FBI Says Covid-19 Most Likely A Leak From Lab

[Kathryn]

By the way, thanks for the link - I didn't even know Wikipedia was around in 2004 but apparently it was!

One thing for sure, according to that article, which doesn't say a thing about vaccines not being very, very effective in PREVENTING a specific disease, is that they've always been controversial, apparently.

By the way, I am all for vaccinations - I just choose not to call a flu shot or COVID shot a "vaccination."

 

[Kathryn]

Seems more than just that with your refusal to call a vaccine a vaccine and claim they don't work that well at what they're supposed to do.

I've been very, very clear about my PERSONAL experiences. You call them whatever you want and so will I and I just bet we're both fine at the end of the day.

 

[Kathryn]

Yes, I know, and you have been told that that does not make it not a vaccine.

That person was almost certainly immunocompromised. Death from coronavirus in the fully vaccinated has been rare. Vaccines do little or nothing for immune systems unable to mount a normal or near-normal response. The failure was not with the vaccine. We saw this with Colin Powell, who had a bone marrow disorder and died of Covid fully vaccinated.

What's odd is that you say you know no unvaccinated people who caught Covid.

That's unfortunate, but it doesn't change the science or the nomenclature, nor does it make you wrong for taking that booster.

It sure didn't keep me from getting COVID. Oh and I have never said that I've never known anyone unvaccinated who has gotten COVID. LATELY (as in the past year) every single person I know who has come down with COVID has been "vaccinated" and usually boosted as well. I relayed a story in fact, of several non vaccinated people who got COVID.

Oh, for the record, I have zero pre existing conditions, I am not elderly, and I'm on zero medications for anything. I am rarely sick, let alone sickly. In fact, when I had the first mild response (a low grade fever for a few hours about twelve hours after the second shot), I was told by many many people that was GREAT, because it showed a strong immune response. To be honest, I sort of figured that must be the case when I got a pounding headache for four days after the booster. The only reason why I didn't get a fourth shot was because I didn't want to be sick with a headache that nothing could assuage, for another four days.

Six in ten deaths from COVID in 2022 were in fully "vaccinated" people. 3.7 out of ten of the deaths in 2022 were from people who were both vaccinated and boosted.

Why Do Vaccinated People Represent Most COVID-19 Deaths Right Now? | KFF

This post explores why the share of COVID-19 deaths among those who are vaccinated has risen, Factors include a rising share of the population that is vaccinated, waning immune protection and low uptake of boosters, and changes in immunity among the unvaccinated.

www.kff.org

But maybe that wasn't many deaths anyway since COVID 19 has claimed less than 1 percent of the world's population since it became known.

 

[Subduction Zone]

By the way, thanks for the link - I didn't even know Wikipedia was around in 2004 but apparently it was!

One thing for sure, according to that article, which doesn't say a thing about vaccines not being very, very effective in PREVENTING a specific disease, is that they've always been controversial, apparently.

By the way, I am all for vaccinations - I just choose not to call a flu shot or COVID shot a "vaccination."

They were controversial when first made. But the beliefs of the scientifically illiterate do not make an idea controversial in the world of the sciences.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It sure didn't keep me from getting COVID. Oh and I have never said that I've never known anyone unvaccinated who has gotten COVID. LATELY (as in the past year) every single person I know who has come down with COVID has been "vaccinated" and usually boosted as well. I relayed a story in fact, of several non vaccinated people who got COVID.

Oh, for the record, I have zero pre existing conditions, I am not elderly, and I'm on zero medications for anything. I am rarely sick, let alone sickly. In fact, when I had the first mild response (a low grade fever for a few hours about twelve hours after the second shot), I was told by many many people that was GREAT, because it showed a strong immune response. To be honest, I sort of figured that must be the case when I got a pounding headache for four days after the booster. The only reason why I didn't get a fourth shot was because I didn't want to be sick with a headache that nothing could assuage, for another four days.

There could have been other causes too. For example due to the pandemic and the various shutdowns the flu season was almost nonexistent that year. The flu tends to be a bit less contagious than covid. A lot of people have developed natural immunities and also quite a few get flu shots. But a period of time without getting ill means that your immune system will have made less of the antibodies for that particular disease. The flu came back last year and made up a bit for lost time. There could have been other explanations as well. It may have been the vaccine but it also may not have been. Did you go to the doctor and have yourself checked?

 

[Kathryn]

There could have been other causes too. For example due to the pandemic and the various shutdowns the flu season was almost nonexistent that year. The flu tends to be a bit less contagious than covid. A lot of people have developed natural immunities and also quite a few get flu shots. But a period of time without getting ill means that your immune system will have made less of the antibodies for that particular disease. The flu came back last year and made up a bit for lost time. There could have been other explanations as well. It may have been the vaccine but it also may not have been. Did you go to the doctor and have yourself checked?

Yes. I had coronavirus.

 

[Kathryn]

They were controversial when first made. But the beliefs of the scientifically illiterate do not make an idea controversial in the world of the sciences.

There you go again, but I digress.

They are still controversial. They always have been.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes. I had coronavirus.

No, I meant when you had the severe reaction to the vaccine.

 

[Subduction Zone]

There you go again, but I digress.

They are still controversial. They always have been.

No. Only among the uneducated. In the medical profession there are just a handful of loons that oppose them and none of them can form a valid argument. For scientific debates one uses scientific evidence and all they seem to have are ad hoc explanations and confirmation bias. I have not seen peer reviewed works supporting them.

 

[Kathryn]

No, I meant when you had the severe reaction to the vaccine.

No because everything I read, including the information they gave me when I got the booster, was that a headache was a common reaction. I just didn't expect it to last four days. I did report it to VAERS though.

 

[Kathryn]

No. Only among the uneducated. In the medical profession there are just a handful of loons that oppose them and none of them can form a valid argument. For scientific debates one uses scientific evidence and all they seem to have are ad hoc explanations and confirmation bias. I have not seen peer reviewed works supporting them.

I don't oppose vaccinations. I support vaccinations. In fact, I am up to date on all my vaccinations, which is more than most people can say. I also get a flu shot every year. Hey, it works for me. But no flu shot has ever given me a four day headache.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No because everything I read, including the information they gave me when I got the booster, was that a headache was a common reaction. I just didn't expect it to last four days.

When it comes to checking vaccines for side effects that is the sort of information that they want to hear. Of course correlation is not necessarily confirmation. People do get sick for various different reasons. What they have to do is collect accounts and then compare those rates to the population as a whole. For example if a chemical is thought to possibly cause a specific cancer and they find that one out of ten thousand people who took a medication were getting that cancer it might ring some alarm bells. But if the population as a whole has a one in ten thousand rate for that cancer then it appears that the drug was not responsible.

Illnesses have so many possible causes that a proper use of statistics at times is the only way to find out if the claims are true or not.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I don't oppose vaccinations. I support vaccinations. In fact, I am up to date on all my vaccinations, which is more than most people can say. I also get a flu shot every year. Hey, it works for me. But no flu shot has ever given me a four day headache.

Hopefully we get a handle on this and there will not be any more outbreaks where it is heavily recommended that one get a vaccination. If one does not occur you will probably be safe without one. But I would still urge you to get vaccinated if it gets serious again.

 

[The Hammer]

Over ONE MILLION people died from in, just in the US alone. Almost SEVEN MILLION people died across the globe from it.
It's bizarre to me that people think this is nothing to sneeze at. Just another day!

"The death of one is a tragedy, but death of a million is just a statistic."

Marilyn Manson

This is how people think.

 

[Kathryn]

Hopefully we get a handle on this and there will not be any more outbreaks where it is heavily recommended that one get a vaccination. If one does not occur you will probably be safe without one. But I would still urge you to get vaccinated if it gets serious again.

I am already "vaccinated" and have one of the two boosters. as I've stated repeatedly.

 

[Kathryn]

"The death of one is a tragedy, but death of a million is just a statistic."

Marilyn Manson

This is how people think.

I hate to break it to you, or anyone else but 1.8 people die globally every second. A preventable injury related death occurs in the US every two minutes. That's 720 Americans who die every day from PREVENTABLE INURIES (not other reasons). People cry and mourn and life continues. I speak as one who lost my own husband to a massive heart attack in 2020. In other words, he died in 2020. It sucked, and I've struggled, but I am here to tell you that life does go on, till it doesn't anymore. One day I'll die too, and one day my kids will die and THEIR kids will die. It's the way things go.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I am already "vaccinated" and have one of the two boosters. as I've stated repeatedly.

Yes, but vaccines are not forever. The flu shot is a vaccine. Tetanus shots are vaccines. Even the smallpox vaccine was not perfect. And that eventually eradicated the disease. Over time vaccines lose the ability to protect as either the immune system stops making those antibodies or as the original virus evolves. Shingles is the chickenpox virus becoming active again as we age. So if a person had chickenpox a vaccine against shingles will keep them from reactivating. If a person was vaccinated when young it does not appear to be necessary. But the other examples I gave show that not all vaccines are one (or in some cases two) and done type of deal.

That is why I said if an outbreak occurs again you should seriously consider another vaccination. If there isn't I would not worry too much at your age.

 

[Kathryn]

Yes, but vaccines are not forever. The flu shot is a vaccine. Tetanus shots are vaccines. Even the smallpox vaccine was not perfect. And that eventually eradicated the disease. Over time vaccines lose the ability to protect as either the immune system stops making those antibodies or as the original virus evolves. Shingles is the chickenpox virus becoming active again as we age. So if a person had chickenpox a vaccine against shingles will keep them from reactivating. If a person was vaccinated when young it does not appear to be necessary. But the other examples I gave show that not all vaccines are one (or in some cases two) and done type of deal.

That is why I said if an outbreak occurs again you should seriously consider another vaccination. If there isn't I would not worry too much at your age.

Why would you not worry too much at my age? Do you consider people my age to be expendable?

Sorry, not getting another shot unless I find myself with days and days of leisure to lay on my sofa with a pounding headache. Wow, that really took me by surprise last year. Someone really needs to work the kinks out of this before I subject myself to that again - and STILL get COVID.

I had three shots total. Would have had four but I was very alarmed by the four day headache that nothing would get rid of. How many have you had?

 

[Kathryn]

I wonder, if I had chicken pox AND shingles, am I immune? I am asking because the shingles vaccine is potentially very problematic and I don't want more drama in my life.

Oh, I see it's possible but unlikely to get shingles more than once. Also, the Shingrix and other shingles shots can offer immunity for up to five years - then they have to be given again. They are not as effective on people who are over aged 70.

Oh, the shingles vaccine is supposed to offer a 90 percent chance that you won't have shingles! Supposedly that was the same with the COVID vaccine. I and everyone I know who has gotten COVID after being vaxxed and boosted must all be extremely unlucky and rare.

I'm going to pass.

 

[The Hammer]

I hate to break it to you, or anyone else but 1.8 people die globally every second. A preventable injury related death occurs in the US every two minutes. That's 720 Americans who die every day from PREVENTABLE INURIES (not other reasons). People cry and mourn and life continues. I speak as one who lost my own husband to a massive heart attack in 2020. In other words, he died in 2020. It sucked, and I've struggled, but I am here to tell you that life does go on, till it doesn't anymore. One day I'll die too, and one day my kids will die and THEIR kids will die. It's the way things go.

So we added another 7 million+ to that due to some people's ignorance and inability do something as simple as mask and stay home?


What's your point?

Also, your husband dying due to CVD (cardiovascular disease) means nothing in relation to the COVID pandemic, it's non sequitur, but I am sorry for your loss, it is a shame.

My wife got COVID, was hospitalized for 4 weeks, nearly died. And due to lingering physical affects hasn't been able to hold a job since 2020.

Edited: Just because everyone dies, doesn't give me or anyone else the right to be ignorant and hasten that along, because I think social/community supportive rules don't apply to me.