Emulation.

[BucephalusBB]

This world does not exist, you do not exist, air does not exist, love does not exist..
All that exist is this emulation of this world, my thought.
When you speak to me and tell me you do exist, that is only my thought speaking. There is only one soul. mine. It's as if there is only one dream that exists, and it dies with my death.

This entire story applies to you as well..

This is not what I believe, but it is a view on this world.
I wondered, is there a religion about this view?

 

[eudaimonia]

Solipsism comes closest, but I don't know of any solipsistic religions.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[ikitikitembo]

I doesn't seem to me like there would be a religion based on this. Certainly a worldview or belief system, but religion assumes a creator, and how can you believe in a creator if you don't believe in existence...

 

[mr.guy]

but religion assumes a creator

Wrong.

...how can you believe in a creator if you don't believe in existence.

Some consider this existence "unreal" in contrast to what they expect the "next" reality to be.
When probing the "how" of belief, the answer seems to often come up as "quite easily".

 

[mr.guy]

This entire story applies to you as well...

...IF you were real.

 

[ikitikitembo]

Wrong.

Really? Religion doesn't assume a creator or a spiritual superior? Could you explain?

Some consider this existence "unreal" in contrast to what they expect the "next" reality to be. When probing the "how" of belief, the answer seems to often come up as "quite easily".

Strange. If they consider "this" existence unreal then how can there be a next existence? And how are they even anticipating one?

 

[mr.guy]

Really? Religion doesn't assume a creator or a spiritual superior? Could you explain?

Sure. Religion doesn't assume a creator.

Is you appendice of "spiritual superior" not an acknowledgement of this?

Strange. If they consider "this" existence unreal then how can there be a next existence? And how are they even anticipating one?

I can't speak for the sequence ordained or expected, but there's a buttload of mushy arguments we could explain that one away with. What difficulty have you with the concept of some future incarnation being mystically more real?

 

[ikitikitembo]

Sure. Religion doesn't assume a creator.

Is you appendice of "spiritual superior" not an acknowledgement of this?

Pardon me for not being technical when i first said "creator". I was using it to describe a spiritual superior, or some spiritual being. Surely regligions assume these? If not then in what sense was he referring to religion? Worship? What would they be worshipping? Institutions? What are the institutions for?

But that's not the big picture. How can someone who doesn't believe in existence believe in anything? Existence is all we know...or should i say..."think".

I can't speak for the sequence ordained or expected, but there's a buttload of mushy arguments we could explain that one away with. What difficulty have you with the concept of some future incarnation being mystically more real?

I have a problem with it because if you don't believe that existence (what you're "experiencing") is reality, then how can you possibly believe in something you're not even experiencing? You would have nothing to go by. It's just arbitrary belief. I mean, not having some degree of reason behind a belief to me sounds a little strange. I could see leaving the possibility open...but belief???

 

[BucephalusBB]

...IF you were real.
[/i]

That's not what I mean. What I mean is that the world is not here, only the illusion. There is in that case only one illusion; mine. But I couldn't explain that to you because you feel to be real as well. So in your case it would be only your imagination.

 

[mr.guy]

Pardon me for not being technical when i first said "creator". I was using it to describe a spiritual superior, or some spiritual being. Surely regligions assume these?

Nope. Ontology may be aspected in certain religions, yet not the sum thereof, nor necessarily the presupposition of all established religions. While it may seem attractive, i'm not sure why heirarchy is your root definition of religion.

If not then in what sense was he referring to religion? Worship? What would they be worshipping? Institutions? What are the institutions for?

Am we to understand that the ground floor to religion is a figurehead for worship?

But that's not the big picture. How can someone who doesn't believe in existence believe in anything? Existence is all we know...or should i say..."think".

You've answered your own question. You needn't "know" anything to "believe", or "think" it. One can easily doubt the lucidity of current reality, ergo they may come to suspect something more "real" down the line.

...if you don't believe that existence (what you're "experiencing") is reality, then how can you possibly believe in something you're not even experiencing?

Quite easily.

 

[mr.guy]

What I mean is that the world is not here, only the illusion. There is in that case only one illusion; mine...So in your case it would be only your imagination.

In my case, you would also be imaginary.

 

[BucephalusBB]

In my case, you would also be imaginary.

Exactly what I mean.

 

[ikitikitembo]

Nope. Ontology may be aspected in certain religions, yet not the sum thereof, nor necessarily the presupposition of all established religions. While it may seem attractive, i'm not sure why heirarchy is your root definition of religion.

Am we to understand that the ground floor to religion is a figurehead for worship?

What is religion?

You've answered your own question. You needn't "know" anything to "believe", or "think" it. One can easily doubt the lucidity of current reality, ergo they may come to suspect something more "real" down the line.

Quite easily.

I realize you don't have to know to believe, but it seems to me you would have to at least "think it" or have some sort of reasons for your belief. For instance it's possible that someone has been stalking me trying to kill me right now. But I don't believe anyone is, because I have no reason to. I don't think possibility is enough for belief. And possibility would seem to be the only thing that these people would be going on to believe in a succeeding reality, when they don't even believe in what they're "experiencing" now.

 

[mr.guy]

What is religion?

Loosely, a system of beliefs and practices.

I realize you don't have to know to believe, but it seems to me you would have to at least "think it" or have some sort of reasons for your belief. For instance it's possible that someone has been stalking me trying to kill me right now. But I don't believe anyone is, because I have no reason to. I don't think possibility is enough for belief. And possibility would seem to be the only thing that these people would be going on to believe in a succeeding reality, when they don't even believe in what they're "experiencing" now.

Which is neither here nor there. What grounding one has in "faith" and "truth" need not meet your evaluatory requirements to hold their own definitions. How you actualize and justify belief is beyond it's field.

Do note, i've yet to paint a theist who believes the "next life" to be of more pressing realism in such black and white terms as you present in your conundrum here.

 

[ikitikitembo]

Which is neither here nor there. What grounding one has in "faith" and "truth" need not meet your evaluatory requirements to hold their own definitions. How you actualize and justify belief is beyond it's field.

Do note, i've yet to paint a theist who believes the "next life" to be of more pressing realism in such black and white terms as you present in your conundrum here.

Well truth is totally different. I do agree with you when you say that the grounding for faith or belief is subjective. I guess I just use my common sense when it comes to belief, basing it on some sort of reason, or something that convinces me so. Like you said that doesn't really matter though, because it's just what I think.

Just curious though...what does it take for you personally to come to a belief?

 

[Doktormartini]

Is this kinda along the lines of the belief that the material world is an illusion?

 

[BucephalusBB]

Is this kinda along the lines of the belief that the material world is an illusion?

Yes, but also that feelings is an illusion. Love is an illusion and our dreams is an illusion

 

[Littledragon]

This would seem to lead to a religon based on self deification. If your soul/mind is the only reality and all other things are evolved from your thoughts, then wouldn't you be the creator?

Littledragon

 

[BucephalusBB]

This would seem to lead to a religon based on self deification. If your soul/mind is the only reality and all other things are evolved from your thoughts, then wouldn't you be the creator?

Littledragon

Not persé. If the world doesn't need a creator, why would the thought?

 

[Littledragon]

okay maybe creator is the wrong word, but you still state that these thoughts start with you, and also that everyone else does the same. This could be taken to mean that everyone is a god or has some divinity in them.