Does a god exist?

[firedragon]

I see all sorts of little things that show various aspects of gods cannot exist

Childhood leukemia shows there is no
compassionate god

The futulity of prayer shows no listening god

Mass (matter) existing shows no omnipotent god

But wait for it. Here we have a picture of god

Spoiler: Picture of god

View attachment 57062
This is an mri scan of a brain thinking of god

Emotions are not evidence or even internal criticism.


Strange for the faithful on emotion requesting empiricism from others.

 

[PureX]

I see so many arguements here about a god existing or a god not existing, show me your evidence a god does exist and show me evidence a god doesn't exist, etc.

Exist, how? God clearly exists as an idea, and as an ideal. And that ideal clearly has a very real and physical presence in the world through the actions of those who embody it. But does God exist as a physical phenomenon apart from the mind of humans? That depends on how we are defining God, and how we are defining the boundaries of existence. Which drives us into the realm of theology, and philosophy. Which are realms of thought that a lot of people are not well versed in. Yet opinions abound.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Kept alive is they key. We have the knowledge and technology to keep things alive that would otherwise die without our knowledge and technology. How does that prove a god?

That was not what the post was about.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

The entertainment is seeing how deeply theists trap themselves.

Or how physicalist, materialists, objective real naturalists and so on trap themselves.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

I see all sorts of little things that show various aspects of gods cannot exist

Childhood leukemia shows there is no
compassionate god

The futulity of prayer shows no listening god

Mass (matter) existing shows no omnipotent god

But wait for it. Here we have a picture of god

Spoiler: Picture of god

View attachment 57062
This is an mri scan of a brain thinking of god

No, I am not going to be nice.
We could do the same with your belief in Real Life. Here is a brain thinking of Real Life.
It works on everybody, including you.

 

[Sheldon]

show me evidence a god doesn't exist

Well I am an atheist and disbelieve in deities, but since the concept is often premised as an unfalsifiable one, I don't claim no deity exists.

What does evidence for a non existent thing look like exactly?

What's the evidence that disproves the existence of invisible unicorns?

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Well I am an atheist and disbelieve in deities, but since the concept is often premised as an unfalsifiable one, I don't claim no deity exists.

What does evidence for a non existent thing look like exactly?

What's the evidence that disproves the existence of invisible unicorns?

What are the everyday limits of evidence: https://undsci.berkeley.edu/article/0_0_0/whatisscience_12

I tried to believe in science for all of the everyday life. I found that I didn't have to. And yes, I am an atheist.

 

[Sheldon]

Personal experience is just that. Personal.

Many claim personal.experience turned them to a god. I wonder what personal experience turns people away from a god.

Well I can't speak for others of course, but firstly I never turned away from anything, I disbelieve in any deity or deities as no one can demsonrate any objective evidence for any deity, thus I withhold belief. Though if the premise is unfalsifiable I also remain agnostic, as I must about all unfalsifiable claims.

That said it is clear humans have a propensity for creating and worshipping imaginary deities, throughout human history. I just see no objective difference between Jesus, Allah or Yahweh, and Zeus Thor or Apollo etc etc..

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Well I can't speak for others of course, but firstly I never turned away from anything, I disbelieve in any deity or deities as no one can demsonrate any objective evidence for any deity, thus I withhold belief. Though if the premise is unfalsifiable I also remain agnostic, as I must about all unfalsifiable claims.

That said it is clear humans have a propensity for creating and worshipping imaginary deities, throughout human history. I just see no objective difference between Jesus, Allah or Yahweh, and Zeus Thor or Apollo etc etc..

The "Devil" is in what all unfalsifiable claims are.
Here is a variant of one way to do it:
For objective as expressing or dealing with facts or conditions as perceived without distortion by personal feelings, prejudices, or interpretations, I have found that I can't be objective for the everyday life.

So here it is for religion:
Religion is subjective, therefore I don't believe in it. The "I don't believe in it" is also subjective.

 

[Sheldon]

What are the everyday limits of evidence: https://undsci.berkeley.edu/article/0_0_0/whatisscience_12

I tried to believe in science for all of the everyday life. I found that I didn't have to. And yes, I am an atheist.

Ok, but I didn't mention science, at all?

The thread author asked "show me evidence a god doesn't exist", so I asked what evidence for a non existent thing looks like? It seems a fair question, since I'm not sure non existence leaves evidence, quite the opposite.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Ok, but I didn't mention science, at all?

The thread author asked "show me evidence a god doesn't exist", so I asked what evidence for a non existent thing looks like? It seems a fair question, since I'm not sure non existence leaves evidence, quite the opposite.

Okay, unpack unfalsifiable and evidence.

 

[Sheldon]

The "Devil" is in what all unfalsifiable claims are.

Unfalsifiable claims are assertions that there is no way to falsify, even if they are false. I see need to muddy the waters with fictional demons.

Religion is subjective, therefore I don't believe in it. The "I don't believe in it" is also subjective.

Well that's your subjective position maybe, but I can't say that all religion is subjective, as that's the nature of unfalsifiable claims, like assertions for personal experience. All I can do is ask if any objective evidence can be demonstrated for a claim assertion or belief, if it can't then I withhold belief. I set the same standard for all claims, without bias.

Also you seem to be equating a lack of belief with the belief, while the the latter carries an epistemological burden of proof and the former logically does not.

 

[Sheldon]

Okay, unpack unfalsifiable and evidence.

I don't understand sorry.

Again I was asked to demsonrate evidence for the non existence of something, and again I'm not sure non existent things leave evidence, quite the opposite. Thus the question seems logically unsound to me, bordering on an argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Unfalsifiable claims are assertions that there is no way to falsify, even if they are false. I see need to muddy the waters with fictional demons.



Well that's your subjective position maybe, but I can't say that all religion is subjective, as that's the nature of unfalsifiable claims, like assertions for personal experience. All I can do is ask if any objective evidence can be demonstrated for a claim assertion or belief, if it can't then I withhold belief. I set the same standard for all claims, without bias.

Also you seem to be equating a lack of belief with the belief, while the the latter carries an epistemological burden of proof and the former logically does not.

Please unpack my bold further and if need be differentiate for opinion and unpack that.
For the rest of your post, I will if relevant get back to that.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

I don't understand sorry.

Again I was asked to demsonrate evidence for the non existence of something, and again I'm not sure non existent things leave evidence, quite the opposite. Thus the question seems logically unsound to me, bordering on an argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy.

No, those are words, that end in behavior, Explain the behavior behind the words.

 

[Sheldon]

Please unpack my bold further and if need be differentiate for opinion and unpack that.

You've lost me sorry, could you be a little less cryptic?

I gave a definition of unfalsifiable, you emboldened part of it and asked me to "unpack it" which I assume means examine it further? You need to be a lot more specific.

Also you seem to be moving away from the point I made, which was a response to the OP assertion:

show me evidence a god doesn't exist

If you're subtly trying to say this is asking for evidence of an unfalsifiable concept, which amounts to asking someone to disprove a claim (theism) and thus is irrational, then you need to direct that at the thread author, as I already know this.

If it's something else then as I say, you'll need to be more specific.

 

[Sheldon]

No, those are words, that end in behavior, Explain the behavior behind the words.

No? I wasn't asked a question, and I didn't give an answer? I f that's what you're saying I'd disagree, but at the minute I'm not sure what your point is, sorry?

Too cryptic, sorry. Seriously just tell me what you're trying to say, and stop trying to lead me there.

 

[Sheldon]

God clearly exists as an idea,

As do unicorns and mermaids, so that doesn't tell us much.

And that ideal clearly has a very real and physical presence in the world through the actions of those who embody it.

All you've told us there is the belief is real.

does God exist as a physical phenomenon apart from the mind of humans? That depends on how we are defining God,

Well anyone who believes something exists should be able to define it accurately, if they can't that is seldom a good sign.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

You've lost me sorry, could you be a little less cryptic?

I gave a definition of unfalsifiable, you emboldened part of it and asked me to "unpack it" which I assume means examine it further? You need to be a lot more specific.

Also you seem to be moving away from the point I made, which was a response to the OP assertion:
...

I have a different opinion on claims, assertions and beliefs, because I use a different norm than you. Your norm for evaluating human behavior for those words are different than mine in some cases. Thus we hold different opinions on norms.

As no, I can give no falsifiable evidence for which norm is correct, because both are subjective.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

As do unicorns and mermaids, so that doesn't tell us much.



All you've told us there is the belief is real.



Well anyone who believes something exists should be able to define it accurately, if they can't that is seldom a good sign.

Good sign is your opinion based on your subjective norm. I do the same with a different norm. I just admit it is an opinion and a subjective norm.