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Following a religion in 2021

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
For many of us who follow a religion or has faith in spiritual teaching there are scriptures that are hundreds if not thousands of years old, and often we can hear "how can you follow a teaching that is so outdated"

In the past i got frustrated with this kind of questions :) But then i started to think ( YEY i am thinking :p )

So the Question for this thread is: When following an "older" religion and its scripture, can we follow it as described but "update" it within our self (not the text it self) to go more along with the thought of 2021 modern world?
Or do we have to live in the "stoneage" as some people like to call it :)

In the scripture I've read so far of my religion, likely among the oldest, I have yet to find content that isn't relevant to today.

My scripture explores the nature of being through story and parable, and this nature of being really isn't any different today than it was two to three thousand years ago.
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
"how can you follow a teaching that is so outdated" In the past i got frustrated [with this question]

The Jewish religion is the root of the Christian and Muslim religions. You will see that the Christian religion uses many parts of the Jewish religion (thou shalt not kill)....yet, often ignores God's orders in favor of fighting terrorism.

Christians pick and choose what they want to follow in their bibles"

Example 1: fight against Gay politicians (judge not lest ye be judged). What about Christian forgiveness? Is that only for Reverend Jimmy Swaggart who sinned with prostitutes, and not for President Clinton who sinned with Monica, but for President GHW Bush who sinned with Jennifer Fitzgerald. Double standards.

Example 2: ignore Revelation that says that if they fight Iraq they will face God's wrath, such as Revelation 15 (seven plagues, including COVID).

Kings have altered the bible and the religion:

Example: King Henry VIII divorced Queen Catherine of Aragon, found that his supreme power was limited by the Catholic church, so founded the Anglican Church, then demanded to head that church himself (perhaps because he was such a moral upstanding man?--dodge flying chicken bones), then chopped off the head of Queen Anne Boleyn (needed a boleyn ball?), and proceeded to bear false witness against other queens to gain divorces).

Popes have altered religions and bibles.

Some popes felt that Christ, having risen from his grave, should not appear as a freak (albino, white hair and red eyes), so they altered his appearance in art.

Numerous bible versions have been made. Are all of them the original word of God?

The King James version was created to possibly take power from the clergy (then, only extremely educated men, especially in the clergy, could read Latin (a dead language spoken by ancient Romans), and the bible had been written only in Latin, so the common people could not read it themselves in their native language but had to have it interpreted by the clergy (and pay the clergy and follow their teachings).

The late Reverend Gene Scott (and the living daughter, Reverend Melissa Scott) try to gain greater knowledge of the Christian religion by undertaking the humongous task of translating each passage from the early languages (Hebrew, Latin, and occasionally Greek), and comparing it to ancient documents, such as the Dead Sea Scrolls. They have found startling differences in translation.

Are all bibles perfectly accurate if they were translated incorrectly, or intentionally altered by kings or popes?

Apparently God wrote the bible, though he gave that task to those who quoted his son or to those who received divine revelation (ESP, psychic vision), to write what the apostles heard, a hundred years after the death of said apostles (or perhaps from word of mouth from them).

Was God wrong when he wrote the original version? Did he need a Messiah (as predicted by Jews and followed by Christians....if their Messiah is the correct one)?

It could be argued that God gave a different version of the bible to different people at a different time because they had to follow different rules:

Example: God told Jews "eye for an eye" but told Christians "thou shalt not kill" and "turn the other cheek." Ancient Jews would have been wiped out by the various warring factions (Egyptians attacked Solomon's Kingdom and took it). Modern Christians have nuclear bombs, so they had better be pacifists because they can destroy all life on earth. So, it might be that old teachings are outmoded?

Did God only give information to those in the Middle East? Or, did God go to America, as the Mormons believe? Many Christians call the Mormons "nonchristian" but they believe in Christ. Many Christians argue that Mormons are Pagans because they have their own bible, and they don't believe that a prophet of God could have divine insight (though that is precisely how the Christian bible was written, and how Revelation was written).

Each religion seems to backbite all others (with few exceptions). This keeps followers in their control.

Thus, many religions say that the Jews are evil
(wring chicken necks for ritual sacrifice). Actually, Jews try to kill food animals as humanely as possible, and this is a reminder to be humane. They also don't drink the milk of the beast and meat of the beast at the same meal. Such backbiting is at the root of antisemitism, and that culminated with Nazis torturing them and murdering them by the millions. (Is that the Christian thing to do?) Remember, Germany started out Christian when they started backing Hitler.

Many Christians would love to learn the roots of their own religion, but they don't want to attend Jewish temples or talk to rabbis. They feel out of place, or somehow hate Jews. On the other hand, many Jews (Messianic) have left the Jewish faith to become Christians--they believe that Christ was the Messiah that their ancient prophecy was talking about.

I leave you with more questions than answers. But my advise is to learn as much as possible about all religions, try to compare them, and try to learn the total message of God to all of the people of the world.

I believe that God, at the Tower of Babel, separated the races, made the different languages, and separated them by vast distances, with the idea that with maturity, some day, they will see all of God's children as God sees them, and merge in harmony, once again.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
So the Question for this thread is: When following an "older" religion and its scripture, can we follow it as described but "update" it within our self (not the text it self) to go more along with the thought of 2021 modern world?
Or do we have to live in the "stoneage" as some people like to call it :)
I'd say that every person who follows a religion based on scriptures written a long time ago already does as you describe... even if they aren't willing to admit it.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Yes, i agree with you here.
The teaching in it self stay the same, but the way we act toward others may have changed over the time since the teaching was first given :)
I think that depends on what the teaching is.

High-level principles and values can adapt to any situation, but plenty of religions have hard-and-fast detailed codes.

When your code of behaviour gives specifics about things like fire and oxen, and is completely silent about anything that was invented or discovered in the last thousand years, decisions and interpretations are going to have to be made.

Is electricity "fire" for the purposes of the religion's rules? Should a pickup truck be subject to the same rules as an ox? You end up having to decide one way or another just to function.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
I think that depends on what the teaching is.

High-level principles and values can adapt to any situation, but plenty of religions have hard-and-fast detailed codes.

When your code of behaviour gives specifics about things like fire and oxen, and is completely silent about anything that was invented or discovered in the last thousand years, decisions and interpretations are going to have to be made.

Is electricity "fire" for the purposes of the religion's rules? Should a pickup truck be subject to the same rules as an ox? You end up having to decide one way or another just to function.
Electricity was not yet "invented" thousands of years ago (not that i know of anyway) So the light and heat was fire that they litt, But in a religious sense it could also be the fire from with in a person,like anger, jealosy and so on or even fever could be seen as fire. Those things still are just as true today as it was before.
i think that as time goes and the world invent new physical things, religious people can use it if it is a benefit to them. and still be within the teaching of the religion :)
 

Psalm23

Well-Known Member
For many of us who follow a religion or has faith in spiritual teaching there are scriptures that are hundreds if not thousands of years old, and often we can hear "how can you follow a teaching that is so outdated"

In the past i got frustrated with this kind of questions :) But then i started to think ( YEY i am thinking :p )

So the Question for this thread is: When following an "older" religion and its scripture, can we follow it as described but "update" it within our self (not the text it self) to go more along with the thought of 2021 modern world?
Or do we have to live in the "stoneage" as some people like to call it :)


Perhaps updating the language of the text especially if hard to understand while having a translation that is true to the text and doesn’t try to put one’s views too much in the text. Also applying text to regular life. I think more than updating the text, if someone applies the scripture to their own life and situations, that is a modern usage.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
Perhaps updating the language of the text especially if hard to understand while having a translation that is true to the text and doesn’t try to put one’s views too much in the text. Also applying text to regular life. I think more than updating the text, if someone applies the scripture to their own life and situations, that is a modern usage.
Language can be a problem sometimes yes
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Electricity was not yet "invented" thousands of years ago (not that i know of anyway) So the light and heat was fire that they litt, But in a religious sense it could also be the fire from with in a person,like anger, jealosy and so on or even fever could be seen as fire. Those things still are just as true today as it was before.
That's certainly one approach.

Another approach would be that fire is something used for work, so new inventions that do work should follow the rules that were set out for fire.

Another approach would be to take it literally and say that "fire" only represents fire, so our use of electricity isn't subject to the rules in place for fire at all.

Whichever approach one takes involves reinterpreting the religion for modern times.

i think that as time goes and the world invent new physical things, religious people can use it if it is a benefit to them. and still be within the teaching of the religion :)
I think whether this is true depends entirely on the specific teachings of the religion in question.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
can we follow it as described but "update" it within our self (not the text it self) to go more along with the thought of 2021 modern world?

You described trajectory hermeneutics. And its absolutely absorbable and in line with religion.

Or do we have to live in the "stoneage" as some people like to call it :)

You are a Muslim so I will ask you a question from the Qur'an. Can you give what you think is "stoneage" in the Qur'an? Just curious to know.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
In the scripture I've read so far of my religion, likely among the oldest, I have yet to find content that isn't relevant to today.

My scripture explores the nature of being through story and parable, and this nature of being really isn't any different today than it was two to three thousand years ago.

What specifically is your scripture?
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
You described trajectory hermeneutics. And its absolutely absorbable and in line with religion.



You are a Muslim so I will ask you a question from the Qur'an. Can you give what you think is "stoneage" in the Qur'an? Just curious to know.
To me the Quran is not bound by time, so nothing is stoneage in the Quran.
But i have heard others say it ( not only in RF)
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
To refuse to change is to deny cultural and ethical evolution. That's the purvey of fundamentalists, salafis et al. That way leads to death because only the dead are unchanging.

If a religion or spiritual path is to survive, it needs to adapt to current circumstances without losing its essential nature.

During my search in the 1970's, I visited Philip Kapleau's zen center in Rochester NY. They had dropped the requirement that their monks begged for food as inappropriate in the West. Instead they performed tasks such as picking up litter as a way to achieve the same end but in a Western context. I was charmed then and am still appreciative of that kind of adaptability.
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
Can you give a gist of why you believe both the Upanishads and the Bhagavad Gita are relevant today? I am interested to know your perspective.

I thought I did that in the first post you responded to ITT. What specifically are you looking for?
 

InvestigateTruth

Well-Known Member
For many of us who follow a religion or has faith in spiritual teaching there are scriptures that are hundreds if not thousands of years old, and often we can hear "how can you follow a teaching that is so outdated"

In the past i got frustrated with this kind of questions :) But then i started to think ( YEY i am thinking :p )

So the Question for this thread is: When following an "older" religion and its scripture, can we follow it as described but "update" it within our self (not the text it self) to go more along with the thought of 2021 modern world?
Or do we have to live in the "stoneage" as some people like to call it :)
Do you believe such older religion originated from a God?
If so, and if you think it needs to be updated according to needs of our Age and Time, why wouldn't God who was the originator do the update? After all, He would do the update much better than everyone else, wouldn't He?

And that's the Bahai belief, that whenever the Religion of God needs to be updated, God Himself do it. This is why for example, Jewish Faith was updated by Jesus. Later Christianity was updated by Muhammad, and now, Bahais believe Islam was Updated by Bahaullah. Later whenever an update is needed, God, without hesitation even for an hour, will update Bahai Faith. And this process of updating will continue forever, and is in the everlasting plan of God.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
Do you believe such older religion originated from a God?
If so, and if you think it needs to be updated according to needs of our Age and Time, why wouldn't God who was the originator do the update? After all, He would do the update much better than everyone else, wouldn't He?
It would surprise me if older religions were not from God.
When i say update i do not mean the scripture, but as a practitoner of a religious practice i see it a bit strange to live exactly as they did thousands of years ago, so the uptdate if within each one of us, not the written words in the scriptures.

So the update is to see the technology we have today, and be able to use it within the law of the religion we follow. Or it can be the way we look at people today with different eyes then before, but still within the law of religion
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
For many of us who follow a religion or has faith in spiritual teaching there are scriptures that are hundreds if not thousands of years old, and often we can hear "how can you follow a teaching that is so outdated"

In the past i got frustrated with this kind of questions :) But then i started to think ( YEY i am thinking :p )

So the Question for this thread is: When following an "older" religion and its scripture, can we follow it as described but "update" it within our self (not the text it self) to go more along with the thought of 2021 modern world?
Or do we have to live in the "stoneage" as some people like to call it :)
In Hinduism the basic foundation and principles are timeless while the actual practice can vary and adapt to the times.
 

InvestigateTruth

Well-Known Member
It would surprise me if older religions were not from God.
When i say update i do not mean the scripture, but as a practitoner of a religious practice i see it a bit strange to live exactly as they did thousands of years ago, so the uptdate if within each one of us, not the written words in the scriptures.

So the update is to see the technology we have today, and be able to use it within the law of the religion we follow. Or it can be the way we look at people today with different eyes then before, but still within the law of religion
Well, a religion is defined by its scriptures who was revealed. So to me, update of religious practices is to update its scriptures.
 
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