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Exact Young Earth Age?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by dorsk188, Aug 10, 2005.

  1. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    James, I don't mean to be crass, but was this answer evasive or what?

    I'll try once more, though:

    Do you think Adam and Eve were full-grown?

    Literally, figuratively, metaphysically, comically, radically, or however YOU view it - do you think they were full-grown?

    Or is it you don't think they existed at all?

    If not, just say so, please, and let's simplify this discussion. I don't have time for wordplay --- Judge Mathis is coming on in 10 minutes.
     
  2. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    No it doesn't. Adaptation and evolution are two different things.
     
  3. Fade

    Fade The Great Master Bates

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    You sound so sure of that. I recommend reading up on evolution...and by that I mean evolution as it is understood by scientists rather than the confused ramblings of Creationists. You may be surprised to learn that adaptation is one of the primary elements of evolution. It is practically the definition of it.
     
  4. James the Persian

    James the Persian Dreptcredincios Crestin

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    Sorry, I wasn't meaning to be evasive, I just don't see the relevance of your question. I don't actually see the creation of Adam and Eve as being the beginning of our biological nature at all (for reasons which would take a very long time to go into) so whether or not they were fully grown at the time is irrelevant. Just so that you can't say I'm being evasive, however, I do believe they existed, I do believe they were physically adult and I do read the Genesis creation account much less literally than you do. If you are willing to do a little reading, the following article sums up my own position (because I agree with it wholeheartedly) much better than I can (see in particular chapter 9):

    http://www.fatheralexander.org/booklets/english/creation_man_a_mileant_e.htm#_Toc67449472

    James
     
  5. painted wolf

    painted wolf Grey Muzzle

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    why don't we ever find mammoths and Dinosaurs together?
    Trilobites and turtles or icthyosaurs?

    Why did everyone have to good sence to die in the right order to suggest evolution and why did god arrange it so that some would "age to the right degree" so that it would seem that dinosaurs are 65+ million years old but Mammoths are only 10,000 odd years old?

    Is the only evidence for a young earth a certen interpretation of the bible?
    wa:do
     
  6. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    I'll respectfully pass on that, Fade. I started off this post by saying that God embedded age into His creation, and I showed how the earth has only been in existence for 6000 years, using just the Bible in one hand, and a calculator in the other. Then questions came up, about, of all things, evolution, and I'm trying my best to answer them as I can. Now you want me to read up on it, and, believe me, evolution is not on my best-readers' list. For every book/website you can recommend, I could probably find an equal number to counter them. I'm more interested in what YOU have to say than some author who couldn't care less that we're even here debating this. In my opinion, we're off-topic. If you need help in calculating the earth's age using just the Bible and a calculator alone (with some secular history), just ask. If you're not interested, fine. Please don't change the subject from Chronology to Archeology though and expect me to follow suit.

    But thanks for the offer, anyway.
     
  7. joeboonda

    joeboonda Well-Known Member

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    There are theories about the time it takes light to reach earth from stars that are pretty logical and still support a young earth. Isaiah40:22 takes care of the light from stars, and the flat earth idea (why people thot the earth was flat is beyond me, lol)

    Isaiah 40:22 "It is he (GOd) that sitteth upon the CIRCLE ( in Hebrew also can mean sphere) of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that STRETCHET out the heavens as a curtain, and SPREADETH them out as a tent to dwell in;"

    There are many explanations, but time does not permit, I might say that just as God created Adam as a man he may have created the stars and their light already enroute, but that is just a supposition. The whole stretch and curve deal and the possibility of gravity and other things acting on light is more than i can bite off right now. Anyway, I stick to the Bible, and let science catch up. PEACE!
     
  8. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Again, for about the third time now, who mentioned a young earth?
     
  9. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    Are you certain that they didn't say "light years" instead of plain old years?
    http://cmb.phys.cwru.edu/boomerang/press_images/cmbfacts/cmbfacts.html
    Science has already far surpassed a literal interpretation of the Bible.
     
  10. Fade

    Fade The Great Master Bates

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    Since evolution is clear evidence that the earth is in fact not very young at all, I would argue that we are quite definitely on topic...but anyhoo. You obviously don't like facing up to the inadequacies/contradictions of your belief.

    But since you bring it up(again) please quote the passages of the bible that clearly state that the Earth is 6000 odd years old. Because if you can't, you are yet again guilty of putting words in Gods mouth.
     
  11. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    Actually, they aren't. A synonym for "adaptation" is "microevolution", and macroevolution is merelt adaptation on a larger scale. If you believe that animals can adapt and change to survive in new environments, then you believe in evolution. :eek:
     
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  12. painted wolf

    painted wolf Grey Muzzle

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    you fail to answer the rest of the questions posed.

    You said that the earth was created 6000 years ago.... why should mammoths date at 10,000 years and be above dinosaurs who date at 65 million? Why don't we ever find a mammoth and a Dinosaur together... or a turtle and a triblobite.... and so on.

    wa:do
     
  13. Fade

    Fade The Great Master Bates

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    Do you have a split personality or something? YOU mentioned a young Earth...6000 years ringing any bells? Not to mention that it's the topic of this thread.
     
  14. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Joe, I agree with you on this. Especially about God stretching the Heavens. But I personally don't subscribe to the Earth being as young as we may think it is. It may be millions of years old, I don't know, or it may be just hundreds of thousands. IMHO, God, 6000 years ago, spoke into existence ex nihilo (out of nothing) a universe that is at least 10,000 years old or more.
     
  15. Fade

    Fade The Great Master Bates

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    :biglaugh: :clap
    I didn't want to be the one to point out the basic irony inherent in his argument. You see folks, that is what fundamentalism breeds...no sense of irony.
     
  16. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    Could you please cite the verse in the Bible where this appears? I don't ever remember learning that...

    The Bible is theological evidence, not scientific evidence. If one chooses to believe in the Bible on a literal level, then they are blatantly flying in the face of modern scientific discoveries. Its not necessarily a bad thing, but it is the truth.

    As for the calculator, I assume you are talking about "adding up the ages of patriarchs" and the rest. Again, you are following the Bible and not science. Science has discovered early humans and simple civilizations that date as far back as 2 million years. Ah yes, but I forgot the "embedded age" of the Earth. Again, could you show me where it says that in the Bible, or are you just making things up as you go in order to keep your beliefs justified in your own head?

    http://users.hol.gr/~dilos/prehis/prerm3.htm
     
  17. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Since the Bible was completed in 96 AD - or 2000 years ago - how can it have a passage in it that states the Earth is 6000 years old?

    Do you see how you're putting the Bible into a Catch-22 situation, Fade?

    Let's just say the Earth has been around as long as it is old, just for the sake of arguing.

    Let's say that the Earth has been in existence for 1 million years.

    Then people would be here posting that if you add up the years of the patriarchs, etc., the Earth has only been around for 6000 years! So either way, the Bible loses.

    Believe me, I've debated this long before I joined this forum.
     
  18. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Where the Bible and Science disagree, Science is wrong.

    Since God is the creator of science, the Two are in perfect harmony.
     
  19. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Again, if radiometric dating shows 2 million years, that's fine. It DOES NOT contradict the Bible. It's only showing age, not existence.
     
  20. Fade

    Fade The Great Master Bates

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    Okay mister pedantic. Show me the passage that states the earths age at the time of writing.

    As for your second point...That is exactly what people have been doing ever since we started scientifically investigating the world around us. You seem to have missed the point of the debate.
     
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