandoning them.

 

[Politesse]

Thank you, but Jesus didn't suggest to not help the other person. It's supposed to be about helping them, not bringing them down. Not doing or saying anything is abandoning them.

That is correct.