facts, opinions, and beliefs

jonjohnrob11 · May 1, 2004

facts are truths like a pen is used several diffferent ways, l plus l is 2, everything has color or the absence of it. opinions are whether i like red or blue or both; whether i would rather eat steak or fish, should i fast or pray now or both. beliefs are spiritual truths that i have faith to know, and which may or be illogical or logical.

painted wolf · May 6, 2004

math changes depending on what base your in... normaly we use base 10... but computers use base 2 and the mayan calander uses base 20... so eaven the absolutes of math depend on the point of view....
Chickens and bees see into the ultraviolet so color for them is different from us... same with dogs who have truble seeing reds... and eaven people who are color blind... again the truth of something as simple as color is up to the viewer...

These are facts... my calling blue, blue is a belief that comes from the way I was taught as a child...

todays date isn't a fact either its a belief... there are various calanders out there that work well... but I go by the Gregorian calander because thats what my culture uses....
todays date according to the mayan calander...
http://www.pauahtun.org/cgi-bin/gregmaya.py

facts are subjective...

wa:-do

Engyo · May 7, 2004

"facts are subjective........"

Science agrees with you. Is anyone familiar with the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, or Schroedinger's Cat, or the wave/particle light experiments?

Mr Spinkles · May 7, 2004

We've been learning about the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle this year. It's true, ultimately we can't claim anything is a "fact".

Still, that belief gets us nowhere. If we want to make any progress, we have to assume that if a pattern occurs with no sign of changing, it will always continue that way. So for example, if all of us observe that things fall down when we drop them, then after years and years of observing this exact same behavior we can pretty much accept the notion that things will always continue to fall down when dropped. Building off of simple "facts" such as these, we can begin to figure out more complicated aspects of nature. It is only in this way- by observing, hypothesizing, and testing- that we can ever gather reliable information. By now, certain things have been observed so many times by so many people that we can pretty much accept them as facts.

Lightkeeper · May 7, 2004

The only constant is that everything changes. It seems that facts, beliefs and opinions are all similar in that they are subject to change. The problem is when we believe our facts, beliefs and opinions to be static and take them too seriously.

Mr Spinkles · May 8, 2004

I agree- that's why I like how scientists question and investigate the world, and use objective evidence rather than subjective faith to back things up. I also like how scientists will admit an old theory was wrong if new evidence refutes it.

Lightkeeper · May 8, 2004

Mr_Spinkles said:
I agree- that's why I like how scientists question and investigate the world, and use objective evidence rather than subjective faith to back things up. I also like how scientists will admit an old theory was wrong if new evidence refutes it.

Many scientific discoveries were made by religious people, i.e. Newton and Hawkings. You can't assume all religious people don't question. Religion like everything else is evolving. Stephen Hawkings says "the goal is to know the mind of God."

jonjohnrob11 · May 9, 2004

sorry painted wolf let me simplify my definitions:

facts: u exist; u think unless unconcious or sleeping; u have a body. u have a mind; u have a life; u have a spirit; u have a soul; etc.

opinions: i like spinach which is also a fact; i like u, which is also factual; i love indians, etc.

beliefs: the world is flat; aliens exist; God is dead; etc.

faith: riligious beliefs such as God is alive; Jesus ressurected, Gallileo is in heaven; aliens are evil angels; etc.

trust: blind faith

jonjohnrob11 · May 9, 2004

engyo: i was familiar with them in 1970-1, but forgot them. i no longer teach science. sorry. u'll find them in science texts.

jonjohnrob11 · May 9, 2004

thanx mr. sprinkles: heisenberg had problems with definitions. socrates or descartes once said, "i think therefore i am." one can expound and say i am aware therefore i exist; i feel therefor i am; i see(unless blind); i hear etc.; i smell etc.; i taste etc.

refer to my topic on senses, u will be pleasantly surprised. luv. butch

jonjohnrob11 · May 9, 2004

Mr. sprinkles: einstein was wrong about his general and specific theories of relativity. only one scientist would back him up and that was probalbly so he feel better as he never would admit being wrong.
l love albett: he made science popular. i don't like combing my hair either, only when necessary. i like his style.

jonjohnrob11 · May 9, 2004

lt.keeper: once u know the heart of a child u can teach him to mind.

Mr Spinkles · May 11, 2004

Lightkeeper said:
Many scientific discoveries were made by religious people, i.e. Newton and Hawkings. You can't assume all religious people don't question. Religion like everything else is evolving. Stephen Hawkings says "the goal is to know the mind of God."

Good point--however, they used science to discover those things, not religion. I apologize if it seemed like I was suggesting that no religious people question. What I meant to say is that it is better to treat ideas as theories, rather than have "belief" in them (in my opinion). Many religious people today are already doing this with their religious ideas (notably the Unitarians), and I commend them for that. :clap:

painted wolf · May 6, 2004

math changes depending on what base your in... normaly we use base 10... but computers use base 2 and the mayan calander uses base 20... so eaven the absolutes of math depend on the point of view....
Chickens and bees see into the ultraviolet so color for them is different from us... same with dogs who have truble seeing reds... and eaven people who are color blind... again the truth of something as simple as color is up to the viewer...

These are facts... my calling blue, blue is a belief that comes from the way I was taught as a child...

todays date isn't a fact either its a belief... there are various calanders out there that work well... but I go by the Gregorian calander because thats what my culture uses....
todays date according to the mayan calander...
http://www.pauahtun.org/cgi-bin/gregmaya.py

facts are subjective...

wa:-do

Engyo · May 7, 2004

"facts are subjective........"

Science agrees with you. Is anyone familiar with the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, or Schroedinger's Cat, or the wave/particle light experiments?

Mr Spinkles · May 7, 2004

We've been learning about the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle this year. It's true, ultimately we can't claim anything is a "fact".

Still, that belief gets us nowhere. If we want to make any progress, we have to assume that if a pattern occurs with no sign of changing, it will always continue that way. So for example, if all of us observe that things fall down when we drop them, then after years and years of observing this exact same behavior we can pretty much accept the notion that things will always continue to fall down when dropped. Building off of simple "facts" such as these, we can begin to figure out more complicated aspects of nature. It is only in this way- by observing, hypothesizing, and testing- that we can ever gather reliable information. By now, certain things have been observed so many times by so many people that we can pretty much accept them as facts.

Lightkeeper · May 7, 2004

The only constant is that everything changes. It seems that facts, beliefs and opinions are all similar in that they are subject to change. The problem is when we believe our facts, beliefs and opinions to be static and take them too seriously.

Mr Spinkles · May 8, 2004

I agree- that's why I like how scientists question and investigate the world, and use objective evidence rather than subjective faith to back things up. I also like how scientists will admit an old theory was wrong if new evidence refutes it.

Lightkeeper · May 8, 2004

Mr_Spinkles said:
I agree- that's why I like how scientists question and investigate the world, and use objective evidence rather than subjective faith to back things up. I also like how scientists will admit an old theory was wrong if new evidence refutes it.

Many scientific discoveries were made by religious people, i.e. Newton and Hawkings. You can't assume all religious people don't question. Religion like everything else is evolving. Stephen Hawkings says "the goal is to know the mind of God."

jonjohnrob11 · May 9, 2004

sorry painted wolf let me simplify my definitions:

facts: u exist; u think unless unconcious or sleeping; u have a body. u have a mind; u have a life; u have a spirit; u have a soul; etc.

opinions: i like spinach which is also a fact; i like u, which is also factual; i love indians, etc.

beliefs: the world is flat; aliens exist; God is dead; etc.

faith: riligious beliefs such as God is alive; Jesus ressurected, Gallileo is in heaven; aliens are evil angels; etc.

trust: blind faith

facts, opinions, and beliefs

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