Drug use in spiritual life?

[Spirit of Light]

I have a question about useage of drugs in spiritual communities,
Personally i have never used any form of drugs and personally would never use drugs (i dont judge those who do)

Why do some people seem to think some form of drugs are needed to experience the highest form of bliss in spiritual or religious practice when all that is needed is serious practice of meditation or prayer to gain the same bliss?

Is it because meditation takes longer time to realize and longer time to let go of human attachments?

 

[ajay0]

I have a question about useage of drugs in spiritual communities,
Personally i have never used any form of drugs and personally would never use drugs (i dont jude those who do)

Why do some people seem to think some form of drugs are needed to experience the highest form of bliss in spiritual or religious practice when all that is needed is serious practice of meditation or prayer to gain the same bliss?

Is it because meditation takes longer time to realize and longer time to let go of human attachments?

In the East, there are some fraudsters , charlatans and misguided people who use drugs. Some even use whiskey. This has been termed as false approaches by enlightened masters.

Meher Baba stated that enlightenment is not found in a pill. Liquor too has been condemned as an inttoxicant which is detrimental to meditative awareness.

Worse, drug addiction is a craving in itself, which strengthens the ego and prevents present moment awareness or mindfulness.

Like anything,drugs have a positive in that it helps one to gain a glimpse of the superconscious and to realize that the material world is not the fundamental reality. This can pave the path for spiritual growth and enlightenment through meditation.

But if one creates an addiction for it, it becomes detrimental, just like liquor, cigarettes, speed driving, the internet and so on.

All notions that drugs can help one attain enlightenment is nonsense and should be discarded.

 

[Sunstone]

MOD POST
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CAUTION: Advocating and/or discussing personal engagement in illegal activities is against Forum Rules. Be very careful here not to advocate the illegal use of drugs and/or discuss your own usage of them.

6. Illegal Activities
Advocating or discussing personal engagement in illegal activities or criminal organizations (such as hate groups or terrorist groups) is prohibited in all areas of RF. Illegal activities are defined based on United States law, and include but are not limited to: drug use, theft, piracy, vandalism, and all violent crimes. Voicing opposition to illegal activities and criminal organizations, or debating changes to current criminal law, may be acceptable at the discretion of the RF staff.

 

[SalixIncendium]

It's simply another means of achieving an altered state of consciousness. For some, it's tradition, for others, it's personal preference.

To me, the question is like asking, why do some people eat beef and pork to satiate hunger when all that is needed is to eat poultry or fish?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sound like i broke a rule in the forum, so can moederator please delete my OP?

 

[SalixIncendium]

Sound like i broke a rule in the forum, so can moederator please delete my OP?

Not at all; this is actually a great topic. Your post was within the parameters of the rules. @Sunstone just put a Rule 6 reminder up to make sure the direction of the thread stays within the confines of the rules.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Not at all; this is actually a great topic. Your post was within the parameters of the rules. @Sunstone just put a Rule 6 reminder up to make sure the direction of the thread stays within the confines of the rules.

Ok then we can continue

 

[Twilight Hue]

I have a question about useage of drugs in spiritual communities,
Personally i have never used any form of drugs and personally would never use drugs (i dont jude those who do)

Why do some people seem to think some form of drugs are needed to experience the highest form of bliss in spiritual or religious practice when all that is needed is serious practice of meditation or prayer to gain the same bliss?

Is it because meditation takes longer time to realize and longer time to let go of human attachments?

Drugs just give you a buzz one way or another or make you high. It's pretty much the gist of it.

 

[Sunstone]

About 40 years ago, I became interested in people's mystical experiences -- experiences that many folks -- but not all -- describe as being experiences of god and/or enlightenment.

Since then I have listened to uncountable testimonies from people about their experiences. The people I've listened to attained their experiences through various means including meditation, drugs, spontaneity, and other means.

While I have not made anything approaching a scientifically rigorous study of such testimonies, I believe I've noticed a difference between people who attained their experiences through drug use and those who attained them through other means.

On the whole, those who attained a mystical experience through drugs seem to me differently impacted by the experience than those who attained it through other means.

For one thing, it seems to me that people who attain a mystical experience while using drugs tend to end up in the long run dealing with their ego -- or psychological self -- in ways that are more like people who have never had any kind of mystical experience, than they are like people who have had a "natural" mystical experience.

There are of course, exceptions.

 

[Sunstone]

Sound like i broke a rule in the forum, so can moederator please delete my OP?

No way, Jose! We're keeping your excellent thread up! I was just warning folks not to endorse any illegal activities and/or discuss their personal engagement in them.

 

[Spirit of Light]

No way, Jose! We're keeping your thread up! I was just warning folks not to endorse any illegal activities and/or discuss their personal engagement in them.

Thank you As a non user of any form of psycedelic drugs i wantd to hear why some think it can help or if it is only a hype of some sort ) No judement fom my part toward anyone

 

[Vinayaka]

I have a question about useage of drugs in spiritual communities,
Personally i have never used any form of drugs and personally would never use drugs (i dont jude those who do)

Why do some people seem to think some form of drugs are needed to experience the highest form of bliss in spiritual or religious practice when all that is needed is serious practice of meditation or prayer to gain the same bliss?

Is it because meditation takes longer time to realize and longer time to let go of human attachments?

As Ajay, said, I too think it's a false path. Perhaps one time experience might give someone the sense that there is indeed 'something' else out there besides ordinary consciousness, but after that realisation, the search for such things is better done with clarity of mind. Besides, that same first -time happens elsewhere, and in other ways too, spontaneously, or via being in strong darshan, for example.

After that, I see it as nothing more than thrill seeking or an excuse for an addiction. But hey, to each his own at whatever point they need to be at. Most people do end it at some point.

 

[Windwalker]

No way, Jose! We're keeping your excellent thread up! I was just warning folks not to endorse any illegal activities and/or discuss their personal engagement in them.

Let's say someone lives in a state where the consumption of marijuana is legal. Can they talk about it then and not cross forum rules?

 

[SalixIncendium]

Let's say someone lives in a state where the consumption of marijuana is legal. Can they talk about it then and not cross forum rules?

Good question, and something the Staff would need to discuss behind the scenes. For now, I would advise against it, as marijuana is still considered an illegal drug under US Federal law.

 

[Windwalker]

Good question, and something the Staff would need to discuss behind the scenes. For now, I would advise against it, as marijuana is still considered an illegal drug under US Federal law.

It seemed a logical question to me since "illegality" is not a universal thing. Whose laws, and in what parts of the world? Does RF follow state of federal guidelines, US or UN standards, and such. Inquiring minds want to know. (Such a technical question so early in the morning for me).

 

[Vinayaka]

Let's say someone lives in a state where the consumption of marijuana is legal. Can they talk about it then and not cross forum rules?

Here in Canada where it is now legal, the percentage of people who use, in any way jumped from 23% to 24%. Very little of that has to do with spiritual purposes, I'm sure. If someone obviously stoned came to our temple, we'd boot him out, just as we would with someone who was obviously drunk. We don't allow smoking on property either.

 

[SalixIncendium]

*nudges thread back onto the rails*

 

[Jumi]

Drugs are like Plato's cave analogy, except you go to a new cave and think it's outside. You might catch a glimpse of the outside from that cave same as you could in the real cave, but people would understand and believe you even less.

 

[Windwalker]

Here in Canada where it is now legal, the percentage of people who use, in any way jumped from 23% to 24%. Very little of that has to do with spiritual purposes, I'm sure.

Very few people in general really care about spirituality, so I don't think you'd see much of an increase in pot use statistically with that as the motive. It would be frankly amazing if suddenly increase in spiritual commitment grew by making pot legal. One would wish maybe they made it legal long ago, if that was the result.

If someone obviously stoned came to our temple, we'd boot him out, just as we would with someone who was obviously drunk. We don't allow smoking on property either.

Well, yes, if someone were "out of it" coming into a temple, that is not being done for spiritual purposes. Then again, I don't think that those who use certain types of drugs as "assists" to meditation, are doing it to escape reality. I think the number of those who use things like pot for spiritual use, are a low number, just as those who use religion for spiritual practice are in the minority as well. I would think its the end result that would be the measure of any practice, be that yoga or meditation or pot, or DMT, or chanting, or dancing, etc. It seems intention is the determination factor to results, not the means.

 

[PruePhillip]

I have a question about useage of drugs in spiritual communities,
Personally i have never used any form of drugs and personally would never use drugs (i dont jude those who do)

Why do some people seem to think some form of drugs are needed to experience the highest form of bliss in spiritual or religious practice when all that is needed is serious practice of meditation or prayer to gain the same bliss?

Is it because meditation takes longer time to realize and longer time to let go of human attachments?

Drugs are an alternative to both normal living and spiritual life.