Don't Know What To Classify Myself As.

[MichaelleahciM]

Welcome.
Do you need to classify yourself? Why?

Perhaps to narrow the search for closely similar minded women and men. People who are looking into this can share knowledge and ideas. I gets lonely out here on the fringe. There are just now a few well know folks in QP who are willing to exam the personal conscious to QP. Like Roger Penrose. Wikie: "Penrose and Hameroff have argued that consciousness is the result of quantum gravity effects in microtubules, which they dubbed Orch-OR (orchestrated objective reduction). Max Tegmark, in a paper in Physical Review E,[20] calculated that the time scale of neuron firing and excitations in microtubules is slower than the decoherence time by a factor of at least 10,000,000,000. The reception of the paper is summed up by this statement in Tegmark's support: "Physicists outside the fray, such as IBM's John A. Smolin, say the calculations confirm what they had suspected all along. 'We're not working with a brain that's near absolute zero. It's reasonably unlikely that the brain evolved quantum behavior'".[21] Tegmark's paper has been widely cited by critics of the Penrose–Hameroff position." Perhaps I'm a Penroseian!?

 

[MichaelleahciM]

View attachment 41240 Welcome to RF. Hope you enjoy the ride.

May i offer you a welcoming petite gateaux.

LOL, I'm liking the repeated candy's being offered! Thank-you for your welcome.

 

[Secret Chief]

Perhaps to narrow the search for closely similar minded women and men. People who are looking into this can share knowledge and ideas. I gets lonely out here on the fringe. There are just now a few well know folks in QP who are willing to exam the personal conscious to QP. Like Roger Penrose. Wikie: "Penrose and Hameroff have argued that consciousness is the result of quantum gravity effects in microtubules, which they dubbed Orch-OR (orchestrated objective reduction). Max Tegmark, in a paper in Physical Review E,[20] calculated that the time scale of neuron firing and excitations in microtubules is slower than the decoherence time by a factor of at least 10,000,000,000. The reception of the paper is summed up by this statement in Tegmark's support: "Physicists outside the fray, such as IBM's John A. Smolin, say the calculations confirm what they had suspected all along. 'We're not working with a brain that's near absolute zero. It's reasonably unlikely that the brain evolved quantum behavior'".[21] Tegmark's paper has been widely cited by critics of the Penrose–Hameroff position." Perhaps I'm a Penroseian!?

Well good luck Penroseian in your search for the similar minded. There's certainly quite a large and mixed group here, united I believe only in their common search for the ultimate cake.

 

[MichaelleahciM]

Perhaps this (Quantum Entanglement) is why I have some (small) agnosticism concerning some creative force or God - but also down to my lack of any appropriate knowledge concerning physics - although nothing really persuades me towards any particular religious belief.

Anyway, welcome to RF.

I get it, I prefer to stay away from all use of the the word God, as it isn't what I imagine to be the situation in QP. ( being forced to use God in these types of discussions bothers me the same as it gets weary to talk about race when race doesn't exist.) I'm not of the group which wishes to use QP to support their theory of God. I don't require what I see as an extended Parental figure. I have a theory that current Atheism and Agnosticism arose from distaste for Abrahamic faiths. And their cultural and moral/immoral laws of behavior. A history extending to today of abuse of followers. Currently I've left behind any but a curiosity of the ancient religions. My mind is simply on a crude layman's study of QP and how it is showing the reality of what we are. Most seem stuck with the Universe and all it contains as the central focus of reality. I see QP as central to everything and the Universe a second thought so to speak. Even those who look to Bio-Centrism seem to be unable to not see biological as primary rather than a secondary.

 

[MichaelleahciM]

Well good luck Penroseian in your search for the similar minded. There's certainly quite a large and mixed group here, united I believe only in their common search for the ultimate cake.

Thanks!

 

[Daemon Sophic]

Out of curiosity, and perhaps an aide to discovering your belief system.....
What do you believe will happen to your conciousness after your body here in the universe “dies”?

So far, I gather that you see it sort of like a real world human “unjacking” from the Matrix. Sitting up while rubbing his jack-plug and saying, “Well, that was kinda fun.”

 

[MichaelleahciM]

Out of curiosity, and perhaps an aide to discovering your belief system.....
What do you believe will happen to your conciousness after your body here in the universe “dies”?

So far, I gather that you see it sort of like a real world human “unjacking” from the Matrix. Sitting up while rubbing his jack-plug and saying, “Well, that was kinda fun.”

Good question!. What I believe is keeping an open mind first and foremost, which currently leads me to the possibility/chance that our consciousness was existing before entering this hologram sort of Universe. and will simply become fully aware again of it's total-self once the body is gone. This is my current guess. ( I seem to remember The Matrix was based upon some sort of fringe Judaism thought, or Mysticism? But yes, at some point we awaken to what has been there, which is our personal consciousness. )

 

[Koldo]

I had to wiki much, and would on first look say that's getting close. Although I don't agree with, 'Philosophy', the power of the mind to over pure science to determine matter. I've always felt that was a critical flaw of most human males. Philosophy can be beneficial for Brain Storming, but must be followed up with scientific study to show an ideas validity. But this is close, I look strictly at what QP is saying we and everything is.

I don't understand. QP doesn't have anything to do per se with consciousness. How do you integrate both concepts without philosophy?

 

[MichaelleahciM]

I don't understand. QP doesn't have anything to do per se with consciousness. How do you integrate both concepts without philosophy?

Maybe this as a primer of Quantum Physics/Mechanics;

Quantum Physics is the scientific study of, you and I and the Universe, anything that is considered as in a state of matter or particles. No need to use Philosophy as it relies strictly on highly advanced mathematics and then the math has been proven through experiments. There seems to be no doubt all the major math of QP has been proven to be true and real. Philosophy could be used to brain store or use the human imagination, perhaps as Einstein might have done, then find a formula that seemed to substantiate the idea or philosophy , than wait for technology to improve so experiments could be done to prove the math. ( This is my limited ability to explain it since I'm not good at basic math nor a scientist in any regards. But I do know that when QP is studied, it is a study of you and I and all so called material things, which have a dual nature all at once. )
PS: Sir Roger Penrose see's consciousness as possibly residing within microtubule inside the brain. That the microtubule allow quantum actions to occur within a material thing, us.

 

[Koldo]

Maybe this as a primer of Quantum Physics/Mechanics;

Quantum Physics is the scientific study of, you and I and the Universe, anything that is considered as in a state of matter or particles. No need to use Philosophy as it relies strictly on highly advanced mathematics and then the math has been proven through experiments. There seems to be no doubt all the major math of QP has been proven to be true and real. Philosophy could be used to brain store or use the human imagination, perhaps as Einstein might have done, then find a formula that seemed to substantiate the idea or philosophy , than wait for technology to improve so experiments could be done to prove the math. ( This is my limited ability to explain it since I'm not good at basic math nor a scientist in any regards. But I do know that when QP is studied, it is a study of you and I and all so called material things, which have a dual nature all at once. )
PS: Sir Roger Penrose see's consciousness as possibly residing within microtubule inside the brain. That the microtubule allow quantum actions to occur within a material thing, us.

But consciousness is not part of QP per se. So how do you bridge it with "I believe we were already conscious and come to this artificial universe for maybe a vacation from boring Eternity or to gain some form of elevation and personal growth. The source of creation could be our collection of consciousness or elder collective of consciousness's." ?

 

[MichaelleahciM]

But consciousness is not part of QP per se. So how do you bridge it with "I believe we were already conscious and come to this artificial universe for maybe a vacation from boring Eternity or to gain some form of elevation and personal growth. The source of creation could be our collection of consciousness or elder collective of consciousness's." ?

Free Thinking and extrapolation of my current reading of QP. I don't profess to have any solid theory, nor to be correct. Sir Roger Penrose, a brilliant mind seems to see the possibility of how a quantum level consciousness could reside in the puppet like material world. Which is through the microtubule in our brain, the microtubule house quantum activity (my crude explanation of Penrose theory). If we are as the QP genius's seems to think, we literally are the Wave state and at that level Time simply doesn't exist at the Wave state, (it would be an eternity to our current level of awareness). QP seems to show we are Wave State and through some manipulation can manifest here. Wave state is the normal state and through some process, currently described as The Observer effect, perhaps Higgs Boson?? Particles are a secondary thingy, as they come from Wave (energy?) In a perfect vacuum, particles pop into existence, proven, not the other way around. If I learned about that correctly, particles appear in pairs, a particle and an anti particle, which quickly annihilate each other. But appear out of the energy that is everywhere. Therefore, consciousness is from the wave energy state and not from here, and is not affected by the constraints of Time, nor any space, Time and Space, which are thingy's of this fake place. This is all crude free thinking on my part.

 

[Revoltingest]

Greetings!
Join us for the free (if you sneak in) Sunday brunch in the staff cafeteria....

 

[Koldo]

Free Thinking and extrapolation of my current reading of QP. I don't profess to have any solid theory, nor to be correct. Sir Roger Penrose, a brilliant mind seems to see the possibility of how a quantum level consciousness could reside in the puppet like material world. Which is through the microtubule in our brain, the microtubule house quantum activity (my crude explanation of Penrose theory). If we are as the QP genius's seems to think, we literally are the Wave state and at that level Time simply doesn't exist at the Wave state, (it would be an eternity to our current level of awareness). QP seems to show we are Wave State and through some manipulation can manifest here. Wave state is the normal state and through some process, currently described as The Observer effect, perhaps Higgs Boson?? Particles are a secondary thingy, as they come from Wave (energy?) In a perfect vacuum, particles pop into existence, proven, not the other way around. If I learned about that correctly, particles appear in pairs, a particle and an anti particle, which quickly annihilate each other. But appear out of the energy that is everywhere. Therefore, consciousness is from the wave energy state and not from here, and is not affected by the constraints of Time, nor any space, Time and Space, which are thingy's of this fake place. This is all crude free thinking on my part.

Have you ever heard about Deepak Chopra? I suggest you read you about him in case you haven't. If your view aligns with his then you are definitely in the new age group. If you aren't, then there might not be a proper label to describe your views I am afraid.

 

[MichaelleahciM]

Have you ever heard about Deepak Chopra? I suggest you read you about him in case you haven't. If your view aligns with his then you are definitely in the new age group. If you aren't, then there might not be a proper label to describe your views I am afraid.

I have looked at him and not for me. Thanks though!

 

[Aupmanyav]

I see creation and source of creation through; Quantum Physics. .. I used to be a member of the Baha'i faith and see it as the best course for the average person to get to the next level of religions. But left due to too much conflicting laws.

God doesn't see your; religion's, nation's, cities, culture's, money, gender, sexual preference. God only sees your consciousness. As soon as you think your better than anyone in anyway. You immediately place distance between yourself and God.

I go by Quantum Physics and do not have any God. We can't escape eternity, because that is what we are. What constitutes us has come to us from millions of forms and after our seming death will to to millions of forms. Religions change and must change to new knowledge, not to new (false) beliefs that this person is a messenger of Allah or a manifestation. My religion, 'Advaita' Hinduism goes step with step with science.

How come on one hand you go by Quantum Physics and on the other talk of God? Where in Quantum Physics did you see the need to talk about God? Get rid of this false belief.

 

[MichaelleahciM]

I go by Quantum Physics and do not have any God. We can't escape eternity, because that is what we are. What constitutes us has come to us from millions of forms and after our seming death will to to millions of forms. Religions change and must change to new knowledge, not to new (false) beliefs that this person is a messenger of Allah or a manifestation. My religion, 'Advaita' Hinduism goes step with step with science.

How come on one hand you go by Quantum Physics and on the other talk of God? Where in Quantum Physics did you see the need to talk about God? Get rid of this false belief.

Thank-you! Good question, I mentioned that in a previous post. To me it's similar to trying to have a conversation about how bad racism is, and race is used to discuss, yet, race doesn't exist! Personally I don't accept any past religions concept of God, I do see Creation, this universe and all it contains seems to be a Creation. Since in QP its particles that pop into existence from the 'energy field' it seems to allude to the energy field an integral part of the source of creation, that it doesn't go the other way, particles couldn't exist without the energy field, making the energy field the primary or base. then to take the idea further, if everything is in/of the energy field, so is our consciousness. Then to go even further and the concept that Observation kick starts a Wave into a particle, leads to the question of who is doing the Observation? This is where I use two books; Dr. Eben Alexander and Anita Moorjani, where it seems there is perhaps an advanced consciousness, perhaps a collective of advanced consciousness's which do the Observation. But I also see the possibility that all of us are are part of the Observation. (My somewhat tongue in cheek personal wouldn't it be nice idea, We create this holographic universe as a vacation spot to enjoy after a boring life of eternity...) PS: Since most people can comprehend a God, it makes a jump off point to take it to Source of Creation to further de-Supreme Being whatever the source of creation is, which is irrelevant to me, since I don't feel I'm required to prostate myself in front of It, from what I feel we are completely considered equal but maybe, just maybe there is a refinement that each consciousness strives to attain. Thank-you for prodding my to explain as it sharpens my ability to explain what seems to me as closer to the reality. As far as Hindu, so much of it seems to, allude to many QP facts, and as the most ancient faith somehow seemed to connect better with QP. I respect it and enjoy study of it because of what seems like connections to QP! PS: RE: "God doesn't see your; religion's, nation's, cities, culture's, money, gender, sexual preference. God only sees your consciousness. As soon as you think your better than anyone in anyway. You immediately place distance between yourself and God.",, I was addressing a common religion prove group and trying to elevate their thinking to above a singular religious faith the demands belief in their laws of god over others. They cannot see that all tribes created personal tribal gods, many gods and singular personal tribal god/s and layered on cultural bias and culture. Trying to get them to see, we are all of the same Source of Creation, end the divisions which are created by humans, be as one family. Which cannot be done even if we accept a single source of creation but stay divided over arguing that 'our' religion faith knows best what the source of creation wants of us.

 

[Aupmanyav]

particles couldn't exist without the energy field, making the energy field the primary or base. then to take the idea further, if everything is in/of the energy field, so is our consciousness. Then to go even further and the concept that Observation kick starts a Wave into a particle, leads to the question of who is doing the Observation? This is where I use two books; Dr. Eben Alexander and Anita Moorjani, where it seems there is perhaps an advanced consciousness, perhaps a collective of advanced consciousness's which do the Observation. But I also see the possibility that all of us are are part of the Observation. (My somewhat tongue in cheek personal wouldn't it be nice idea, We create this holographic universe as a vacation spot to enjoy after a boring life of eternity...) PS: Since most people can comprehend a God,

Does the energy field exists all the time? Or is it something which exists or ceases to exist according to some law that we do not know today? You went to consciousness without any proof. That was quite a jump. Observation comes after the seeming creation, before that there is no observer. What is this 'advanced consciousness'? What proof Dr. Eben Alexander and Anita Moorjani have given for the 'advanced consciousness'?What ignorant people comprehend or do not comprehend is no reason to jump to a God. As I said you seem to be totally confused or you are quite smart and your purpose is only of confuse people. We have one or two members like that in the forum.

 

[MichaelleahciM]

Does the energy field exists all the time? Or is it something which exists or ceases to exist according to some law that we do not know today? You went to consciousness without any proof. That was quite a jump. Observation comes after the seeming creation, before that there is no observer. What is this 'advanced consciousness'? What proof Dr. Eben Alexander and Anita Moorjani have given for the 'advanced consciousness'?What ignorant people comprehend or do not comprehend is no reason to jump to a God. As I said you seem to be totally confused or you are quite smart and your purpose is only of confuse people. We have one or two members like that in the forum.

Hi Aupmanyav, Energy Field; Yes, it's always there. There is no Proof of a continuing personal consciousness nor of a 'already there personal consciousness which temporarily inhabits bodies here. I'm more comfortable with a personal consciousness pre-existing, maybe related to reincarnation theory. Just my personal extrapolation that I mentioned. Which is roughly everything in this Universe arises or emanates from the EF, including our personal consciousness, all my personal guess. In or At the EF level Time doesn't exist, location doesn't exist, there is no Eternity as Time doesn't exist. The Observation has to do with a proven QP experiment called the Double Slit experiment. The double slit experiment shows what should be a non-physical Wave of energy, changes to the state of a particle when an attempt to measure or observe the particles position, it's slightly more to it. Therefore the particles which comprise all of what we see as solid are created perhaps by some form of Observation. Who, or, what, is doing the Observation is a question that is poised. Dr. Alexander and Mrs. Moorjani have no proofs, only an experience they had had. It is interesting to me. You'd have to read their books to fully see what they are conveying. And again, I don't ascribe to to historical concept of a God. I do feel this Universe is not the center of consciousness. That personal consciousness exists somehow within the Energy Field which all matter comes from.

 

[Aupmanyav]

No proof for reincarnation, judgment, ever-lasting life or eternity in hell. Nobody with brain or any intelligence is observing or controlling. These are only interaction of forces. If you consider them eternal, then you will have to provide a proof as to from where they arose. The other option is to say that we will perhaps know exactly about this in future, we do not know at the moment, perhaps existence has another phase in non-existence. Only in that case the problem of being eternal does not arise (and personally I think our future generations may find that true). If Dr. Alexander and Ms. Moorjani have no proof about what they say, then they are automatically stand rejected as far as I am concerned. You see, Michael, I am a strong atheist.

 

[MichaelleahciM]

No proof for reincarnation, judgment, ever-lasting life or eternity in hell. Nobody with brain or any intelligence is observing or controlling. These are only interaction of forces. If you consider them eternal, then you will have to provide a proof as to from where they arose. The other option is to say that we will perhaps know exactly about this in future, we do not know at the moment, perhaps existence has another phase in non-existence. Only in that case the problem of being eternal does not arise (and personally I think our future generations may find that true). If Dr. Alexander and Ms. Moorjani have no proof about what they say, then they are automatically stand rejected as far as I am concerned. You see, Michael, I am a strong atheist.

Oh, OK, understood,, Thank-you!