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Environmentalism, Anti-Immigrantism, White Supremacism, & Terrorism....A Connection?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Revoltingest, Aug 19, 2019.

  1. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    Interesting thing in the news...
    Two mass murders a world apart share a common theme: 'ecofascism'
    Excerpted....
    Before the slaughter of dozens of people in Christchurch, New Zealand and El Paso, Texas this year, the accused gunmen took pains to explain their fury, including their hatred of immigrants. The statements that authorities think the men posted online share another obsession: overpopulation and environmental degradation.

    The alleged Christchurch shooter, who is charged with targeting Muslims and killing 51 people in March, declared himself an "eco-fascist" and railed about immigrants' birthrates. The statement linked to the El Paso shooter, who is charged with killing 22 people in a shopping area earlier this month, bemoans water pollution, plastic waste and an American consumer culture that is "creating a massive burden for future generations."

    The two mass shootings appear to be extreme examples of ecofascism - what Hampshire College professor emeriti Betsy Hartmann calls "the greening of hate."

    Many white supremacists have latched onto environmental themes, drawing connections between the protection of nature and racial exclusion. These ideas have shown themselves to be particularly dangerous when adopted by unstable individuals prone to violence and convinced they must take drastic actions to stave off catastrophe.
     
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  2. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    Yes, forms of environmentalism are big parts of Nazism as they were obsessed with "purity", including that of natural settings.

    More than that, though, I've noticed that many of these shooters are just straight up nihilists and misanthropes, which aren't features of actual National Socialism. NS may be genocidal and hateful, but it certainly doesn't hate all of humanity and want wanton destruction. Hitler was a civilized person, albeit a monster. These people are on something else. A lot of misanthropes try to veil their hatred of humanity in environmentalist concerns.
     
  3. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Call it Environmentalism, Anti-Immigrantism, White Supremacism, Eco- Fascism or whatever ... racism-thats-a-human-problem-16389820.png

     
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  4. Labourwave

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    They lie about Jews, POC and Anti-fascists, why wouldn't they lie about wanting and being able to save the environment too?

    There is no link between environmentalism and bigotry. Just a case where bigots happen to be concerned about the environment as a side dish.

    A link between anti-immigration and white supremacy? Now you're onto something.
     
  5. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    There are unsavoury or crazy individuals who latch
    onto things.

    Look at our pyramid-weird math- left-right-"god"-
    etc etc people.

    There is, I think, a very legitimate consideration for
    overcrowding / strain on resources.

    A million new Americans end up as being far more
    destructive than, say, that many more in less demanding
    life style.

    It is a bit late for China to have a population density
    that goes well with environmental concerns, but the
    USA, compared to much / most of the world still has
    a lot of open natural spaces and a low population density.

    It seems a pity to try to fill it up as fast as possible-
    plus, and then what?

    Anyway, yeah, a lot of idiots have gotten into
    "ecology" and dont even know what it is, but
    that hardly makes it woo woo, or something only
    of interest or real importance to like terrs or
    etc.
     
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  6. Erebus

    Erebus Well-Known Member

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    This isn't all that surprising to be honest. Bigotry and extremism often goes hand in hand with genuine concerns. From what I've seen, this tends to work in two ways:

    1. Real problems are used to legitimise reprehensible behaviour. Killing people in the name of saving the world seems less heinous than killing people because of their skin colour. This has been a very popular tactic through the ages since it can influence the perceptions of people who might not otherwise share the particular brand of bigotry being espoused.

    2. A scapegoat makes real problems easier to deal with. Overpopulation is an interesting case here since I've personally seen people say something to the effect of, "It's not us who need to change, it's the [insert nationality/ethnic group] who need to stop having children." That's a dangerous line of thinking but also an attractive one since it shifts all responsibility onto others. Rather than a nebulous threat that often has no easy solution, you have a human enemy who bears all responsibility.

    This is based on personal observation so don't take it as gospel. That said, declaring "[insert group] are ruining the world!" is hardly a new phenomenon.
     
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  7. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    Oh? Tell me a lie about antifa. And something good about
    them.

    I doubt enough people are anti (all) immigration for you
    to be onto anything.

    I am not white, and I am an immigrant. I came legally.
    (and didnt even want to)

    I am far from a white supremacy sort, but I am against
    unlimited / unregulated / etc immigration.

    ONE little detail in there, for example, is that we have
    thousands of family members, and various others who
    legally qualify for entrance, who wait years to finally get
    a visa.

    Meanwhile, at the southern border-

    Is anyone unaware that US immigration law and
    policy is insane, unjust and inhumane?

    It isnt just "pro" and "anti" immigration.
     
  8. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    That they're a terrorist group who are more of a threat than white supremacists.
    Um, that they're anti-fascist and anti-racist, standing at the front line against KKK, neo-Nazis and so on? Most people would see those as positives, unless they themselves support those things.
     
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  9. Altfish

    Altfish Well-Known Member

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    If you have issues with the environment why would you attack a mosque unless you had other more prominent issues too.
     
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  10. Labourwave

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    If you don't consider yourself anti-immigrant then my post didn't make any reference to your views. Don't know why you assumed I was talking about your views when I said "anti-immigrant" (the term y'know, that was being used in the OP).
     
  11. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    If you dont consider defending your claim about antifa
    worth defending, why make it?

    ALSO, as I said, I dont think anyone but the barest
    few would be against all immigration.

    It isnt just "pro" and "anti" immigration.

    A link between anti-immigration and white supremacy? Now you're onto something.

    In the sense that there is a link between being human
    and being anti immigration, sure.

    Are you for 100% open free immigration, come one,
    come all?

    Coz if not...?
     
  12. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    Aye, this obsession with getting millions of immigrants,
    both legal & illegal is ridiculous. We don't need more
    people, despite claims that we're better off economically.
    (We're really not.)
    I'm also reminded of The Unabomber, another eco-terrorist.
     
  13. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    We're not talking about the sharpest tools in the shed here.
    But yes, there's more than 1 dysfunctional attitude at work.
     
  14. Labourwave

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    There is a plethora of lies about antifa out there.

    If you want one from just the last couple of days.

    Prominent misinformation "journalist" Andy Ngo tweeted that "Antifa attacked people on a bus. They try to pull them out and hit them with a hammer."
    This myth was spread wide and far by Ngo's far right fanbase.

    However, looking at the actual evidence of the rally, we get a completely different story.

    The Bus was being used by a group called "The American Guard" a far-right paramilitary group. The members of the paramilitary pulled an antifascist into the bus and then assaulted the member with a hammer. Other anti-fascists then pulled the assaulted person out of the bus, and tried to wrestle the weapon away from the fascists. All photo evidence corroborates this.

    But, Andy Ngo does what far-right reporters do. They turn fascist violence into bad publicity for the left rather than honestly reporting on his buddies terrorist actions.
     

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  15. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    Accuracy is the first casualty when tempers flare.
     
  16. Labourwave

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    Relevant:
    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Greased up & ready for action!
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    I don't buy that cartoon.
    Black on black violence gets the least attention.
    White on black is what makes the news.

    Now, before anyone gets angry, let me offer this
    olive branch...
    Failure to cover black on black violence can be
    viewed as white racism, ie, that it doesn't matter.
     
  18. Labourwave

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    Are you trying to dispute that offenders in OP were anti-immigration and white-supremacists? It's not a huge leap to say these things go together.

    When I am using these labels, I am accepting the usage as used in the OP. If you don't like their usage in this thread, why are you zeroing in on my post?
     
    #18 Labourwave, Aug 19, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2019
  19. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    That cartoon had nothing to do with race. Weird how you immediately jump to that.
     
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  20. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    What ( in your opinion ) would be some good actions to take and changes to make?
     
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