"Don't Ask, Don't Tell" repealed!

[Draka]

Honestly, I've never seen the issue. I was in the military. I shared quarters and showers and heads with many women. I knew a few of them were lesbians and I think it reasonable to assume that there were others I didn't know about. You know what? It didn't bother me in the slightest. It's not like homosexuals are really interested in going after heterosexuals anyway, so there's not any real reason to get worked up about sharing quarters to me. To think that a gay person is checking you out just because they are gay says more about you. Like your ego for one

Ideally though, it would be nice if we as a species could get past certain things sexually. Then perhaps it wouldn't matter what gender or orientation people are in the showers or bunks. Like that movie I can never remember the name of. The one with the big alien bugs and Neil Patrick Harris. Everyone worked together, showered together, shared quarters together and were just seen as other soldiers period. Wouldn't that be nice?

 

[Sententia]

Human blood is red.

And even if some people had green blood your point would still stand.

 

[Father Heathen]

But other members of the military have rights too, and I want to be sure that their rights are protected as well.

What rights in particular are being threatened?

 

[Revoltingest]

What rights in particular are being threatened?

The right to be hot in front of an entirely uninterested audience?

 

[javajo]

Hooray!

 

[Alceste]

I just think gays should have their own showers. I think it's completely inappropriate that someone should have to take a shower with those that are sexually attracted to their gender. Just like coed showers are inappropriate. At least give heterosexuals the option of taking showers by themselves

Should there be another separate shower for the closeted homosexuals who think they are straight? Studies have shown that men who are disgusted by gay sex are more aroused by gay porn than genuine heterosexuals.

 

[Acim]

I do have some questions about some issues that could arise.

1) If men and women soldiers who are having sex together are not allowed to share a dorm room or a bunker, will gays who are having sex together be allowed to share rooms or bunkers? I mean, do you say that only women can bunk with other women, or men with other men - UNLESS they are having sex together?

I would think if two or more soldiers are known to be sexually active with each other, there is no justification for sharing same room, while essentially serving duty.

2) Can a heterosexual man or woman in the military demand to be assigned another heterosexual roommate if the roommate they are assigned is gay? Why or why not?

I would think not unless the person was making unwanted advances. In which case, it would seem to me, the person making such advances, if overt about it, would be reprimanded. If person on receiving end feels it is ever so subtle, but is uncomfortable, I don't know how that would be handled, other than on case by case basis.

3) Would it be right to expect or demand that heterosexual females in the military shower and room with heterosexual men? If not, why not?

IMO, this is a very interesting question, and given the nature of the duty, I can't think of good reason why not. But I'm guessing many will suggest we aren't there yet, and it is unreasonable demand. Why? I don't know. And what I'm taking as your implication with regards to DADT being repealed, I think it would have crossover rationale.

Btw, I'm one who rejoices gladly with DADT repealed.

 

[Alceste]

I do have some questions about some issues that could arise.

1) If men and women soldiers who are having sex together are not allowed to share a dorm room or a bunker, will gays who are having sex together be allowed to share rooms or bunkers? I mean, do you say that only women can bunk with other women, or men with other men - UNLESS they are having sex together?

2) Can a heterosexual man or woman in the military demand to be assigned another heterosexual roommate if the roommate they are assigned is gay? Why or why not?

3) Would it be right to expect or demand that heterosexual females in the military shower and room with heterosexual men? If not, why not?

I am sure that many gay men and women are serving in our military with honor and bravery - and I support their right to serve, as well as their right to be open about their sexuality. But other members of the military have rights too, and I want to be sure that their rights are protected as well.

You are over-thinking the issue. Why not just leave everything as it is? Right this very minute, some men are bunking with men they are in a romantic relationship with, and some women are too. The only thing this changes is that they will no longer lose their jobs if they are discovered.

Do you think it's OK for a soldier to request a different room-mate because his is black, or Asian, and he's only comfortable around whites? If a straight soldier can't suck it up and bunk next to a homosexual soldier, he's not much of a soldier.

 

[Revoltingest]

I favor one restriction.
American draftees & enlistees should not shower with us draft dodgers.

 

[Alceste]

I favor one restriction.
American draftees & enlistees should not shower with us draft dodgers.

I don't think that will be a problem until you draft dodgers are required to shower.

 

[Skwim]

You are over-thinking the issue. Why not just leave everything as it is? Right this very minute, some men are bunking with men they are in a romantic relationship with, and some women are too. The only thing this changes is that they will no longer lose their jobs if they are discovered.

Do you think it's OK for a soldier to request a different room-mate because his is black, or Asian, and he's only comfortable around whites? If a straight soldier can't suck it up and bunk next to a homosexual soldier, he's not much of a soldier.

And if a straight soldier can't suck it up and bunk next to a soldier of the opposite sex, (s)he's not much of a soldier.

 

[Revoltingest]

I don't think that will be a problem until you draft dodgers are required to shower.

Draft dodgers are so sub-human, that we shouldn't even be allowed to offend the eyes of soldiers.
Tis best to keep us out of the military.
A moot issue, some would call it...but there's always some politician (usually a Dem who is past draft age) who wants to re-institute it for multi-cultural goals.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

Draft dodgers are so sub-human, that we shouldn't even be allowed to offend the eyes of soldiers.
Tis best to keep us out of the military.
A moot issue, some would call it...but there's always some politician (usually a Dem who is past draft age) who wants to re-institute it for multi-cultural goals.

hehehe.. funny that's how it usually works out

 

[Revoltingest]

hehehe.. funny that's how it usually works out

For some, the appearance of equality in groups trumps actual civil liberties of individuals.

 

[averageJOE]

I don't think any of you understands what this means (which is really simple actually). All it means is that a soldier who is gay/lesbian no longer has to keep that part of their life seceret. Period. All the same rules before still apply. Fraternization between any soldiers is still prohibited, unless married. Two men or two women caught having sex will get into the same amount of trouble as a male and female would.

I can answer as many questions as I can but I won't pretend to have all the answers.

 

[blackout]

And if a straight soldier can't suck it up and bunk next to a soldier of the opposite sex, (s)he's not much of a soldier.

LOL. People who are not afraid of sharing a battlefield with enemies who have guns,
and want to kill them,
are afraid of sharing showers and bunks with the people who are going to help them survive.

If all I had to do was shower and bunk with fellow Americans of different genders and sexual orientations, even I could handle the military. Cake.
If I were a military person (and all of you military persons should be truly glad I'm not) I'd be far more concerned about who I'm sharing a fox hole with. :yes:

 

[IsmailaGodHasHeard]

Everybody is WRONG in here according to you.

No, not really. I have agreed with people on here before.

 

[IsmailaGodHasHeard]

It will all be figgered out.
Everyone will cope.
Things should even improve.


Both are part of you.
But the proportions aren't for us to say.

Fair enough. I just prefer to define myself by my spirituality.

 

[Draka]

I don't think any of you understands what this means (which is really simple actually). All it means is that a soldier who is gay/lesbian no longer has to keep that part of their life seceret. Period. All the same rules before still apply. Fraternization between any soldiers is still prohibited, unless married. Two men or two women caught having sex will get into the same amount of trouble as a male and female would.

I can answer as many questions as I can but I won't pretend to have all the answers.

Let's be clear here so some people don't get a little dumb on this, specifically no PDAs (public displays of affection) are allowed in-uniform and/or on-duty. There are also rules concerning officers and enlisted personnel and fraternization within a person's chain of command. Other than those things, there isn't anything prohibiting, say, two enlisted members from having a relationship, as long as they keep their personal interactions confined to off-duty time and out-of-uniform in public.

 

[Kathryn]

You are over-thinking the issue. Why not just leave everything as it is? Right this very minute, some men are bunking with men they are in a romantic relationship with, and some women are too. The only thing this changes is that they will no longer lose their jobs if they are discovered.

Do you think it's OK for a soldier to request a different room-mate because his is black, or Asian, and he's only comfortable around whites? If a straight soldier can't suck it up and bunk next to a homosexual soldier, he's not much of a soldier.

Do you think it would be OK for a black soldier to request a different roommate if it was a known fact that his roommate was a white supremacist? I mean, using your reasoning, if a soldier can't suck it up and bunk next to a white supremacist, he's not much of a soldier.

I understand that there are many different sorts of people and beliefs in our military and that part of military training is to bond as a team in spite of those differences.

But you didn't answer my question. Should female soldiers be forced to shower or share quarters with male soldiers? Why or why not?

I do not believe that sexual harrassment is limited to heterosexuals.

Let me repeat myself - I support the rights of gays to be in our military, and to be open about their sexuality. I also believe that there are going to be issues stemming from this right, that will need to be addressed - INCLUDING some of their own rights, such as housing for married military, rights of their partners, etc.

I didn't say these issues can't be worked out. I'm just saying that they are there. I'm not sticking my head in the idyllic sand.