Evidence for “a god” at John 10:33

[Muffled]

Yes. focusing solely on John 10:30 that seemed to be the case but in verse 29 he said God our Father is greater . In any case he said who he was in verse 36.

I believe v29 does not negate v30.

I believe v36 reaffirms v30.

 

[Muffled]

A careful examination of John 10:33 and its context shows that it should be translated as "a god." - Examining the Trinity: THEON - 'RDB's Rule' (Jn 1:18; 10:33)

So "I am" would be considered "a god?"

 

[Muffled]

Why must you goddies shout, with bold underlined font and
switching colours about?

I use bold because I have trouble reading lighter text.

I use colors because I like to tie my answer in to a statement that was made.

 

[Audie]

I use bold because I have trouble reading lighter text.

I use colors because I like to tie my answer in to a statement that was made.

Ah, thanks, and if I may, I will give myself a wet-noodle lashing
for being rude.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I believe you are deluded. I certainly have no need of him.

Those words are the most pure honey to me.

I thank you for such a blessing.

Regards Tony

 

[YoursTrue]

No Jesus is not "a God" but God. Jesus is "the Word of God", he is one with the Father.

Here are some biblical passages that clearly show that Jesus is God Himself.

God is the Lord of Lords(Deuteronomy 10:17)=Jesus is the Lord of Lords(Revelation 19:16)
There can't be two different persons claiming this title.

God is the First (the origin) and the Last (the goal) (Isaiah 44:6)=Jesus is the First (the origin) and the Last (the goal) (Revelation 1:17)
There cannot be two different persons claiming this title.

God is the husband (Isaiah 54:5)=Jesus is the husband (2 Corinthians 11:2)
Two different persons cannot marry the same woman.

God is the only Saviour(Isaiah 43:11)=Jesus is the Saviour(Luke 2:11)
God is the only rock (Isaiah 44:8; Psalm 18:31)=Jesus is the rock(1 Corinthians 10:4)
God will be the pierced(Zechariah 12:10)=Jesus is the pierced(crucifixion)
For God the way is prepared (Isaiah 40:3)=For Jesus the way is prepared (Mark 1:3 ; Matthew 3:3)
Jesus and YHUH are God (Psalm 45:7-8) =Jesus and YHUH are God (Hebrews 1:8-9)
God created the world (Genesis 1:1)=All things were created by Jesus, through Jesus and for Jesus(Romans 11:36) (Colossians 1:16-17)
Jesus is God and the father (Isaiah 9:6)
Jesus is the true God (Romans 9:5) (1 John 5:20)
Thomas calls Jesus God (John 20:28)
Jesus is the image of the invisible God (Colossians 1:15)
God became flesh (human) and Jesus is this flesh (John 1:1+14) (1 Timothy 3:16)
Who has seen Jesus, has seen God (John 14:9)
Whoever believes in Jesus believes in God (John 12:44)

Now that you mention it, as if it means Jesus is God a trinity, how come do you think Jesus did not say he was one with the Father and the holy spirit? Jesus could have said to make it clearer that he was one with the Father and the holy spirit. But he didn't. Now that would make a bit of a difference if God is a trinity of Jesus, the Father and the holy spirit persons. But Jesus didn't say he was one with the Father AND the holy spirit. He said he was one with the FATHER. Not the Father and the holy spirit persons. Wonder why that is.

 

[YoursTrue]

I believe it is Himself.

So Jesus prayed to himself and told himself that he is greater than he is when he said the Father is "greater than I am." Is that what you believe?
John 14:28 - "Remember what I told you: I am going away, but I will come back to you again. If you really loved me, you would be happy that I am going to the Father, who is greater than I am." Is it any problem that the world is so mixed up?

 

[rational experiences]

It is approximately equal to 3.14159.

A male says God is 10. Says 10.33. Says his maths belongs to pi O.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning You for any good work ...
https://www.biblehub.com/john/10-33.htm

10 says the male 0 God and one (1) is also God.

I claim God the stone owns magnetism, and 1 he also says is (I), but gives (I) the value of 9 in his Numbers.

First you understand a human is I, the self and one body/consciousness thinking.

And he is not thinking about relativity for life, he is contemplating science.

What science lied about. He never contemplated science for life, he contemplated science as ANTI life. For God is not the Number 1, or the Number 0 or the Number 10.

It is only relative to his thinking for a cause.

So as soon as he thinks relative instead of Number 10, Number 9 or minus one is proposed as being relative. Straight away he is consciously told, you are trying to destroy your idea of God being relative as 10.

Told himself therefore what you claim you are doing, you falsified information to your own self, and your head told you so.

For John is head of the Order of his wisdom.

Matthew 14:10 10and had John beheaded in the prison.

Straight away he is advised consciously and spiritually that if you follow this belief you will change your thinking advice of God 10 is Holy, as a thinker.

For what males overlook today, you preach to your own conscious awareness of a living human male, for and on behalf of trying to stop self from believing in destruction.

Therefore in natural life it became brother science self as one self to argue against brother self the other science self, for you consciously and spiriutally would not first listen to your own natural advice that told you would change God and force it to fall out of the Heavenly o face in natural light.

The self idealised relativity of science in its owned preaching telling self if you practice occultism, science conversion GOD in first relative review will get changed.

So science was always higher advised first in natural thinking, then ignored self and self got attacked...as simple an explanation as is real. For WANT supersedes self advice.

 

[Muffled]

Ah, thanks, and if I may, I will give myself a wet-noodle lashing
for being rude.

I believe Christians are used to forgiving even incidental things.

 

[Muffled]

Those words are the most pure honey to me.

I thank you for such a blessing.

Regards Tony

I believe I like to sweep away the cobwebs when I can so you are quite welcome.

I believe however the question is not whether it is beneficial or not to enjoy the writings of a religious philosopher but whether in viewing him as a messenger yo buy into his misunderstandings as though they were true and from God.

I believe the question of need is whether adhering to a philosopher blocks one from receiving Jesus as Lord and Savior which is necessary to receive eternal life.

 

[Muffled]

So Jesus prayed to himself and told himself that he is greater than he is when he said the Father is "greater than I am." Is that what you believe?
John 14:28 - "Remember what I told you: I am going away, but I will come back to you again. If you really loved me, you would be happy that I am going to the Father, who is greater than I am." Is it any problem that the world is so mixed up?

I believe you should consider the source of your confusion. The problem is that you don't understand what God is.

I believe Jesus prayed to the Father. I don't believe Jesus is the Father but I do believe that Jesus and the Father are God and one. I believe The father is that which is outside the body and that is everywhere but Jesus is God inside a body and quite limited in area. So if God is in New York He is less than God who is everywhere but God is still one everywhere. You can't say there is a separate god in NY.

 

[YoursTrue]

I believe you should consider the source of your confusion. The problem is that you don't understand what God is.

I believe Jesus prayed to the Father. I don't believe Jesus is the Father but I do believe that Jesus and the Father are God and one. I believe The father is that which is outside the body and that is everywhere but Jesus is God inside a body and quite limited in area. So if God is in New York He is less than God who is everywhere but God is still one everywhere. You can't say there is a separate god in NY.

Here's what I do understand, Muffled. Jesus is the Son of God. Jesus is not equal to his Father, and he is not "co-equal" to what is said to be another person of this triune combination.

 

[YoursTrue]

I believe you should consider the source of your confusion. The problem is that you don't understand what God is.

I believe Jesus prayed to the Father. I don't believe Jesus is the Father but I do believe that Jesus and the Father are God and one. I believe The father is that which is outside the body and that is everywhere but Jesus is God inside a body and quite limited in area. So if God is in New York He is less than God who is everywhere but God is still one everywhere. You can't say there is a separate god in NY.

So let me try to understand what you just said. Jesus is God equal to God his father, is that what you just said, in essence? But he is trapped in a fleshly body and is limited, but he does not pray to himself because he's God trapped in flesh. Do I have this right so far?

 

[YoursTrue]

I believe you should consider the source of your confusion. The problem is that you don't understand what God is.

I believe Jesus prayed to the Father. I don't believe Jesus is the Father but I do believe that Jesus and the Father are God and one. I believe The father is that which is outside the body and that is everywhere but Jesus is God inside a body and quite limited in area. So if God is in New York He is less than God who is everywhere but God is still one everywhere. You can't say there is a separate god in NY.

I understand what God is. What I don't understand is how there are three persons each God and equal to the other persons then said to be one being. The scriptures tell me what and who God is. He is the Almighty, the Creator, the Most High. Why would Jesus, as Godintheflesh, look heavenward, and pray to one of his equals (the Father) if he was equal to the other two persons and the three were really one being? Because he was trapped in the flesh?

 

[TrueBeliever37]

If Jesus is THE GOD then who is THE GOD whom he calls "MY GOD"?

The Father (the one and only God) is an eternal Spirit. He didn't have blood to shed for the sins of mankind. So the Father took on a fleshly body to be able to shed blood for mankind. He called that body his Son. After all he was the Father of that body. The Son was the fleshly body, while the Father was the eternal Spirit dwelling in that body.

So the answer to your question is that the Son (the fleshly body) was calling the eternal Spirit his God. That flesh wasn't God or it couldn't die. But the Spirit dwelling in that body was God. But he was still God manifest (or made known) in the flesh.

The distinction between the Father and the Son - is flesh versus Spirit. Not that there are two different persons.

 

[YoursTrue]

The Father (the one and only God) is an eternal Spirit. He didn't have blood to shed for the sins of mankind. So the Father took on a fleshly body to be able to shed blood for mankind. He called that body his Son. After all he was the Father of that body. The Son was the fleshly body, while the Father was the eternal Spirit dwelling in that body.

So the answer to your question is that the Son (the fleshly body) was calling the eternal Spirit his God. That flesh wasn't God or it couldn't die. But the Spirit dwelling in that body was God. But he was still God manifest (or made known) in the flesh.

The distinction between the Father and the Son - is flesh versus Spirit. Not that there are two different persons.

So when the Son calls the Father his God, he meant the eternal spirit in himself is his God? So he was kind of talking to himself, calling his spirit in his flesh his God???

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Hi @Hockeycowboy

I apologize that I missed @tigger2 s point about "the wording and meaning of Jesus’ statement at John 8:58" can you point me to the post or his blog for this discussion.
Thanks so much.

Clear
.

I am so sorry, clear, for missing this!
Here is his blog:
Examining the Trinity
Enjoy searching!

 

[TrueBeliever37]

So when the Son calls the Father his God, he meant the eternal spirit in himself is his God? So he was kind of talking to himself, calling his spirit in his flesh his God???

The scripture says that YHWH is the God of all flesh. So that would have to include that flesh. Of course God's Spirit fills the heavens and the earth. But the fullness of deity was dwelling in that body. Colossians 2:9

It makes a lot more sense than Trinitarians saying 1 God + 1 God + 1 God = 1 God
Is it that difficult to believe the flesh would cry out to the Spirit for strength?

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Almost every version of John 10:33 that I’ve checked, says “God”...that the Jews were saying that Jesus was implying that he was God.

Is this accurate? (It certainly fits with mainstream teachings of Christendom.)

Well, there is a very easy way to determine what was actually said and meant.

All four Gospel accounts record the “raking over the coals” Jesus received from the High Priest and the other religious leaders, they were even looking to find false witnesses against him, so great was their hatred!

Yet, never once did anyone accuse Jesus of implying he was God, which they certainly would have done if those Jews had accused him of such!!

It’s obvious that the verse should read, “a god”, which was the argument Jesus proceeded with, at John 10:34.

It’s just another verse where Greek grammar’s lack of the indefinite article is used to promote faulty theology.

Ok, so what are you going to do with other verses such as John 20:28 where Thomas said he was his God?

Notice the Greek wording - Answered Thomas and said to him: "the kurios" of me and "the God" of me. The definite article is sure there in this verse.

Just a side note: "kurios" is a Greek word they substituted for the name of God (YHWH)

Also are you going to try to say that a verse such as John 1:6 should read - There was a man sent from a God, whose name was John?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Ok, so what are you going to do with other verses such as John 20:28 where Thomas said he was his God?

Notice the Greek wording - Answered Thomas and said to him: "the kurios" of me and "the God" of me. The definite article is sure there in this verse.

Hey @TrueBeliever37 , hope you are well.

Don’t have much time to go into this, but please read the context, including John 20:17.

And furthermore, ask yourself, what was Thomas expressing disbelief in prior to Jesus’ appearance? Thomas had seen other resurrrections....if, before Jesus’ death, Thomas thought Jesus was really God, why would he express disbelief that He would be resurrected?

More info:
The Trinity Delusion: John 20:28