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Featured Extraterrestial Creator ?

Discussion in 'Theological Concepts' started by Neuropteron, Mar 11, 2019.

  1. Neuropteron

    Neuropteron Member

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    Some scientists are willing to consider that life (or humans) on earth was created by extraterrestials.

    The questions seems valid that if scientists are willing to consider that life came from an extraterrestial source, is that not a basis for considering God as that source ?
     
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  2. Woberts

    Woberts The Perfumed Seneschal

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    No.
     
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  3. Salvador

    Salvador RF's Swedenborgian

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    The numeric and semantic message of "037" that's been embedded in our genetic coding by our Creator gets conveyed to me who computes with a base 10 numeric system.

    This is evident to me by how each codon relates to 3 other particular codons having the same particular type of initial nucleobase and sequential nucleobase subsequently then followed by a different ending nucleobase. Half of these 4 set of codon groups ( whole family codons ) each code for the same particular amino acid. The other half of those 4 set of codon groups ( split codons ) don't code for the same amino acid. So then, in the case of whole family codons, there are 37 amino acid peptide chain nucleons for each relevant nucleobase determinant of how a particular amino acid gets coded. Start codons express 0 at the beginning of 37 Hence, the meaningful numeric and semantic message of 037 gets unambiguously and factually conveyed to us present day Earthling human beings with our genetic code invented by a superior intelligence beyond that of anybody presently bound to Earth.

    The significance of the semantic message "037" embedded in our genetic coding is well-explained in the following journal articles: .
    Biosystems Volume 70, Issue 3, August 2003, Pages 187-209 "Arithmetic inside the universal genetic code" Author: Vladimir I. shCherbak
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar...4703000662

    NeuroQuantology | December 2011 | Vol 9 | Issue 4 | Page 702-715 Masic, Natasa Nested Properties of shCherbak’s PQ 037 and (Biological) Coding/Computing Nested Numeric/Geometric/Arithmetic Propertiesof shCherbak’s Prime Quantum 037 as a Base of (Biological) Coding/Computing

    https://www.researchgate.net/public...m_037_as_a_Base_of_Biological_CodingComputing

    The human genome has 145 "alien" genes that can't be linked to any of our distant past human ancestors; these genes are in our genome from the process of horizontal gene transfer. These 145 "alien" genes, which nobody inherited from any distant past terrestrial ancestor, might have been the result of genetic engineering by advanced extraterrestrial intelligence or from a post human futuristic civilization.

    Reference:

    Expression of multiple horizontally acquired genes is a hallmark of both vertebrate and invertebrate genomes
    Genome Biology201516:50
    Expression of multiple horizontally acquired genes is a hallmark of both vertebrate and invertebrate genomes
    • Received: 25 September 2014
    • Accepted: 4 February 2015
    • Published: 13 March 2015


    Cosmic ancestry theory can often explain the transitional evolutionary changes between species that aren't well-explained by traditional Darwinian evolution.

    Viruses can insert new genes, which have never before encountered by a species, to become part of the species' genome. These transferred genes are a vital part evolution. According to Cosmic Ancestry, the horizontal transfer of genes by viruses and other means is essential for evolutionary progress.

    Three New Human Genes
    and De Novo Genes in General | What'sNEW

    Entirely novel human-specific protein-coding genes originating from ancestrally noncoding sequences have been reported by two geneticists at the University of Dublin

    Reference:

    David G. Knowles and Aoife McLysaght, "Recent de novo origin of human protein-coding genes" [abstract], doi:10.1101/gr.095026.109, Genome Research, online 2 Sep 2009.
    Discovery of novel genes..., by EurekAlert!, 1 Sep 2009.
    Genes That Make Us Human, by Elizabeth Pennisi, ScienceNOW, 1 Sep 2009.
    Three human genes evolved from junk, by Michael Le Page, NewScientist, 3 Sep 2009.
    Which Genes Make Us Human? by Alan Boyle, MSNBC, 3 Sep 2009.

    ."Analyzing available data, they identified genes that are expressed in the human species but not in chimps. They then looked for simiar sequences in other primates, finding three. The chimp and macaque (unexpressed) sequences are nearly identical to the human one, but are interrupted by frameshifting insertions and stop codons.
    Although the three human genes are known to be expressed from several lines of evidence, their functions are not definitively characterized. However one, chronic lymphocytic leukemia upregulated gene 1 (CLLU1), appears to have a role in that human disease. Its sequence among humans, compared to the matching one in chimps and macaques, is illustrated below."

    [​IMG]

    "Multiple sequence alignment of the gene sequence of the human gene CLLU1 and similar nucleotide sequences from the syntenic location in chimp and macaque. The start codon is located immediately following the first alignment gap, which was inserted for clarity. Stop codons are indicated by red boxes. The sequenced peptide identified from this locus is indicated in orange. The critical mutation that allows the production of a protein is the deletion of an A nucleotide, which is present in both chimp and macaque (indicated by an arrow). This causes a frameshift in human that results in a much longer ORF capable of producing a 121-amino acids-long protein. Both the chimp and macaque sequences have a stop codon after only 42 potential codons." © Genome Research 2009
    CLLU1 is also disabled by a matching point insertion in the gorilla and gibbon, but not orangutan, genomes. The geneticists reason, If the ancestral primate sequence was coding, then we would need to infer that an identical 1-bp insertion occurred in four lineages independently, whereas if we infer the presence of the disabler in the ancestral sequence, then we must infer two independent 1-bp deletions. The inference that the ancestral sequence was noncoding is a more parsimonious explanation of the data, even without considering that the parallel insertion of a specific base into an identical location is probably less likely than the parallel deletion of one base. ...We hypothesize that these genes have originated de novo in the human lineage, since the divergence with chimp from ancestrally noncoding sequence.

    Consider the human nucleotide sequence designated CLLU1, 121 codons in length. A codon, three nucleotides, may encode any of 20 amino acids, or a stop. (But this sequence is a gene, an open reading frame with no stops.)
    Assume that the protein encoded by this nucleotide sequence needs ~25%, or 30, of its codons exactly right. In other words, only 1 out of 21 codons can occupy each of those 30 positions. The chance that 30 random codons will match this sequence in one trial can be estimated as

    (1/21)^30 = ~10^-40

    Assume that the remaining 91 codons in this sequence may vary widely, encoding any of 10 of life's 20 amino acids, but no stops. In other words, 10 out of 21 codons can occupy each of those 91 codon positions. The chance that 91 random codons will satisfy these criteria in one trial is approximately

    (10/21)^91 = ~10^-30

    Combining these assumptions, the chance that a given sequence of 121 random codons will constitute a working version of this gene is on the order of

    10^(-40-30) = 10^-70 ..."

    (This method copies Chandra Wickramasinghe's in The Legacy of Fred Hoyle, reviewed 2005.)

    Reference: Metazoan Genes Older Than Metazoa?, 25 Oct 1996.

    "If a new genetic program arrives by the strong panspermia process, intervening (ancestral) species should possess either nearly identical versions of it ...or nothing similar.."
    Reference: New genetic programs in Darwinism and strong panspermia, 7 Apr 2002.
    .At least some of the silent DNA is for future use ."]Reference: Why Sexual Reproduction?, first posted May 1996.
    "Point mutations and other simple mechanisms can switch existing programs off and on."
    Reference: Testing Darwinism versus Cosmic Ancestry, 24 Nov 2002
    "This process would ...depend on sophisticated software management that can recognize an installed program."
    Reference: Duplication Makes A New Primate Gene, 21 Feb 2005.
    "New genetic programs will be continually offered for testing."
    Reference: How is it Possible?

    This mark of intelligence left in our genetic coding is indicative of an intelligent designer, whom we Earthling humans may never truly understand.

    I've been accused of following the "Aliens of the gaps" or the "Computer (simulator) of the gaps", so I can relate to the "God of the gaps" fallacy. ...:)

    [​IMG]
     
    #3 Salvador, Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
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  4. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    As far as I know, legitimate scientists do not consider the possibility that extraterrestrials as the Creator of life. There is a hypothesis that some of the amino acids that formed life are extraterrestrial in origin.
     
  5. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    You'd then be asking whether the same scientists think the extraterrestrial source was natural, or uncaused.

    Assuming they're wearing their science hats, assuming a supernatural entity makes no sense.
     
  6. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    Yep. There was some very loose suggestions floated that more complete cephalopod DNA could have been 'imported'.
    This wasn't even at hypothesis level, to my knowledge. Just acknowledgement that space-born 'building blocks' may have been more advanced than a retro-virus.

    Haven't seen anything approaching science that suggests this is likely though.
     
  7. Jollybear

    Jollybear Hey

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    Is francis crick a legitimate scientist? :cool:
     
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  8. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    The existence of lifeforms from outside of this earth is confirmed by the Bible. These lifeforms had the ability to materialize flesh and blood. They can do what science cannot even fathom. How does science know that they can't exist?
    What does "extraterrestrial" mean after all? :shrug:

    It depends on what "extraterrestrial" means in their own definition. Do they have to be material beings? Does it depend on whether scientists have the equipment to test for their existence? What does science really know about the realms that they cannot detect with their present infantile knowledge and narrow minds?

    There is so much more that science has to learn before it can be certain of anything. Why do we think that everything is a theory.....? Its a belief that requires no proof, just evidence. Faith requires exactly the same IMO.
     
    #8 Deeje, Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
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  9. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

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    Well, Francis Crick, one of the co-discovers of the spiral structure of DNA realized life is so complex it could not simply have evolved on earth... his conclusion.... it came from aliens long ago.
    Big problem... no explanation where the aliens came from.

    An article by Gary Bates
    shown in part below
    Designed by aliens? (Crick, Watson, atheism, panspermia) - creation.com

    Designed by aliens?
    Discoverers of DNA’s structure attack Christianity
    by Gary Bates

    Francis Crick and James Watson have used the occasion of the 50th anniversary of their discovery of the DNA double helix as an excuse to attack belief in a Creator.1

    wikimedia commons[​IMG]
    Francis Crick and James Watson. Together with Maurice Wilkins they received the Noble Prize in 1962 for their discovery of the double helix structure of DNA back in 1953.
    A recent UK news article about the Nobel-Prize–winning pair claimed ‘scientific discoveries have a habit of offending religious susceptibilities’, and pointed out, ‘Watson and Crick are both outspoken atheists.’1

    Crick’s atheistic faith leads to absurd pseudoscience
    Unfortunately, Crick was not being entirely forthright in this regard. He does hold a religious view. Atheism is a religion in the sense of answering the ‘big questions’, such as ‘Where did we come from?’ and ‘What is our destiny?’, and is foundationally a belief system, since the non-existence of God could hardly be said to have been proven! So he must explain the origin of DNA from his religious perspective, and, subsequently, the origin of life on earth
     
  10. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    I think that is precisely how it happened. It just beats me why intelligent people can't make that connection.
     
  11. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

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    Well, there was an episode on Star Trek the Next Generation where Jean Luc Picard discovered exactly that !!

    Not sure that counts

    Screen Shot 2019-03-11 at 10.58.06 PM.png

    see The Chase (Star Trek: The Next Generation) - Wikipedia
    where the holographic projection of the race that seeded the Milky Way are shown
     
  12. wellwisher

    wellwisher Active Member

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    Another explanation for the anomalies on the DNA, that are explained by some using an alien theory addendum, is maybe our knowledge of DNA is not as advanced as we think. If one was trying to maintain the infallibility of a theory, while looking at anomalies, that our theory cannot explain, we can either change our thinking, or keep it the same theory and add band-aids like aliens.

    Water is part of the DNA. There are hydrogen bonding acceptor and donor groups also over the DNA, that are all earmarked for water. The DNA contains a double helix of water, as part of its structure. This hydrogen bonded double helix of water is needed for DNA functionality. DNA does not work properly if sufficient water is not present.

    2 Peter 3:5 But they deliberately forget that long ago by God's word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water.

    If you place the DNA in any solvent, besides water, i.e., replace the attached water with any other solvent, the DNA as well as its enzymes do not work. This on-off switch; water versus any other solvent, should lead one to logically conclude that water is uniquely designed and required to make DNA functional.

    Water was there since the first stars of the universe. Water is now the second most common molecule in the universe; behind H2. Water, as ice, is currently the most abundant solid material in the universe. Water is involved in modern star formation. The common nature of solid water; ice, makes it available all over the universe as the easiest abundant material ,for gravity to act upon, for star formation. DNA evolved in water, with the water setting the nanoscale chemical environment for chemical natural selection, from which DNA would appear.

    In terms of DNA and water and the conformational states of the DNA;

    By differing the amount of hydrating water along the donor and acceptor groups of the DNA, the DNA can form different helical configurations; A, B, C, D, Z, with the beta configuration used by life requiring the most attached water of hydration. Theoretically, if we could control the level of hydration along various parts of the DNA, you can alter the local configuration and its functionality. This can theoretically allow you to trick the proofreader enzymes. The current theory assumes a type of uniform hydration, allowing proofreader enzymes to maintain one type of alphabet and language for proofing. The anomalies are like adding slang to this language and can be theoretically accomplished on a variable DNA hydration platform.

    As a side note; Recently water experiments were done by a Russian team, where they trapped single water molecules within interstitial cavities of emerald crystals. The original experiments was to see if all the separated individual water molecules would align with a magnetic field, to form something like a magnet, similar to what iron atom do. The result was yes. All the positive and negative poles align.

    This was not the big observation. The single water molecules, in the small interstitial cavities, had six possible places for the two hydrogen of water to align and minimize energy. What they observed was the two hydrogen protons of the caged water molecule appeared in all six places, simultaneously. The two hydrogen protons of water were quantum tunneling between six locations.

    This quantum tunneling affect sort of transcends our normal experience of space and time. Two things should not be in six places in space, all at the same time. This is not unusual and is predicted by quantum physics. However this observation in light if life offering water many confinement scenarios, theoretically adds additional physics properties to the hydrogen protons of water in life. When time and space break down in quantum tunneling, the past, present and future can overlap since time and space is no longer in any sequence.

    If we read a book, we start on page one and then sequentially go from beginning to end as we flip the pages. But in the case of quantum tunneling, the beginning and end of the six locations are not in sequence, but all occur at the same time. This is more like surfing the internet, where we can jump around a book without flipping the pages in sequence. We hyperlink around and between the normal sequences within space and time. The needs of the future can overlap the present, so the needs of the happy ending is known in advance. Consciousness does this.

    Aliens explanations can offer a sequential explanation in space and time. But quantum tunneling offers a quantum explanation outside of space and time.



     
    #12 wellwisher, Mar 12, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
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  13. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    Crick, Sagan and others loosely proposed the possibility of panspermia in the 1960's and 70's, but never proposed a serious hypothesis based objective verifiable evidence. This view has faded as more evidence on the origins and nature of life has become known. These scientists did propose we try and develop 'Directed Panspermia' in other possible worlds in our galaxy, but this view has also faded . I travel in space we are likely to carry our life to other worlds, like Mars, and contaminate them unintentionally.

    More recent research on the nature of the life and DNA has precluded any possibility of foreign origins at the complex level. Natural origins of some amino acids that formed naturally in our solar system in the asteroid belt as the present evidence indicates.
     
  14. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    True, observed? anomalies are hypothetical at best, and even the present knowledge of Genetics does not consider the hypothetical anomalies a real problem.

    'Arguing from hypothetical ignorance' is never a good way to approach science.
     
  15. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    My thought is based on a feeling. Your thought seem to be based upon much more knowledge than I have. People seem to insist on keeping God and those with him on a mysterious basis.
     
  16. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

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    I wonder whether the same scientists think the extraterrestrial creators of man, were created by extraterrestrial beings, who were created by extraterrestrial beings, who were created by-- - - - - - - - add Infin.
     
  17. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    Are you asking what they think (which would vary somewhat) or what their science can test and effectively hypothesise on?
     
  18. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

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    Hypothesis..... (1) "An assertion subject to verification or proof." (2) "A theory supported by no objective evidence; a groundless assumption."
     
  19. wellwisher

    wellwisher Active Member

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    If you assume an alien connection, the question becomes, where did the aliens come from, in their very beginning? Aliens address the human origin questions, but not the questions of universal life origins.

    Bible stories in Genesis talk about sons of God; aliens? breeding with the daughters of man. The hybrid human-alien (sons) where call the Nephilim.

    Sampson and the project managers of the Pyramids may have been considered Nephilim.
     
  20. wellwisher

    wellwisher Active Member

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    There is a theory that the microtubules in neurons have a connection to consciousness. These nanoscale microbes offer a way to place single water molecules in confined spaces, for the generation of quantum tunneling affects. However, it is not clear how such a signal is interfaced to the normal sequential processes of biochemistry. Although lack of a direct mechanism would be a way to explain will power and choice.
     
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