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Faith Crisis

Thief

Rogue Theologian
I lean to science.....
the constant association of cause and effect place the Creator before creation

as for immediate conversing....picture yourself as Moses

dealing with a disembodied Voice

and if you claim such things happen to you.....
others will think of you as ......
 

OceanSoul

Member
I lean to science.....
the constant association of cause and effect place the Creator before creation

as for immediate conversing....picture yourself as Moses

dealing with a disembodied Voice

and if you claim such things happen to you.....
others will think of you as ......

Probably crazy. If I heard disembodied voices, even I would make sure to get checked out to be sure if I'm still sane or not.
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Probably crazy. If I heard disembodied voices, even I would make sure to get checked out to be sure if I'm still sane or not.
so you don't really expect a return for a prayer spoken?

I have seen it written....
Go to your closet and close the door
and the Spirit that knows you will hear you

when I read it.....I couldn't help but wonder
that Spirit in there with you.....would that be the Lord God Almighty?

or something less?

I take aim when I pray
I don't need unwanted attention
if you know what I mean
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
Interesting, I never thought about it like that. I guess when I felt it, the experience was...jarring...a little scary for me. My reaction since then has been to figure out why I did and what to do now.
Yes, I've experienced something I would describe the same as you did. Could be the same, could be something else. Most likely you entered an altered state of consciousness most people aren't aware of and described in poetry by people(the so-called mystics) who've reached some of these states through effort, most likely in the beginning by accident as you did.

I have actually read a little bit about Buddhism. Meditation is a practice I would need to work on hahaha monkey mind syndrome right here. Mindfulness is something I try to incorporate into my life because I think it's sensible and helps to bring more awareness into my life. I will read more about them.
If you wrestle with a monkey everyday, you'll get stronger, but so will the monkey. Who will get stronger? Maybe the point is to forget wrestling and find a way around...

So in my opinion you don't need to deal with the monkey mind to meditate. It depends on what school of meditation you learn. I prefer something where I close my eyes, focus on sounds and texture of the air while outside. If you focus on the monkey mind, the battle will already be lost.
 

OceanSoul

Member
so you don't really expect a return for a prayer spoken?

I have seen it written....
Go to your closet and close the door
and the Spirit that knows you will hear you

when I read it.....I couldn't help but wonder
that Spirit in there with you.....would that be the Lord God Almighty?

or something less?

I take aim when I pray
I don't need unwanted attention
if you know what I mean

When I pray, I do not have high expectations of them being answered anymore.
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
How do you find spiritual connection in this world with so many religions? What should I do?
Run away from anyone who tells you that they can fix your spiritual connection. They can't. Anyway what is a spiritual connection? Maybe it isn't always the same. Maybe it changes? Maybe you still have one.
 

OceanSoul

Member
Yes, I've experienced something I would describe the same as you did. Could be the same, could be something else. Most likely you entered an altered state of consciousness most people aren't aware of and described in poetry by people(the so-called mystics) who've reached some of these states through effort, most likely in the beginning by accident as you did.

If you wrestle with a monkey everyday, you'll get stronger, but so will the monkey. Who will get stronger? Maybe the point is to forget wrestling and find a way around...

So in my opinion you don't need to deal with the monkey mind to meditate. It depends on what school of meditation you learn. I prefer something where I close my eyes, focus on sounds and texture of the air while outside. If you focus on the monkey mind, the battle will already be lost.

Definitely an accident. I had it a few more times after that as the feeling still hit me when I would be praying and trying to connect with the Divine.

My mind loves rebelling when I try to sit down and quiet the monkey down. I will turn on some meditative music or something peaceful since music is one of the best ways to get my mind to be quiet, along with writing and art. I do find going outside for a walk helps a lot though. Nature is mentally healing for me.
 

OceanSoul

Member
Run away from anyone who tells you that they can fix your spiritual connection. They can't. Anyway what is a spiritual connection? Maybe it isn't always the same. Maybe it changes? Maybe you still have one.

In my opinion, a spiritual connection is when I feel I can reach out my hand and a metaphorical hand touches mine back, when I'm gazing at the stars and feel the sacred and am in awe of it all, when I feel a little fire within me. There are many ways to describe the inexplicable. Some people feel a connection to the universe, some to the divine in other people/nature/animals, etc. I doubt everyone experiences it the same way.

There is a lot I don't know nor understand so I suppose such a connection could change. I don't know.
 
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David1967

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I converted to Christianity when I was 16 years old after having gone through a lot of pain and through which I had the courage to improve my life. I stopped being angry at the world and have been a believer up until a year ago when for whatever reason something broke or maybe it's just me who has. I don't know if it is just a temporary thing due to so much crap coming at me in life.

About a year ago, I was laying on my bed trying to pray when an overwhelming sense of emptiness came over me and I could feel it in my bones. I didn't feel any connection. Nothing hearing me. I tried praying here and there afterwards but I felt it did no good and made zero difference in my life so I stopped, not to mention I started feeling anxious every time I would pray since my expectations would make me feel worse. My family lost someone in recent months and after that I went digging spiritually to figure out why that happened. I no longer call myself a Christian because I struggle too much with the faith and have no reason to.

I have been studying different religions, included deeper into Christianity which has only made me feel even more uncertain and confused not to mention how overwhelming it is too see just how many religions and spiritual paths there are! How does one even begin? I have read up on Buddhism, but that is it.

How do you find spiritual connection in this world with so many religions? What should I do?

Struggling within a faith doesn't necessarily make you less of that faith. It just means your being honest with yourself. I would say that most if not all people struggle with their faiths or different aspects of it as we go through life and experience the different phases and challenges. This is just part of the human experience. We face loss, sorrow and other unpleasant things. We experience joy and happiness. All these things make us who we are and will become. The challenge to us is to be patient and see life as it is. A learning experience. I'm not suggesting what you should do, but advising patience and not doing anything drastic. Good luck to you.
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
Definitely an accident. I had it a few more times after that as the feeling still hit me when I would be praying and trying to connect with the Divine.
Yes, it happened to me first by accident also. Then on purpose. Is it the work of the divine? Not being religious in the traditional sense I don't know anything about the divine, but I've learned to appreciate it that some people call it god.

I do find going outside for a walk helps a lot though. Nature is mentally healing for me.
This part is what I do when I meditate, going for a walk in nature and healing begins. Meditation happens on it's own and I notice I'm "there" again... if you listen to the birds there's no monkey to wrestle with. That's what I meant by going around the monkey instead of trying to fight it.
 

OceanSoul

Member
Struggling within a faith doesn't necessarily make you less of that faith. It just means your being honest with yourself. I would say that most if not all people struggle with their faiths or different aspects of it as we go through life and experience the different phases and challenges. This is just part of the human experience. We face loss, sorrow and other unpleasant things. We experience joy and happiness. All these things make us who we are and will become. The challenge to us is to be patient and see life as it is. A learning experience. I'm not suggesting what you should do, but advising patience and not doing anything drastic. Good luck to you.

My reasoning has been to refrain from labeling myself until I have done some introspection and get through this current spiritual slump. I know there are Christians who also have doubts and uncertainties like me, but I don't have the same assuredness as some Christians do which can be alienating. I also do a lot of reading of Christian theology and as a history freak, I like studying Christianity past history, iconography, mysticism, etc. Some of my studying just adds to my uncertainty though.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I converted to Christianity when I was 16 years old after having gone through a lot of pain and through which I had the courage to improve my life. I stopped being angry at the world and have been a believer up until a year ago when for whatever reason something broke or maybe it's just me who has. I don't know if it is just a temporary thing due to so much crap coming at me in life.

About a year ago, I was laying on my bed trying to pray when an overwhelming sense of emptiness came over me and I could feel it in my bones. I didn't feel any connection. Nothing hearing me. I tried praying here and there afterwards but I felt it did no good and made zero difference in my life so I stopped, not to mention I started feeling anxious every time I would pray since my expectations would make me feel worse. My family lost someone in recent months and after that I went digging spiritually to figure out why that happened. I no longer call myself a Christian because I struggle too much with the faith and have no reason to.

I have been studying different religions, included deeper into Christianity which has only made me feel even more uncertain and confused not to mention how overwhelming it is too see just how many religions and spiritual paths there are! How does one even begin? I have read up on Buddhism, but that is it.

How do you find spiritual connection in this world with so many religions? What should I do?
A possibly useful recommendation......
Find a connection with people.
See what happens then.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I converted to Christianity when I was 16 years old after having gone through a lot of pain and through which I had the courage to improve my life. I stopped being angry at the world and have been a believer up until a year ago when for whatever reason something broke or maybe it's just me who has. I don't know if it is just a temporary thing due to so much crap coming at me in life.

About a year ago, I was laying on my bed trying to pray when an overwhelming sense of emptiness came over me and I could feel it in my bones. I didn't feel any connection. Nothing hearing me. I tried praying here and there afterwards but I felt it did no good and made zero difference in my life so I stopped, not to mention I started feeling anxious every time I would pray since my expectations would make me feel worse. My family lost someone in recent months and after that I went digging spiritually to figure out why that happened. I no longer call myself a Christian because I struggle too much with the faith and have no reason to.

I have been studying different religions, included deeper into Christianity which has only made me feel even more uncertain and confused not to mention how overwhelming it is too see just how many religions and spiritual paths there are! How does one even begin? I have read up on Buddhism, but that is it.

How do you find spiritual connection in this world with so many religions? What should I do?

This is all my opinions.

My advice, and I don't know if this will help because it's a different approach than what you are doing, but put the religious books aside for a minute. They are supplements to your faith not a replacement of it.

I'd write down all your priorities in your life without thinking of any religion associated with it (unless, like Christianity, it is a priority).

You can list concrete things like family, self, environment, helping others, and things of that nature and others not limited to.

What do you do and value on a daily basis? Are you school oriented? Work oriented? Do you have a goal or calling even if you don't know what it/they are?

What are your morals?
What do you consider right and wrong?

Then go to the religious books and think reflective thoughts. How does Christianity relate to my priorities and morals? Do I want them to be my priorities even though I have different ones? Am I willing to sacrifice some of my values to take up those of Christianity?

That's another challenge that may be hard for you. If you take up a religion, in my opinion, there are some beliefs and traditions that you may not be familiar with or are uncomfortable with.

A religion that may click with you isn't one that will pull you away from the religion because of what you are not comfortable with but it will let you want to overcome those challenges and understand what they mean when they say X and how does it apply to your life.

That's another thing thing about religion. When you have priorities and values, they usually apply to your life and actions not just thoughts. The same with religion. If you find a religion that reflects what you belief and set as a priority, are willing to apply these beliefs or actions to your everyday life?

How do you view religion? Will it be part of yourself or something you are interested in?

:leafwind: On the other hand

If you already have priorities and morals, why do you want a religion? Do you like structure? If not, maybe stick with following what you value, write it down, and put it to action.

You can still believe in god or a deity without religion.
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
In my opinion, a spiritual connection is when I feel I can reach out my hand and a metaphorical hand touches mine back, when I'm gazing at the stars and feel the sacred and am in awe of it all, when I feel a little fire within me. There are many ways to describe the inexplicable. Some people feel a connection to the universe, some to the divine in other people/nature/animals, etc. I doubt everyone experiences it the same way.

There is a lot I don't know nor understand so I suppose such a connection could change. I don't know.
I think I understand based on that description and my own experiences. Yes, I have lost connection before. I think that there have also been certain special times of powerful connection. I am in pursuit of reconnection, too. Now that I think about it a lot of people have given me advice about this over the years. They say to get outdoors away from it all (such as when camping). They say to love myself (such as with lovingkindness meditation).

My own thoughts are that it really helps to see something that truly refreshes you, such as to see an amazing feat of generosity. It also helps to commit yourself to somehow doing for others -- such as doing volunteer work. Some people, such as myself, don't have a lot of ways to help others; but there are ways. Also if you can be with other people without having to say anything or listen to anything they say or worry about what they think that it can help, too.

I think that this is all the advice that I can remember at the moment.
 

OceanSoul

Member
Yes, it happened to me first by accident also. Then on purpose. Is it the work of the divine? Not being religious in the traditional sense I don't know anything about the divine, but I've learned to appreciate it that some people call it god.


This part is what I do when I meditate, going for a walk in nature and healing begins. Meditation happens on it's own and I notice I'm "there" again... if you listen to the birds there's no monkey to wrestle with. That's what I meant by going around the monkey instead of trying to fight it.

Interesting that you call it the divine as I find the experience has made me question more and made me more open to breaking down what I believe. I'll let my mind chew on that on what you've said.

Nature is great, I go for walks when my mind is too bothersome, when in a bad mood, sad, etc and I will feel so much better afterwards!
 

OceanSoul

Member
This is all my opinions.

My advice, and I don't know if this will help because it's a different approach than what you are doing, but put the religious books aside for a minute. They are supplements to your faith not a replacement of it.

I'd write down all your priorities in your life without thinking of any religion associated with it (unless, like Christianity, it is a priority).

You can list concrete things like family, self, environment, helping others, and things of that nature and others not limited to.

What do you do and value on a daily basis? Are you school oriented? Work oriented? Do you have a goal or calling even if you don't know what it/they are?

What are your morals?
What do you consider right and wrong?

Then go to the religious books and think reflective thoughts. How does Christianity relate to my priorities and morals? Do I want them to be my priorities even though I have different ones? Am I willing to sacrifice some of my values to take up those of Christianity?

That's another challenge that may be hard for you. If you take up a religion, in my opinion, there are some beliefs and traditions that you may not be familiar with or are uncomfortable with.

A religion that may click with you isn't one that will pull you away from the religion because of what you are not comfortable with but it will let you want to overcome those challenges and understand what they mean when they say X and how does it apply to your life.

That's another thing thing about religion. When you have priorities and values, they usually apply to your life and actions not just thoughts. The same with religion. If you find a religion that reflects what you belief and set as a priority, are willing to apply these beliefs or actions to your everyday life?

How do you view religion? Will it be part of yourself or something you are interested in?

:leafwind: On the other hand

If you already have priorities and morals, why do you want a religion? Do you like structure? If not, maybe stick with following what you value, write it down, and put it to action.

You can still believe in god or a deity without religion.

I already know what my morals and priorities in life are. I care about other people and their welfare, I look out for the weak and vulnerable, I love my family and friends, care about animals, etc. I admittedly struggle with some things in religion at times like I support LGBT rights. Religion is a way to find structure in my crazy life, and can provide a sanctuary and a sense of community which being a loner may not give me. I get what you're saying though.
 

OceanSoul

Member
I think I understand based on that description and my own experiences. Yes, I have lost connection before. I think that there have also been certain special times of powerful connection. I am in pursuit of reconnection, too. Now that I think about it a lot of people have given me advice about this over the years. They say to get outdoors away from it all (such as when camping). They say to love myself (such as with lovingkindness meditation).

My own thoughts are that it really helps to see something that truly refreshes you, such as to see an amazing feat of generosity. It also helps to commit yourself to somehow doing for others -- such as doing volunteer work. Some people, such as myself, don't have a lot of ways to help others; but there are ways. Also if you can be with other people without having to say anything or listen to anything they say or worry about what they think that it can help, too.

I think that this is all the advice that I can remember at the moment.

Seems to happen often that most people's lives get so busy that it doesn't always register that one should stop and smell the daisies. Appreciate things that get often missed like the glow of a sunset over a mountain, you know? I think this can happen with one's faith too and you stop listening to the Divine's language if that makes any sense. I think going out in the woods and finding a place to relax just to chill between you and the universe without the commotion of daily life and city lights is good advice, IMO. Also doing something for other people does help too.
 
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Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I already know what my morals and priorities in life are. I care about other people and their welfare, I look out for the weak and vulnerable, I love my family and friends, care about animals, etc. I admittedly struggle with some things in religion at times like I support LGBT rights. Religion is a way to find structure in my crazy life, and can provide a sanctuary and a sense of community which being a loner may not give me. I get what you're saying though.

Since your morals you listed are your religion, are you looking for more structure or foundation to them? To add to your morals or shape them based on religious practices and beliefs?

I went to a Santero (a "priest" of the Santeria religion) and received a reading. He mentioned I have many morals and values but I don't have a solid foundation to mold them in a coherent lifestyle. I now have a religion that cannot be separated from my lifestyle: it is my lifesyle. It is me.

How do you view religion? Is it separate from your goals? Maybe how you define religion shows others the challenges you may have and ways to help you address them.
 
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