• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

E.L.F and A.L.F.-Thoughts?

Druidus

Keeper of the Grove
As long as they harm no one, I see nothing wrong. I don't exactly know what they are or do, and I don't have time to read the links right now, but that's what I usually think. As long as it harms no one, go ahead and do it.
 

Hope

Princesinha
There were some ELF members here in Richmond recently being investigated....I don't agree with their tactics at all. :tsk:
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
I think they hurt the cause of enviromentalism by their tactics more than they help it.
 

HelpMe

·´sociopathic meanderer`·
linwood said:
I`d go so far as to call them terrorists.
and I`d go so far as to call Bush a terrorist.except i agree with their cause.last i read, they've hurt no people.
 

Hope

Princesinha
Maybe they haven't 'physically' hurt anybody, helpme, but the incidents I've heard about here where I live---thru the news and another source--weren't exactly commendable. Would not want any kids following their example...:tsk:
 

Fluffy

A fool
Love their aims. Hate the way they want to get them. If only we could clone an enviromentalist version of Martin Luther King... thats what they need I think, a good speaker who can inspire people and can argue their points of view rather than cram them down another's throat.
 

Druidus

Keeper of the Grove
I see... Hmmm... I don't fully agree with them, but we must remember, they do not have a defined membership. Anyone can do something and then say they were the ALF or the ELF, or even frame them...
 

linwood

Well-Known Member
HelpMe said:
and I`d go so far as to call Bush a terrorist.except i agree with their cause.last i read, they've hurt no people.
I wouldn`t argue with you about Bush.

They willfully destroy property in order to persuade the owners to change their business practices.

Thats terrorism in my book.

You cannot assure me that once you light a row of SUV`s on fire the ensuing explosions won`t harm anyone.

They haven`t caused physical harm to anyone because they are lucky.
 

linwood

Well-Known Member
Student convicted of torching dozens of SUVs in Southern California
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/state/20041119-1309-brf-suvarson.html

Animal Group Under Suspicion
http://www.montereyherald.com/mld/montereyherald/news/10276401.htm

Domestic Terrorism
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2004-11-14-domestic-terrorism_x.htm

Two Men Plead Guilty in Seperate Arson Attacks
http://www.animalrights.net/archives/year/2004/000415.html

Arson believed the Work of ELF

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/170136_elf22.html
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Who would have condemned tearing up the rails leading to auschwitz? It was destruction of property, to be sure, but would have been done to impede a greater evil.

ELF/ALF may destroy property or liberate enslaved people, but they do so to counter a greater evil. They answer to a higher authority than their state legislatures.

If you believe a law to be immoral isn't opposing it your only moral option?
 

HelpMe

·´sociopathic meanderer`·
thank you seyorni.


i'm sure it's impossible to plan on not harming anyone.
 

linwood

Well-Known Member
Seyorni said:
Who would have condemned tearing up the rails leading to auschwitz? It was destruction of property, to be sure, but would have been done to impede a greater evil.

ELF/ALF may destroy property or liberate enslaved people, but they do so to counter a greater evil. They answer to a higher authority than their state legislatures.

If you believe a law to be immoral isn't opposing it your only moral option?
Yes it is and incarceration is the only option the rest of the society you impact has when your moral movement attempts to force your morality upon those who do not share it.

I find the comparison of selling some SUV`s to gassing Jews to be extremely distatstefull and unfair.

Their criminals.

Please explain what "enslaved" people have these groups liberated?

I don`t understand the statement.
 

HelpMe

·´sociopathic meanderer`·
linwood said:
...your moral movement attempts to force your morality upon those who do not share it.
are you not opposed to majority law because majority makes it right?
 

linwood

Well-Known Member
HelpMe said:
are you not opposed to majority law because majority makes it right?

Yes I am but in this case this minority is causing harm to get their point across, a point that does not affect the lives of the humans within the society.

If a minority is being abused and discriminated against by all means defend yourselves in any manner you can.

That simply isn`t happening here.
 

HelpMe

·´sociopathic meanderer`·
linwood said:
If a minority is being abused and discriminated against by all means defend yourselves in any manner you can.

That simply isn`t happening here.
unless you replace 'minority' with 'defenseless'.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The four-leged and feathered people may not be a minority, but they can certainly be considered defenseless. They're as able to experience pain, fear and suffering as we humans are but are considered fair game for whatever form of exploitation we choose to impose on them.

I'd have no objection if someone sneaked into a burn lab and snatched all their beagles.
 
Top