Explain how math is not a universal logic

[Slapstick]

Bees can make Hexagons when they create their honeycombs. Yet, most people probably don’t know what a hexagon is.

Explain how math and logic is something only humans are capable of discovering and understanding when these objects and phenomena are found in nature.

Edit: Added some Links

http://coloradobeekeepers.org/wp-con...athematics.pdf
Honey Bees Can Tell The Difference Between Different Numbers At A Glance
https://agdev.anr.udel.edu/maarec/ho...-organization/
Information Sheet 10, Honey Bees are Important Pollinators
https://sites.google.com/site/mybeep.../bees-and-math

 

[Skwim]

Bees can make Hexagons when they create their honeycombs. Yet, most people probably don’t know what a hexagon is.

Explain how math and logic is something only humans are capable of discovering and understanding when these objects and phenomena are found in nature.

No.





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[NobodyYouKnow]

Mathematics in purest form is the 'language of God', it's just that scientists cannot speak it fluently enough yet.

Mathematics represents a concept...like musical notes on paper represent the most beautiful symphony to delight the senses.

In simplest form, all manner of nature can be thus defined.

Whenever I watch this video I am about to show you, I get all goosebumpy in a huge way because I know God is responsible for all this...I can see His dance in this...

Take it further, into the realms of the 'Golden Ratio' and sacred geometry and it will just blow everything away. I have had a few very nice experiences doing it:

[youtube]P0tLbl5LrJ8[/youtube]
The Fibonacci Sequence - YouTube

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

I just watched that again (for about the hundredth time now) and I am crying...again.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

Its a nice video and some elegant mathematical representations are possible of many phenomenon. Thats hardly surprising; since maths and geometry are related and geometry and physical things are related.

The naturalistic associations are wonderous, there is no need to pervert mathematics with psuedo religious associations.

 

[LuisDantas]

Bees can make Hexagons when they create their honeycombs. Yet, most people probably don’t know what a hexagon is.

Explain how math and logic is something only humans are capable of discovering and understanding when these objects and phenomena are found in nature.

Math is indeed an universal logic. But that does not mean that all people must understand it, nor that those like bees that demonstrate it know anything of it.

Part of the reason why it is universal is in fact because it does not need to be validated by a sentient being.

 

[Enai de a lukal]

Bees can make Hexagons when they create their honeycombs. Yet, most people probably don’t know what a hexagon is.

Explain how math and logic is something only humans are capable of discovering and understanding when these objects and phenomena are found in nature.

In what sense does a bee understand mathematics when it makes its honeycomb in a geometric pattern?

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

I am not too sure, after all, Hinduism gave us 'nothing'.

Seriously though. I am just totally awestruck, humbled and totally appreciative of all this and I don't know why...

I don't know why I get all emo when I see a very nice equation...but I do.

 

[Skwim]

Mathematics in purest form is the 'language of God', it's just that scientists cannot speak it fluently enough yet.

Mathematics represents a concept...like musical notes on paper represent the most beautiful symphony to delight the senses.

I fail to see anything beautiful in the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter.

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If mathematics is the "language of god" then why all this gibberish? He should have been able to construct the universe where pi = 3, or some other rational number.

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

I fail to see anything beautiful in the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter.

. . . . . . . . . . .

​

If mathematics is the "language of god" then why all this gibberish? He should have been able to construct the universe where pi = 3, or some other rational number.

It isn't just the expression of Pi in numeric terms, but how the concept of Pi relates to what we understand about our known universe and the many permutations thereof.

This is the main reason why I have the Sri Yantra as my Avatar. It shows this in a representational form - I always preferred triangles over circles anyway. lol

[youtube]eYDwWbDhCEg[/youtube]
Ancient Knowledge Pt.2 Fibonacci Sequence, Golden Ratio, Phi in Nature, DNA, Fingerprint of God - YouTube

 

[Slapstick]

I fail to see anything beautiful in the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter.

. . . . . . . . . . .

​

If mathematics is the "language of god" then why all this gibberish? He should have been able to construct the universe where pi = 3, or some other rational number.

Actually that is human error and there was recently a person with savants who found a mathematical flaw with pi.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

Actually that is human error and there was recently a person with savants who found a mathematical flaw with pi.

link?

 

[The Sum of Awe]

If you're not aware of what binary is? Does it mean the game does not exist?

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

*waits for the inevitable Matrix reference again* lol

Meanwhile, lost in the land of fractals and tesseracts...

[youtube]gEw8xpb1aRA[/youtube]
Mandelbrot Set Zoom - YouTube

 

[Parsimony]

Why should humans be the only beings capable of discovering and understanding math and logic in the first place?

 

[InformedIgnorance]

Because thus far humans are the only entities known to be conscious (it is arguable that animals might be conscious yet we cannot detect it) - therefore to date it seems that humans are so far the only entities to which concepts like math are known to have meaning and have the capacity to be intentionally (whether consciously or subconsciously) leveraged for utility. It IS possible that other entities might either already have or one day develop such capabilities - but if so once again it seem inevitable that this can only arise through the development of consciousness.

 

[Skwim]

It isn't just the expression of Pi in numeric terms, but how the concept of Pi relates to what we understand about our known universe and the many permutations thereof.

Yes, it is just the expression of Pi in numeric terms. If you have other concerns, fine, but they're not my concerns.

Actually that is human error and there was recently a person with savants who found a mathematical flaw with pi.

Well, let's hear more about this person with savants who found a mathematical flaw with pi.

 

[Sunstone]

Bees can make Hexagons when they create their honeycombs. Yet, most people probably don’t know what a hexagon is.

Explain how math and logic is something only humans are capable of discovering and understanding when these objects and phenomena are found in nature.

It's was discovered years ago -- pre-internet dark ages, actually -- that bees make round cells rather than hexagonal cells. The cells turn into hexagons because they are squeezed together from all angles at once. Any group of round cells packed that way will form hexagons if they are malleable enough in the first place.

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

If you have other concerns, fine, but they're not my concerns.

That's cool. Hardly anybody is in the same 'space' I am anyway, so it makes discussing things very difficult and gives me a migraine even trying...I have one now, but that's more due to reductionism. lol

 

[Enai de a lukal]

Because thus far humans are the only entities known to be conscious (it is arguable that animals might be conscious yet we cannot detect it) - therefore to date it seems that humans are so far the only entities to which concepts like math are known to have meaning and have the capacity to be intentionally (whether consciously or subconsciously) leveraged for utility. It IS possible that other entities might either already have or one day develop such capabilities - but if so once again it seem inevitable that this can only arise through the development of consciousness.

:yes:

Exactly. Mathematics involves understanding symbols, and manipulating them in certain ways according to given rules- both of which require some pretty sophisticated cognitive machinery, which makes understanding mathematics a pretty exclusive club.