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Exeption vs Redemption Debate

kreeden

Virus of the Mind
I posted this in Theological Concepts , but I'm not sure if that was the correct place for it , and as I hope to get as many views as possible I have decided to ask the same thing here .

A friend and I have a bit of a disagreement on the topic . So I decided to run the question here .

Is there a difference between exemption and redemption ? If so , what ? Are they related ? If so , how so ? Did Christ both exempt us , and redeem us ? If so , surely not of the same thing ? Seems redundant .


Personally , I believe that there is a difference , but I want to wait and get a few other views before stating mine .
 

McBell

Resident Sourpuss
The big problem I see is that there really has not been given enough information to answer the question.

However, Here is my .02:
If one is exempt, there is no need for redemption.
 

James the Persian

Dreptcredincios Crestin
I have to ask how you've heard the term exemption used in a theological context, because it's a new one on me. If you can explain that, I might be able to provide an answer better than the one I was going to give which is thayt exemption is not applicable.

James
 

kreeden

Virus of the Mind
I believe that you have just answered my question James . Or at least put it in a way that I understand where the problem started .

The death of Christ didn't exempt us from anything , it just set things right . I am refering to the " original sin " here . Which I was about to submit to my friend's arguement ....

But then , doesn't the Bible say that Jesus fillfulled the First Covenant ? And if so , would that not imply that we are now exempt ?
 

James the Persian

Dreptcredincios Crestin
kreeden said:
I believe that you have just answered my question James . Or at least put it in a way that I understand where the problem started .

The death of Christ didn't exempt us from anything , it just set things right . I am refering to the " original sin " here . Which I was about to submit to my friend's arguement ....
I don't hold to the whole 'original sin' thing. Augustine's theology made next to no impact upon the east, but certainly we are not exempt from anything. We still can sin and we still have a tendency to do so. Any talk of exemption sounds to me rather like OSAS which is not a doctrine that I consider there to be valid Scriptural support for (or support in Tradition for that matter, though I suspect from the talk that your friend is a protestant of some stripe). The only time I've ever heard exemption used theologically is in the RC doctrine of the Immaculate Conception (which is basically that Mary was free of Original Sin), but this for us is heretical.

But then , doesn't the Bible say that Jesus fillfulled the First Covenant ? And if so , would that not imply that we are now exempt ?
We are exempt from the Jewish Law, if that's what you mean. But then, most of us, being from Gentile stock, always were. Fulfillment does not mean abolition, however and so I'm still not sure exemption is the right word. We've simply replaced the minutiae of Jewish Law with the commandments to love God and love one another which Christ taught covered the entire Law.

James
 

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
kreeden said:
I believe that you have just answered my question James . Or at least put it in a way that I understand where the problem started .

The death of Christ didn't exempt us from anything , it just set things right . I am refering to the " original sin " here . Which I was about to submit to my friend's arguement ....

But then , doesn't the Bible say that Jesus fillfulled the First Covenant ? And if so , would that not imply that we are now exempt ?

This is so cryptic and contains questionable theology but I'll attempt something anyway.

Because of sin man dies. Christ redeems us from the penalty of sin which is death.

We are also exempt from being judged by our evil deeds at judgement day after accepting Christ.
 

James the Persian

Dreptcredincios Crestin
sandy whitelinger said:
This is so cryptic and contains questionable theology but I'll attempt something anyway.

Because of sin man dies. Christ redeems us from the penalty of sin which is death.
This i agree with, as you avoided language that can only be read in tne vein of Penal Substitutionary Atonement.
We are also exempt from being judged by our evil deeds at judgement day after accepting Christ.
This I utterly disagree with and I genuinely have no idea how you could possibly get this belief from either Scripture or Tradition. The New Testament seems quite explicit in saying the opposite.

James
 

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
sandy whitelinger said:
We are also exempt from being judged by our evil deeds at judgement day after accepting Christ.

JamesThePersian said:
This I utterly disagree with and I genuinely have no idea how you could possibly get this belief from either Scripture or Tradition. The New Testament seems quite explicit in saying the opposite.

James
I stated the case for this here:
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43636
 

Bick

Member
This is so cryptic and contains questionable theology but I'll attempt something anyway.

Because of sin man dies. Christ redeems us from the penalty of sin which is death.

We are also exempt from being judged by our evil deeds at judgement day after accepting Christ.

Hi Sandy. You say 'Christ redeems us from the penalty of sin which is death."

NOT TRUE Sandy, for we still die! Unless we are alive at the rapture!

We, in the church/body of Christ await the rapture when the corruptible (dead ones in Christ) put on Incorruption; and those still alive (mortal), will put on Immortality.

Also, if you think we (church/body) are exempt from being judged for our deeds, good and evil; IMO, we will be at the judgment seat (bema--Greek) of Christ in the heavenlies, read these:

Rom. 14:10 "But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ." KJV.

2 Cor. 5:10 "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad."

Being believers in the heavens, I understand the outcome of this judging would be loss of rewards. Obviously not the loss of our salvation.

But, you are right that we, the church/body will not appear to be judged at the Great White Throne.

Bick
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
The whole idea of grace is that we are exempt from the penalty of sin (but not from sin, itself. It's obvious that those who are saved still sin.) It is precisely that exemption from the penalty that has saved us.
 

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
Hi Sandy. You say 'Christ redeems us from the penalty of sin which is death."

NOT TRUE Sandy, for we still die! Unless we are alive at the rapture!Bick

True, let me explain fither; We are redeemed from eternal damnation, or as some believe this to be, destruction. We are redeemed into eternal life with God and free from the penalty of sin and death.
 
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