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Do You Support Lowering The Federal Election Age to 16?

Discussion in 'North American Politics' started by esmith, Mar 15, 2019.

?
  1. Yes

    14.6%
  2. No

    78.0%
  3. Undecided

    7.3%
  1. Hubert Farnsworth

    Hubert Farnsworth Well-Known Member

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    True. I guess you could think of it that way.
     
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  2. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    I think they should raise it to perhaps 30, or you must be a military Veteran. Let the stone throwing begin. :)
     
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  3. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Physiologically the Brain is not mature until around 30.
     
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  4. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Libertarian Capitalist Atheist Bokononist
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    Another fan of Starship Troopers?
    <stone thrown>
     
  5. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Libertarian Capitalist Atheist Bokononist
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    That would explain AOC's antics.
    Let's hope Oct 13th brings maturity next year.
     
    #45 Revoltingest, Mar 15, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2019
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  6. Kangaroo Feathers

    Kangaroo Feathers Hardline moderate

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    Typical bleeding heart SJW.
     
  7. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Kids shouldn't be able to vote (I also think they should be exempt from paying income taxes until they are old enough to vote due to their lack of representation). Their brains aren't fully matured, they lack in life and world experience, and they should be focused on life at that age rather than trying to figure out a system that most adults can't make heads or tails from (I also think we shouldn't consider someone an adult until 25, when the brain is fully matured and there is some experience in life gained - lets give our kids a chance to have some time to figure things out instead of rushing them through childhood and into adulthood in an assemblyline manner and expecting them to know what they want from life before they have even had a chance to live life).
    Even with driving many states are uping the age and becoming more strict with minors and those who are still technically teenagers, because this demograph alone is a rather high risk group when it comes to driving.
     
  8. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Science and medicine do not support that, as clearly age is not just a number. It's no inherent guarantee of things, but at 16 someone is not yet fully mature. At 50 their body has had some decades for aging to accumulate. During one's 30s we can reasonably expect to see some physiological changes. At 1 we can hardly grasp the concept of object permanence. Over 50 and ones chances of developing a terminal illness begins to increase (and why those who reach a certain age get to look forward to new physical exams and screens and tests, because their bodies are getting to an age when things break down and certain illnesses become more common).
    If age were just a number, age would be totally irrelevant in most areas of life. But because it is so much more than just a number both physical and mental health acknowledge different things going on at different ages/points in ones life, and the evaluations and treatment plans also tend to acknowledge age.
     
  9. Stevicus

    Stevicus Well-Known Member
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    I see what you're saying, and you're right, for the most part. But people mature and age at different rates. Not everyone is the same or can be lumped into the same category. Someone who is 40 might still look like they're under 30, and another person who is 40 might look like they're over 50. The range of differences can be quite stark when comparing people of the same age. The "number" may still be the same, but their biology and physical fitness may be quite different nevertheless, due to other contributing factors apart from age (such as genetics, lifestyle, etc.).

    But the OP's question was about voting, which (ideally) requires intelligence, knowledge of the issues, and at least a basic understanding of the US political system. Of course, there are plenty of adults who are grossly deficient in these areas, but I honestly see no reason why a 16-year-old should be deemed incapable of learning about these things just because of their age.
     
  10. Stevicus

    Stevicus Well-Known Member
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    We're just talking about voting here, not going off to war or getting married, although 16-year-olds can do those things - as long as they have signed permission from their parents. They would also need parental permission to get a driver's license at 16.

    So, maybe they could do the same with voting.
     
  11. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    Yes, because they have not attained control of their civic rights. Incidentally, were they emancipated at 16, they would not be considered a minor. Better to get into the habit early.especially when the school or parents could walk them through the process of registering to vote, researching candidates, where to vote, various lobby organizations, etc.
     
  12. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Children shouldn't be able to do those things. Literally, due to their underdeveloped frontal cortex, thinking in long-term and comprehending consequences before they happen does not come easily. That is why teenagers are a high risk group for auto accidents, and have the statistics to support the claim. It's why teenagers are known for doing dumb high-risk stunts. Of course many adults are just as bad, if not worse. But they have a fully matured brain and don't have the excuse of childhood and immaturity to explain their behaviors. But kids do. We don't need to belittle or degrade them, rather guiding them as a sort of "apprenticeship in life" is what is needed. Let them figure them selves out first before we demand they figure out careers and political allegiances.
     
  13. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    It is not necessary to have figured out one's "political allegiances" in order to vote.
     
  14. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Installing good habits early is of course a good thing (and there is strong evidence to suggest it translates to life-long habits), but do you really want children, who also lack full maturity, making such important decisions? And high school students are often required to pass a US government class to graduate high school - ideally this would include the things you mentioned (I was fortunate enough to have a teacher who did include those).
    And, ultimately, legal definitions do not bypass physiological fact. If they can vote at 16, why not 14? Both are, after all, of the same age group and close together in terms of physical and mental development, and both are high school aged children.
     
  15. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    16 year olds are hideously immature. 18 is better and 21 is best.
     
  16. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    No, but it does help so you know not just who you are voting for but what you are voting for (which is far more important than who). Better to prepare them for an active civic life rather than just adding one more thing we throw kids to the sharks over.
     
  17. Stevicus

    Stevicus Well-Known Member
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    Not being a doctor, I can't really speak to your point about their underdeveloped frontal cortex. I realize that teens are young, but I also know they're not toddlers either.

    As far as how mature or responsible they might be, that may be more a matter of upbringing/environment than biology. Even if they're not fully mature, they're perfectly capable of learning the basics of US government and the political system at that age.

    Voting is not exactly a high-risk stunt, but even assuming that's true for a moment, what's the worst thing that could happen? Seriously. I suppose a bunch of immature teens could get together and say "Hey, let's all write in Mickey Mouse for President heehee!" I suppose something like that could happen. But if they're really that immature, then a lot of them probably wouldn't even care or bother to vote at all.

    I don't think it would make much of a difference in terms of election results.
     
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  18. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    It's something many undergrad lifespan development, psychology, and medical text books will cover. You don't need to be a doctor, but only dabble in the field up to the 200-level courses to have gone over the subject at least a couple times.

    Acting mature has nothing to do with physical/mental maturation. We tell young children they act mature as a means of support and encouraging good behaviors. But that doesn't mean they are mature. The same goes for teenagers and emerging adults. Physically they are fully mature (or close to it), but they are not fully matured mentally. That doesn't happen, on average, until about the mid 20s.
    And there is definitely very strong evidence to show the overall mental immaturity of this group, as evidenced by having more auto wrecks than most other groups, having a tendency to perform high-risk thrill seeking stunts, and not easily understanding consequences of an action before they happen.
     
  19. Salvador

    Salvador Conscious Being

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    When 16 year old persons start paying a significant amount of taxes, then they should be given the right to vote; of course, that will never happen.
     
  20. Stevicus

    Stevicus Well-Known Member
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    I got into a few auto wrecks when I was younger, so I understand your point here. Although looking back, it wasn't the result of any desire for high-risk thrill seeking behavior, but more a lack of experience on the road. Driving is a skill that takes time and practice, just like any other skill. Driver education is also essential, which is why insurance companies will give better rates if you provide transcripts indicating that you've taken driver's ed.

    Teens that can demonstrate some level of responsibility are considered a lesser risk. Not all of them are daredevils off to do hare-brained stunts. But I also realize a lot of teens can fall in with the wrong crowd - possibly get into drugs and alcohol.
     
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