Even a moral person will go to Hell.

[Booko]

Again, I think you are making the same mistake as Doppelganger. I am not here to tell you that the idea of picking Morgoth or Valar is nonsensical. I am saying that picking hell over heaven is nonsensical.

I"m saying that from an atheist's pov, the very idea of picking something imaginary is nonsensical.

(by the way, I'm not an atheist, though I was for many years)

 

[Booko]

I do not think being with God would give me eternal happiness though. Could you be happy if you were forced to live with someone you hate?

I think the theory is that when it comes to God "to know Him is to love Him" and if so the problem would be nullified.

 

[Booko]

When people dont like truth, they create myths, they twist the original, and create new scripture to fulfill their ideas of what something should really be like.

Yes, this is too often the case.

 

[Booko]

C.S. Lewis was an author and writer, not a theologian or a minister, but simply a writer.

Yes, just like St. Paul was an author and a writer. At least I presume that's all he was, since he didn't have any degrees from any seminaries or anything like that...

His methods of writing were for entertainment.

I take it you've not read "Mere Christianity"? I highly recommend it. I would've considered it "apologetics" more than "entertainment" but give it a read and let me know what you think of it.

 

[Booko]

And now we could just as easily say that people with only one book have a tendency to look for everything in it, whether it's there or not. I applaud your filling in of gaps, but much of this is non-scriptural. For one thing, it says in Revelations that Death and Hell will be cast into the Lake of Fire. It says nothing about whether people will still be in it.

There is also not a guideline in that book that details what should interpreted literally and what should be interpreted metaphorically. Let him who has ears, hear.

Clearly not everything prophetic is to be fulfilled literally. Were it so, John the Baptist would've been named "Elias."

 

[Booko]

You are allowed to interpret. But what i dont like is any extra-biblical teaching which IS NEVER TAUGHT BY ANY JEW OR CHRISTIAN, and never appears in the Bible ANYWHERE, to be presented as the true Christian doctrine.

The entire notion of eternal torment is so laughably un-Jewish I can't even explain further at the moment. Sorry.

 

[Quiddity]

The entire notion of eternal torment is so laughably un-Jewish I can't even explain further at the moment. Sorry.

I think one could argue you could find it in it's infancy. You can certainly see it with words like sheol and ge-hin-nom being used. Whether it was eternal or not is probably a more latter development, but I have no doubt you could find it in Diaspora Jews, but probably not with Palestinian Jews with Christianity flourished.

 

[longshanks]

In what way could spreading atheism improve our world? Religion, by and large, improves the character of humanity.

There was a suicide bomber up the road from where live trying to destroy as many lives he could just the other day in scotland.
He was doing this in the name of god.
Atheism is about respect for life because life is all a person has.
The religions of the world have the blood of millions upon million on its hands.
And the misery of billions.
Atheism would improve the world in any one of a thousand ways but for starters
if atheism was predominant ten years ago say, maybe the twin towers would still be standing.
If atheism was predominant a thousand years ago and scientist and thinkers were able to work as they wanted without fear of bishops and cardinals we could well more advanced than we are.
What percentage of battles have been fought in the name of a god or religion in the last 1000 years.
Religion and the notion of god has been nothing but the purest of poisons to mankind.
You tell me in the context of this world (dont mention souls and there destination its irrelevant to an atheist) what harm Atheism has ever done.

 

[lillitruthseeker]

You tell me in the context of this world (dont mention souls and there destination its irrelevant to an atheist) what harm Atheism has ever done.

i have to agree with you there -- human decency preceded the bible

 

[Mister_T]

That is absolutely what the Bible says. Every time an atheist says something like "I would gladly go to hell than spend eternity with God" I can't help but bust into a raging fit of laughter. Who are you kidding? Do you really believe that? There's no way anyone would willingly choose hell no matter what the alternative was. To say that shows a great lack of comprehension for eternity and the torture you will face in hell, not to mention a twisted view of God and heaven.

Many people say that because they'd prefer the company in Hell....you know.....Ghandi, The Dalai Lama, Mother Teresa.

As oppose to the company they'd be with in Heaven.....Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, James Dobson.


It makes a person wonder who Jesus was really talking about when he said "You shall know by their fruits."

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Many people say that because they'd prefer the company in Hell....you know.....Ghandi, The Dhali Llama, Mother Teresa.

As oppose to the company they'd be with in Heaven.....Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, James Dobson.


It makes a person wonder who Jesus was really talking about when he said "You shall know by their fruits."

Whoa, wait a minute.....the Dalai Lama isn't in hell yet.

But at least we can see that he's quickly on the path to hell - you know, with his message and example of kindness, compassion, and charity to all others.




Peace,
Mystic

 

[kmkemp]

There was a suicide bomber up the road from where live trying to destroy as many lives he could just the other day in scotland.
He was doing this in the name of god.
Atheism is about respect for life because life is all a person has.
The religions of the world have the blood of millions upon million on its hands.
And the misery of billions.
Atheism would improve the world in any one of a thousand ways but for starters
if atheism was predominant ten years ago say, maybe the twin towers would still be standing.
If atheism was predominant a thousand years ago and scientist and thinkers were able to work as they wanted without fear of bishops and cardinals we could well more advanced than we are.
What percentage of battles have been fought in the name of a god or religion in the last 1000 years.
Religion and the notion of god has been nothing but the purest of poisons to mankind.
You tell me in the context of this world (dont mention souls and there destination its irrelevant to an atheist) what harm Atheism has ever done.

Again, religion doesn't have any blood on its hands. Those were purely independant acts by religious fanatics. If religion didn't exist, it would not prevent fanaticism.

 

[longshanks]

Again, religion doesn't have any blood on its hands. Those were purely independant acts by religious fanatics. If religion didn't exist, it would not prevent fanaticism.

Those fanatics minds were poisoned by religion, and as you didnt answer the question about what harm atheism has ever done i trust you couldnt think of anything.
Its all pointless anyway, religion in the west is in decline anyway modern man is waking up to its irrelivance, atheism is the future whether that be good or bad.
Science is steadily obliterating everything religion claims.
I may be an atheist but if i have a second religion its science.
The bible itself is slowly being exposed as a load of old cobblers.
jesus mohammed and the rest were simply either diluded or con merchants.
Many people died a wako for there religious leader has there deaths been worth it no sir.
Thousands died for the god kings of egypt and japan uneducated fools, lambs to the slaughter.
I dont know who it was who invented the idea of a god to start with but i think rather than blaming religion for tragedy i would have to blame him.
Im just glad i live in an era when we are slowly coming to terms with the fact that this world and this life is all we have and we had better make the most of the time we have.
A prayer plus a hungry child equals a hungry child.:yes:

 

[kmkemp]

Those fanatics minds were poisoned by religion, and as you didnt answer the question about what harm atheism has ever done i trust you couldnt think of anything.
Its all pointless anyway, religion in the west is in decline anyway modern man is waking up to its irrelivance, atheism is the future whether that be good or bad.
Science is steadily obliterating everything religion claims.
I may be an atheist but if i have a second religion its science.
The bible itself is slowly being exposed as a load of old cobblers.
jesus mohammed and the rest were simply either diluded or con merchants.
Many people died a wako for there religious leader has there deaths been worth it no sir.
Thousands died for the god kings of egypt and japan uneducated fools, lambs to the slaughter.
I dont know who it was who invented the idea of a god to start with but i think rather than blaming religion for tragedy i would have to blame him.
Im just glad i live in an era when we are slowly coming to terms with the fact that this world and this life is all we have and we had better make the most of the time we have.
A prayer plus a hungry child equals a hungry child.:yes:

Looks like you got it all figured out.

 

[Darkness]

I do not believe that everyone that goes away into everlasting punishment will burn (in hell). I guess you and I agree on that. However, they will endure an eternal punishment in hell. And after time has passed everyone in hell will be tossed into the Lake of fire, where everyone will burn in everlasting flames.

Wow! Your God is like a super-Hitler with Saddam on top. Glory be the Lord. :sarcastic

 

[ChristineES]

How on earth can anyone say they know who is going to Hell? God knows many things that we do not know and will never know. If you believe in God, then you must believe that He created the whole universe, and nothing is ever greater than it's creator. A lot of people you would never dream of may be in heaven now or later (depending on whether we go straight there or if we don't go until after the resurrection. ) On top of that, we don't even know what heaven is even like. We can only judge it by our own experiences.

 

[Sunstone]

Religion, by and large, improves the character of humanity.

It seems pretty well established that religion is a wash when it comes to improving people. Religion is a facilitator. In some it facilitates good. In others it facilitates evil.

 

[kmkemp]

I don't see how that is the case. Just in my own example (and there are certainly millions like me), there are many things I want to do and restrain myself from because of my faith. Other religions like Islam teach similar principles. Without Christianity, there is no doubt that I would lead a completely different lifestyle. I don't see one case in which Christianity could bring out the bad in someone unless the bad was already going to come out irregardless of it.

 

[Nanda]

Just in my own example (and there are certainly millions like me), there are many things I want to do and restrain myself from because of my faith. Other religions like Islam teach similar principles. Without Christianity, there is no doubt that I would lead a completely different lifestyle.

You can't be good for the sake of those around you, you have to be strong-armed into behaving because of the fear of eternal damnation? That's frightening.

 

[Sunstone]

Without Christianity, there is no doubt that I would lead a completely different lifestyle.

Would you really?

I don't see one case in which Christianity could bring out the bad in someone unless the bad was already going to come out irregardless of it.

Christianity can certainly facilitate evil. Even a quick reading of the history of Christianity shows that. Just as even a quick reading of the history of Christianity shows that Christianity can facilitate good.