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Earth: 0% religion

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
I think they are the best described and best known.

They seem to have belief in "spirits" despite no belief in a supreme creator God.

I suspect that even if we had no formal "religion" people would still maintain supernatural and even superstitious beliefs. E.g. astrology, crystals, spirits, afterlife, ghosts, etc.
 

Left Coast

This Is Water
Staff member
Premium Member
They seem to have belief in "spirits" despite no belief in a supreme creator God.

I suspect that even if we had no formal "religion" people would still maintain supernatural and even superstitious beliefs. E.g. astrology, crystals, spirits, afterlife, ghosts, etc.

Incidentally, this is consistent with observations by anthropologists and historians that monotheism appears to have evolved from polytheism and animism.
 

Watchmen

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
What if there was no religion? What if everyone was an atheist? How would the world look like? Would it be better or worse for planet Earth? For humanity?

Allow me to frame this question in two ways.

First, suppose that society and homo sapiens developed without religion. How would've that looked like? Is it possible for a being to evolve intelligently and remain non superstitious? Where would we be now?

Second, suppose that the next generation decides that religion isn't for them and atheism becomes the majority "religion". How would the near future look? Where would society go if humanity began discarding religion on mass from this point on?
The world would be pretty much the same. There’d be good people and there’d be bad people.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
Incidentally, this is consistent with observations by anthropologists and historians that monotheism appears to have evolved from polytheism and animism.
... with henotheism as in intermediate step. It even is still visible in the OT that the Israelites were henotheistic or even polytheistic in the beginning.
 

Colt

Well-Known Member
Where do you come up with this stuff? Atheists exist in opposition of something they don't believe in? There's an atheist 'identity'?
Its obvious, if there were no religious concept of a creator or religion to heckle then the Atheists would be unemployed! They would have to find another hobby, another way to seek attention.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
Its obvious, if there were no religious concept of a creator or religion to heckle then the Atheists would be unemployed! They would have to find another hobby, another way to seek attention.
With so many BS merchants around (flat earthers, homeopathists, crystal healers, etc.), the chance of us becoming unemployed is minuscule.
 
Yes, though I would call it "superstition" or "spirituality". Religion only seems to forms in cultures above the Dunbar's Number threshold.

That's a fair enough point, although I personally don't really know how to differentiate religion from "not religion".

We tend to judge what counts as a religion by its similarity to Christianity.
 
"Religion" can be a pretty broad subject, not necessarily connected with theology or even worship. A belief or set of beliefs that manifests an ethic in a society might be considered religious. Such beliefs/rules/attitudes would be needed for group solidarity and cohesion even in small, band-based societies.

Out of interest, how would you define religion? Do you think religious belief systems can be meaningfully differentiated from "not religious" belief systems?
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
That's a fair enough point, although I personally don't really know how to differentiate religion from "not religion".

We tend to judge what counts as a religion by its similarity to Christianity.
The borders are diffuse. When does a cult turn into a religion?

I'd require more than one of the following:
  • A theology or philosophy above and beyond some rituals and taboos.
  • A known founder.
  • Artificial places of worship.
  • A priesthood. (More than one shaman.)
  • A tradition spanning more than one generation.
  • A distributed followership of more than 150 people.
I think that includes all known religions including the zero god ones. It may not be exact enough to exclude all "cults".
 

CharmingOwl

Member
What if there was no religion? What if everyone was an atheist? How would the world look like? Would it be better or worse for planet Earth? For humanity?

Allow me to frame this question in two ways.

First, suppose that society and homo sapiens developed without religion. How would've that looked like? Is it possible for a being to evolve intelligently and remain non superstitious? Where would we be now?

Second, suppose that the next generation decides that religion isn't for them and atheism becomes the majority "religion". How would the near future look? Where would society go if humanity began discarding religion on mass from this point on?
1) People would have community centers for emotional healing or group therapy would be a lot more popular
2) There would be no cultural practices that arose from religion, so culture would be determined mostly by environment and history only. Japan, India, and America look radically different because of this.
3) I suspect political ideologies and lifestyles would be more diverse as there are no religious taboos in society.
4) Countries would not have national identity as often and some nations like Israel or Saudi Arabia simply would not exist. ISIS would not exist but it's likely some other ideology would be formed that is against the people who harmed their group. Religion is not used in politics or for recruitment into radical organizations.
5) Science becomes very problematic as humans no longer have religions to justify bigotry and stuff. Stuff like race realism and pseudoscience would be used in some cases by hate groups to spread hate and stuff.
6) People would likely categorize their lifestyles or belief systems in different ways. We would not have terms like hedonism or ascetism as the spiritual practices that started them simply would not exist.
7) Society would be closer to utopia as religious wars of the middle ages would not happen and the people would be allowed to progress faster through technology.
8) Feudalism cannot be justified without divine right theory, so we would go straight from tribes to republic to the modern ideologies of communism or liberalism. I doubt fascism can work without some religious backing. No theocracies ever exist in the world, and philosopher kings are more likely to be rulers in this time.
 
The borders are diffuse. When does a cult turn into a religion?

I'd require more than one of the following:
  • A theology or philosophy above and beyond some rituals and taboos.
  • A known founder.
  • Artificial places of worship.
  • A priesthood. (More than one shaman.)
  • A tradition spanning more than one generation.
  • A distributed followership of more than 150 people.
I think that includes all known religions including the zero god ones. It may not be exact enough to exclude all "cults".


Fair enough points again, and there are ultimately no definitive answers regarding the boundaries.

Would you include "secular" ideologies that meet the above definitions as being religions (Marxism for example)?
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Out of interest, how would you define religion? Do you think religious belief systems can be meaningfully differentiated from "not religious" belief systems?
I define it by context.
Did you read the link in post #60?
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The borders are diffuse. When does a cult turn into a religion?

I'd require more than one of the following:
  • A theology or philosophy above and beyond some rituals and taboos.
  • A known founder.
  • Artificial places of worship.
  • A priesthood. (More than one shaman.)
  • A tradition spanning more than one generation.
  • A distributed followership of more than 150 people.
I think that includes all known religions including the zero god ones. It may not be exact enough to exclude all "cults".
This seems more like 'organized religion' than religion per se. Read the link in post #60. Religion's hard to define.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
Fair enough points again, and there are ultimately no definitive answers regarding the boundaries.

Would you include "secular" ideologies that meet the above definitions as being religions (Marxism for example)?
No. And thanks to your question I now know what criterion must be met by any religion: an attempt at explaining the "spiritual" questions. Where do we come from, where does the universe come from, where are we going (after death)? This attempt to answer these questions separates the philosophical religions (Buddhism, Daoism) from just philosophy. (Though, again, the borders are diffuse. Many western philosophies are only excluded because they existed parallel to more "religious" religions.)
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
This seems more like 'organized religion' than religion per se. Read the link in post #60. Religion's hard to define.
I read the link (well, skipped over it). For me "organized religion" is a tautology. Some form of organization and crystallisation like scriptures separate a religion from a cult.
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
First, suppose that society and homo sapiens developed without religion. How would've that looked like? Is it possible for a being to evolve intelligently and remain non superstitious?

Superstitious tendencies are seen throughout pretty much the entire animal kingdom - and for good survival reasons.

So in that sense, humanity never stood a chance. In fact, our evolving intelligence most likely has even reinforced such tendencies, paving the way for all kinds of mystical and supernatural beliefs.

But now that we are aware of such things, there seems to be a general decline of engaging in such beliefs proportionally.

Second, suppose that the next generation decides that religion isn't for them and atheism becomes the majority "religion". How would the near future look? Where would society go if humanity began discarding religion on mass from this point on?

That would entirely depend on what replaces it as the new "cultural standard".

If it gets replaced with some kind of democratic humanism, then the world definitely will be better off imo.


Here we touch upon an important difference between atheism and theism which a lot of theists have a hard time to comprehend.

Theism is pretty much life overshadowing. It encompasses a LOT of aspects of a follower's life. In some religions more then others. But the impact is rather huge in all of them.
These religions come with all kinds of rules and rituals and commandments etc.

Atheism is nothing like that. There are no rituals, commandments, rules,... in atheism.
Atheism is JUST the absence of theism. That's it.

How an atheist looks at morality, societal organization, intersocial relations, etc.... is NOT derived from their atheism. For a theist it mostly IS derived from their theism, or influenced by it.

An atheist will thus derive such from other actual worldviews etc. Like, for example, humanism.

In that sense, atheism is NOT an "alternative" to theism.
A thing like secular humanism is.
 
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