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Featured Failed NT Prophecies about the Second Coming of Jesus

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by Hubert Farnsworth, Jun 4, 2018.

  1. Hubert Farnsworth

    Hubert Farnsworth Well-Known Member

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    Most Christians believe in the Second Coming of Jesus (along with a final "Judgment Day"), yet very few of them seem to be aware that this second coming and judgment was explicitly prophesied by the gospels to occur within the lifetimes of Jesus' disciples. Here are a few of the verses that contain this failed prophecy. After the verses, I will delve a bit deeper into the attempts made by Christian apologists to explain away these verses, and illustrate why these rationalizations clearly fail upon further examination.

    Matthew 10:21-23: "Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death. You will be hated by everyone because of me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.
    Comments: Christian apologists are fond of making the erroneous claim that verse 23 is a reference to the coming of Jesus after his alleged resurrection as in the later chapters of the gospels. But what they fail to acknowledge is that the references to brothers betraying each other, parents and children betraying each other, and being hated for being followers of Jesus are found in Mark 13, a chapter that is clearly a reference to the "last days," indicating that the prophecy in verse 23 is in fact a reference to the final judgment, or Second Coming of Jesus. In fact, the words used in Matthew 10:21-22 are essentially identical to those found in Mark chapter 13 (a chapter which refers to the final Judgment), removing all doubts that this is in fact a prophecy about Jesus' final return.

    Matthew 16:27-28: "For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father's glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done. Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."
    Comments: Some Christian apologists make the error of attempting to explain the obviously failed prophecy in verse 28 by claiming that it refers to the "Transfiguration" event described in the following chapter. But, clearly, as can be seen when reading verse 28 in the context of verse 27, this prophecy is a reference to the second coming of Jesus, also known as Judgment Day, as is evident from the reference to "angels" (no angels are mentioned in the transfiguration chapter), and the allusion to judgment where Jesus will "reward each person according to what they have done." So, it's clear that these verses were also a prophecy that the final judgment would occur within Jesus' disciples lifetimes.

    Luke 21:29-32: "He told them this parable: Look at the fig tree and all the trees. When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near. Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened."
    Comments: Some Christian apologists attempt to argue that "this generation" is a reference to some future generation that is alive at the time of Jesus' return. But, again, when examining the context of the verse, we again learn that this is incorrect. Jesus is speaking to his disciples privately during this conversation, and refers to them using the second person pronoun "you" stating "When you see these things....." Clearly, Jesus is telling his disciples that they will be witnesses to the end times, and that their generation will not pass away until all of the signs have occurred, again mirroring the similar language found in the aforementioned erroneous prophecies.

    So, if you are being intellectually honest, you can now clearly see that these are failed prophecies. Even C.S. Lewis, a renowned Christian apologist, referred to these verses as being the most embarrassing verses in the bible, and admitted that they are clearly erroneous prophecies. Most of the time, when discussing these verses with Christians, and explaining the context of them, and why they clearly fail, the typical initial reaction is that of anger toward me, indicating that some degree of cognitive dissonance has set in. I understand it's upsetting to realize that a book you previously thought was infallible clearly contains errors, but it's important to acknowledge this if you honestly care about whether your beliefs are true or not.
     
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  2. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    Nice piece of work. :thumbsup: However, I expect those Christians who care what you've said here are dusting off their tap shoes in expectation of driving you nuts with a rehash of those arguments you've already come across. Good luck, stay calm, and smile. Other than remaining silent they have no other choice.

    .
     
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  3. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    When Christians cannot be honest about as trivial and obvious of a failed prophecy as the Tyre prophecy, how do you expect them to be honest about such major failed prophecies?
     
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  4. Samantha Rinne

    Samantha Rinne Active Member

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    Herp derp, the world is still here, so Jesus must not have come...

    Uhhh, about that. Did Jesus say his second coming would destroy the world?

    Every single Gospel has Jesus sightings. Supposedly, Jesus went back to the Father, but ummm there were new followers.

    https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/20140612114310-117953348-second-coming-of-christ-misunderstood

    Oh lookie, same quotes.

    We are living in a world that is already reborn. It is a matter of us seeing it.

    Second, it is important to note that there is actually a specific tense used for making prophecies. It is called prophetic perfect tense. It's a sort of strange mix of future and present tense. More on this here.

    Prophetic perfect tense - Wikipedia

    That is, the prophecy of God not only will happen, but has happened, but is always happening. Each generation faces the end of the world, the apocalypse. Rather than seeking to declare it false, what could you do right now to cope with your own personal Jesus (reach out and touch faith) and what's to come?
     
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  5. Hubert Farnsworth

    Hubert Farnsworth Well-Known Member

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    Ha-ha. Have the stars fallen to earth yet? Has Jesus gathered up all his followers and raptured them to the clouds while raining judgment down upon the unbelievers? No? Then the prophecies have failed. Again, read the contexts for yourself (I didn't provide all the context for the sake of brevity, but if you read the entire chapters, you know that clearly Jesus is referring to an end-of-the-world scenario).
     
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  6. David T

    David T Well-Known Member
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    So you are saying Christianity is accurate to its own text? I am waiting
    For you to tell me young creationism is brilliant ..... Are you proposing young creationism is brilliant?, personally I know it's absurd but hey.....
     
  7. David T

    David T Well-Known Member
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    Its stupid it makes an assumption of what exactly? Come on skwim I know you are a bit brighter than this.
     
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  8. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    How did you get that from the OP?
     
  9. David T

    David T Well-Known Member
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    I would like to know how there is any proof that people that make such claims aren't blowing hot air... Rather simple question actually. Are you suddenly saying these people are what experts? Of what exactly. They do make idiots feel smart though.
     
  10. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

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    In the big picture 'the gospel will be preached to all nations and then the end will come'
    as Mark says
     
  11. Samantha Rinne

    Samantha Rinne Active Member

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    1. Stars have indeed fallen. It's called a METEOR SHOWER. It happens alot. Moon turning to blood is a solar eclipse. This stuff has happened.
    2. Lemme ask you this. If it happened, a little at a time, how would it be perceived? If you said "missing persons, not even covered by the news" you'd be right. Hey, lookit. How 1,600 People Disappeared on Our Public Lands 1600 people disappeared in the woods. Suppose one person working in a factory, with no wife and no relatives didn't show up to work. They'd be fired, but ppl might not even investigate it. The tax guy would know, that's probably it.
    3. Judgement doesn't need to be "rained down". This is a false prophecy, but for completely different reasons.

    and Matthew 5

    Jesus is indeed referring to the end of the world. However...

    Taoism doesn't even accept the idea of end of the world, finding it immature.
    Hinduism views the world as cyclic.
    Buddhism views the world we see as illusory.

    Unless we want to take the hard stance that other religions besides Christianity have no merit at all, in which case, in trying to discredit Christianity, you have already proven yourself more guilty of judgemental behavior than the Lord whose prophecies you claim as false, then we can claim at least a grain of truth in these statements.

    Therefore:
    1. The world will not "end" in the way you define it. Because it not the nature of God to throw planets into the sun, that is the nature of a spoiled child.
    2. The world has possibly already ended, and we currently living are either those already left behind, or we are living in the New Earth and simply need to learn to see it as such. Or we are possibly damned who are reborn in order to advance spiritually and are currently in a sort of karmic Hell to help us develop.
    3. If #2 was true, and you were unable to see Earth properly, how would you even know it happened? You'd see only the illusion.
     
  12. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Oh my, too tempting to comment.

    So you have nothing at all. I thought as much.
     
  13. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    So the prophecy failed you are saying. Or did you not understand it?
     
  14. Hockeycowboy

    Hockeycowboy Well-Known Member
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    Do you know what the “Israel of God” refers to, at Galatians 6:15-16? Or how that relates to the 144,000 at Revelation 7:4-8? And what is “the tribe of Joseph”? (There was no fleshly, literal tribe. Then is there a figurative Israel?)

    It would probably behoove you to find out these things, before making assumptions.

    I would suggest searching “wol.jw.org”
     
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  15. Hubert Farnsworth

    Hubert Farnsworth Well-Known Member

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    1. Meteors aren't stars. You should learn some basic astronomy.
    2. The events described by these passages are clearly supposed to occur at one time, at the end-of-the-world.
     
  16. Hubert Farnsworth

    Hubert Farnsworth Well-Known Member

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    You didn't even acknowledge my original post, and instead just directed me to a Jehovah's Witness site. Lolol:tearsofjoy:
     
  17. Hubert Farnsworth

    Hubert Farnsworth Well-Known Member

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    Interesting to note the lack of responses from Christians to this thread. Not surprising, since the prophecies are so obviously erroneous.
     
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  18. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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    Can you explain exactly who ( Death ) is,
    That brother shall betray brother to death

    In Matthew 10:21--- And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.

    At what point and time does this take place, that the brother shall deliver up the brother ?
    And who exactly is Death, What is Death's name ?
     
  19. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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    You Quoted ----> Matthew 16:27-28: "For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father's glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done. Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

    But you have not explain exactly who death is nor given what is the name of Death ?
    Your sure are having a hard time in understanding Prophecy.

    Your great at giving things, but do not explain the simplest things in Prophecy
    Such as who is Death, What is Death's name.
     
  20. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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    The only thing that is failed, Is you having no understanding anything about Prophecy.
     
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