We still said "under God" when reciting it when I was in school in the 2000s.I think for me it was the 2nd or 3rd grade they removed the word God from the pledge of allegiance.
No doubt the start of the down-fall of America.
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European Theists
- Thread starter Rival
- Start date
I was in California so I suppose we're more progressive...
Would have been around '67
I might move this thread elsewhere, we'll see.
To those theists in Europe, how do you feel with the overwhelming unbelief in this sphere? Christianity as default is gone, especially in places like GB, Czech Republic, France, etc. belief is nominally dead. How do you deal with this in your lives, how do you talk to the unbelievers you encounter and does it ever frustrate you?
It is definitely true. It's hard sometimes to know that I'm surrounded by so many people who don't share my beliefs, but I understand why it's happening. When I talk about my beliefs I'll tell them what and why, most of the times they tell me why they're not believers and life goes on. I can't make them agree with me and they can't make me agree with them. They live with their beliefs and I live with mine. It can be frustrating, but I accept and respect their point of view.
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
There is no need to think like that, please. The Second Coming 1835-1908 had just in time, even much before the time that Atheism kind of movement got started, tackled the oncoming problem by writing his famous reason oriented book Barahin-e-Ahmadiyya* ( of five volumes) in this connection, please. Get equipped with those reasonable arguments, common for every kind of believers in G-d of whatever religion of Monotheism one belongs to , and the issue will be resolved, I am sure as I visualize, please. Right?
Regards
____________________
*Barahin-e-Ahmadiyya Parts I & II
Barahin-e-Ahmadiyya Part III
Barahin-e-Ahmadiyya Part IV
Barahin-e-Ahmadiyya Part V
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
To some extent yes...and to some, no.
It appears to have always been thus.
Always take solace in the fact that some things have improved.
Exempli gratia....
Gay couples now endure the burden of marriage
rather than the horror of persecution & prison.
Alien826
No religious beliefs
I was a teenager in 1950's England. Back then, though most people would have answered "yes" to "do you believe in God", or thoughtlessly slapped "C of E" (Church of England) under "religion" on a form, I doubt many gave it much thought from one day to the next. Add to this that there was an established Church that still had a lot of power over people's lives. Sometimes it paid to profess Christianity, say when applying for a job. Over the years the cultural pressure to at least pay lip service to Christianity relaxed and people became more willing to admit they had no faith.
This may not be a bad thing from a believer's point of view. What remains is people who have actually chosen to be members of a church, attend regularly, and and so on.
This may not be a bad thing from a believer's point of view. What remains is people who have actually chosen to be members of a church, attend regularly, and and so on.
syo
Well-Known Member
Five Solas
Active Member
I might move this thread elsewhere, we'll see.
To those theists in Europe, how do you feel with the overwhelming unbelief in this sphere? Christianity as default is gone, especially in places like GB, Czech Republic, France, etc. belief is nominally dead. How do you deal with this in your lives, how do you talk to the unbelievers you encounter and does it ever frustrate you?
My contention is that the Christian faith is not in decline at all meaning the number of true believers had always been relatively small. I believe the true state of affairs is becoming clearer, i.e. people are more honest about what they believe and many do not pretend to be Christians anymore. So, cultural Christianity is disappearing which is a good thing. The influence of Christianity in the wider public sphere is declining.
I blame theological liberalism for this. The difference between a liberal ‘Christian’ and an atheist is paper-thin.
As a devout believer, I am sad but not worried.
In Luke 13:23 Jesus faced the question: “Lord, are there few who are saved?” But he doesn’t answer it.
In Matthew 7:14 He says, “Narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and few there be who find it.” Jesus stressed that many of his contemporaries will be “thrust out” (v. 28).
However, Jesus’s also said that “Many are called, but few are chosen” (Matt. 22:14).
The Bible teaches that not all people are saved. Instead, the saved are a remnant (Rom. 9:27). That had been the case through the entire human history – only a remnant believes. Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to confirm your calling and election, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall. For in this way there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. ~2 Peter 1:10-11
Five Solas
Active Member
Really?
I might move this thread elsewhere, we'll see.
To those theists in Europe, how do you feel with the overwhelming unbelief in this sphere? Christianity as default is gone, especially in places like GB, Czech Republic, France, etc. belief is nominally dead. How do you deal with this in your lives, how do you talk to the unbelievers you encounter and does it ever frustrate you?
Waning Christianity is a relief to many who want truth.
1. Truth about Global Warming.
2. Truth about military intel that prompted us to declare war against peaceful nations. [Now the Cancel Culture wants us to hush up about that].
3. Truth about the age of the earth (though time is relative, so God's time isn't our time).
4. Truth about the existence of God (proven or not).
5. Truth about evolution.
Living the lies, and blissfully not seeking the truth, and hushing up others who seek truth, is fine with most Christians.
Look at the mess that the world is in today.
I can hardly wait to get to heaven, so I can say "I told you so."
The original version was "one nation, indivisible"...but I think that Eisenhower changed it to "one nation, under God, indivisible."
Five Solas
Active Member
If you think science is the truth you have a substantial misunderstanding of what science is. From your biased misunderstanding of what the truth is or where it count be found I get the impression you are a typical product of the modern secular society.
It is an undeniable fact that we live in a post-truth society. Most modern people in the West will not even recognise the truth when they see it. People believe what they are told to believe. Secular indoctrination is rife. All information being fed to us is filtered and biased. Even modern science is not objective which became clear from all the heavily biased misinformation we were fed by so-called scientists during the Covid fiasco .
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
paarsurrey said: ↑
moved people away from the truthful path of Jesus to Hellenism.
"he (Paul) was, if any of the Epistles that bear his name are really his, entirely a Hellenist in thought and sentiment. As such he was imbued with the notion that "the whole creation groaneth" for liberation from "the prison-house of the body," from this earthly existence, which, because of its pollution by sin and death, is intrinsically evil (Gal. i. 4; Rom. v. 12, vii. 23-24, viii. 22; I Cor. vii. 31; II Cor. v. 2, 4; comp. Philo, "De Allegoriis Legum," iii. 75; idem, "De Vita Mosis," iii. 17; idem, "De Ebrietate," § 26; and Wisdom ii.24). As a Hellenist, also, he distinguished between an earthly and a heavenly Adam (I Cor. xv. 45-49; comp. Philo, "De Allegoriis Legum," i. 12), and, accordingly, between the lower psychic. life and the higher spiritual life attained only by asceticism (Rom. xii. 1; I Cor. vii. 1-31, ix. 27, xv. 50; comp. Philo, "De Profugis," § 17; and elsewhere). His whole state of mind shows the influence of the theosophic or Gnostic lore of Alexandria, especially the Hermes literature recently brought to light by Reizenstein in his important work "Poimandres," 1904 (see Index, s. v. "Paulus," "Briefe des Paulus," and "Philo"); hence his strange belief in supernatural powers (Reizenstein, l.c. pp. 77, 287), in fatalism, in "speaking in tongues" (I Cor. xii.-xiv.; comp. Reizenstein, l.c. p. 58; Dieterich, "Abraxas," pp. 5 et seq.; Weinel, "Die Wirkungen des Geistes und der Geister," 1899, pp. 72 et seq.; I Cor. xv. 8; II Cor. xii. 1-6; Eph. iii. 3), and in mysteries or sacraments (Rom. xvi. 25; Col. i. 26, ii. 2, iv. 3; Eph. i. 9, iii. 4, vi. 19)—a term borrowed solely from heathen rites."
SAUL OF TARSUS - JewishEncyclopedia.com
Right?
Regards
___________
*“Take heed that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.
Matthew 24:4-5
moved people away from the truthful path of Jesus to Hellenism.
And this had happened despite clear warning* from Jesus of false claimants "in Jesus' name". This is what Hellenist-Paul did exactly:
"he (Paul) was, if any of the Epistles that bear his name are really his, entirely a Hellenist in thought and sentiment. As such he was imbued with the notion that "the whole creation groaneth" for liberation from "the prison-house of the body," from this earthly existence, which, because of its pollution by sin and death, is intrinsically evil (Gal. i. 4; Rom. v. 12, vii. 23-24, viii. 22; I Cor. vii. 31; II Cor. v. 2, 4; comp. Philo, "De Allegoriis Legum," iii. 75; idem, "De Vita Mosis," iii. 17; idem, "De Ebrietate," § 26; and Wisdom ii.24). As a Hellenist, also, he distinguished between an earthly and a heavenly Adam (I Cor. xv. 45-49; comp. Philo, "De Allegoriis Legum," i. 12), and, accordingly, between the lower psychic. life and the higher spiritual life attained only by asceticism (Rom. xii. 1; I Cor. vii. 1-31, ix. 27, xv. 50; comp. Philo, "De Profugis," § 17; and elsewhere). His whole state of mind shows the influence of the theosophic or Gnostic lore of Alexandria, especially the Hermes literature recently brought to light by Reizenstein in his important work "Poimandres," 1904 (see Index, s. v. "Paulus," "Briefe des Paulus," and "Philo"); hence his strange belief in supernatural powers (Reizenstein, l.c. pp. 77, 287), in fatalism, in "speaking in tongues" (I Cor. xii.-xiv.; comp. Reizenstein, l.c. p. 58; Dieterich, "Abraxas," pp. 5 et seq.; Weinel, "Die Wirkungen des Geistes und der Geister," 1899, pp. 72 et seq.; I Cor. xv. 8; II Cor. xii. 1-6; Eph. iii. 3), and in mysteries or sacraments (Rom. xvi. 25; Col. i. 26, ii. 2, iv. 3; Eph. i. 9, iii. 4, vi. 19)—a term borrowed solely from heathen rites."
SAUL OF TARSUS - JewishEncyclopedia.com
Right?
Regards
___________
*“Take heed that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.
Matthew 24:4-5
Joshua Pryce
Member
These are known by different sources as christian and catholic countries. Appearances can be deceiving. We must challenge deceit learn off each other, and come to a resolution which helps the greater good. In God not in atheism and rubbish beliefs.
Which "God"?
The one who urges murdering abortion clinic staff,
who praises invading Ukraine, who cleans out
bank accounts of believers, who executes infidels,
who.....you know this list goes on.
Good is about what one does,
not which god one obeys.
So you have thought up your beliefs all by yourself?